Rituals, lots of them !

[Stogoe]

Quick-casting rituals seems to be a phenomenally bad idea. Like, one of the worst D&D ideas I can imagine. Almost on the level of refusing to roll any dice. But I guess if that's your thing, feel free to make rituals have instantaneous casting.

Please, WotC, don't.

 

[That One Guy]

Quick-casting rituals seems to be a phenomenally bad idea. Like, one of the worst D&D ideas I can imagine. Almost on the level of refusing to roll any dice. But I guess if that's your thing, feel free to make rituals have instantaneous casting.

Please, WotC, don't.

Quick-casting without limit is a phenomenally bad idea in most situations. With a high magic setting that is different than the 4e PoL setting it actually makes sense. Not having quick-cast rituals actually seems a little bad for that sort of setting. As far as PoL goes, quick-casting w/out a downside/limitation is a bad idea. But, in case I was not clear... I am thinking of experimenting with some house rules in regards to quick-casting with limits. If that is phenomenally bad to you, then why not use explanation rather than hyperbole?

 

[doctorhook]

Quick-casting without limit is a phenomenally bad idea in most situations. With a high magic setting that is different than the 4e PoL setting it actually makes sense. Not having quick-cast rituals actually seems a little bad for that sort of setting. As far as PoL goes, quick-casting w/out a downside/limitation is a bad idea. But, in case I was not clear... I am thinking of experimenting with some house rules in regards to quick-casting with limits. If that is phenomenally bad to you, then why not use explanation rather than hyperbole?

"Quick casting" (relatively speaking) isn't necessarily a terrible idea. What would be a terrible idea is allowing any rituals to be cast in less than one minute's time. 10 rounds of casting to complete a ritual is a long time in combat, but not long enough that ritual casting in combat would be a guaranteed waste in 99% of fights. The trade-off between not contributing to battle for 10 rounds versus casting a miscellanous effect with potentially far-reaching combat implications seems fair.

(Yes, some rituals will be "more fair" than others, in this case. DM's discretion, perhaps? This warrants further thought.)

At any rate, I don't think rituals, as we know them, should take less than 10 rounds.

 

[That One Guy]

At any rate, I don't think rituals, as we know them, should take less than 10 rounds.

Y'know, I think that is a fair assessment. With combat taking more rounds in 4e, a minute casting time would still be potentially worthwhile. I think I'll use that as the minimum of quick-casting... or rather, the most quickly a spell could be cast by a... truly amazing ritual caster.

 

[doctorhook]

Y'know, I think that is a fair assessment. With combat taking more rounds in 4e, a minute casting time would still be potentially worthwhile. I think I'll use that as the minimum of quick-casting... or rather, the most quickly a spell could be cast by a... truly amazing ritual caster.

Yes, agreed. I've suggested a feat before, something to the effect of, "You can cast a ritual in 1/10th its normal casting time, to a minimum of 1 minute." I think it would be most appropriate as an Epic-tier feat; by that level, the game expects you to be able to do some crazy stuff.

 

[grickherder]

Yes, agreed. I've suggested a feat before, something to the effect of, "You can cast a ritual in 1/10th its normal casting time, to a minimum of 1 minute." I think it would be most appropriate as an Epic-tier feat; by that level, the game expects you to be able to do some crazy stuff.

I really like this idea. Though I'd give it to the players far, far earlier. I'm thinking something like this:

Ritual Efficiency
Prerequisites: Ritual Caster, Int 15 or Wis 15
Benefit: The time taken to cast a ritual is reduced by 1 minute per level of your character to a minimum of 1 minute.

 

[Andor]

I am a bit confused by this ritual.

[sblock=Earthen Ramparts]Level: 6 Component Cost: 80 gp
Category: Exploration Market Price: 360 gp
Time: 10 minutes Key Skill: Arcana or Nature
Duration: Instantaneous
You channel the earth around you into defensive mounds. Within 10 squares of you, earth rises to create a wall 2 squares high. On one side of the wall (your choice), the earthen mound is sloped so creatures can climb atop the wall. Climbing atop the mound from that side costs an extra square of movement. [/sblock]

Now reading that I was under the impression that you created a 10' high wall around the perimeter of a 10 sq burst, making a nice defensive rampart suitable for a large encampment.

However the article goes on to say "For every 10 points you have on an Arcana or Nature check result, you can create another wall 2 within 10 squares."

Which makes me think I had it wrong.

Is this ritual intended to produce 1 + 1(result/10) squares of 10' high wall wherever you want within 10 squares of the caster? And if so, why didn't they say so in exactly that way?

 

[Keenath]

Now reading that I was under the impression that you created a 10' high wall around the perimeter of a 10 sq burst, making a nice defensive rampart suitable for a large encampment.

However the article goes on to say "For every 10 points you have on an Arcana or Nature check result, you can create another wall 2 within 10 squares."

Which makes me think I had it wrong.

Is this ritual intended to produce 1 + 1(result/10) squares of 10' high wall wherever you want within 10 squares of the caster? And if so, why didn't they say so in exactly that way?

It's badly edited. I think they meant you produce a "wall 2" that is 2 squares high -- in other words, a two-square wall 10' in height -- and somebody edited out the second 2 thinking it was a mistake.

It sounds like they intend that you create 1+floor(check/10) wall-2 sections (using the PHB's rules for how walls can be positioned), and each section is 10' high.

 

[Plane Sailing]

There may as well be. With the reduction in the amount of spells they have now (let's face it the entire "wizards suck now, so we'll make the better and more useful in 4e" crap WotC kept shoveling has been proven to be nothing more than crap!). A first level wiz/sor in 3.x has MORE spells and such than the 4e WIZ/SOR has powers for several levels.

The only difference is now you can select something like Magic Missile as an "at will" "power" and literally blast away at something with it every few seconds all day long until the end of time and NEVER get tired or worn out or run out of arcane ability or what-not... Basically they made wiz/sor's better and more useful by gutting the class of all the truly useful "utility" spells (who the heck wants something like "Knock" as one of their very few "powers" or to have to wait 10 minutes for the wizards ONE "ritual" he can cast that day!?) and making them able to be ultra-cheesy and cast one or two "powers" endlessly...

No real use as an adventuring party member now that they've got no "utility" capability... What's the point of having them along to do anything but prance around in fishnets, heels, and a smocked frilly maid's dress!?

It is difficult to see this as anything other than threadcrapping.

If you have a point to make, please make it without attempting to ridicule an edition (especially if it is something you haven't fully understood).