Steel_Wind
Legend
Joshua Dyal said:
This time, you and I care in complete and total agreement. You are so reading my mind, I need an aluminum hat.
Robert Jordan’s eleventh book - KNIFE OF DREAMS
- Thread starter Hand of Evil
- Start date
This time, you and I care in complete and total agreement. You are so reading my mind, I need an aluminum hat.
Aris Dragonborn
First Post
I've put enough time and effort into The Wheel of Time that I feel I owe it to myself to finish out the series.
Psychic Warrior
First Post
Who is Robert Jordan? Is he a writer of some kind?
Dragonblade
Adventurer
I'm excited that he is finally finishing the series. I'm a huge Robert Jordan fan. I stopped reading after book 9 but thats only because I got tired of rereading everything every time a new book came out. I'll eagerly buy the last two and then sit down and read the whole thing from start to finish. I have every single book on hardcover except the prequel series.
I have no interest in the prequel series. But that's more of a general thing against prequels than Jordan in particular. Anyway, I'm not such a devoted fan boy that I think the man can do no wrong. His story clearly got away from him in book 5. He reined it in in book 6, and then it got away from him again until book 9. I haven't read book 10 yet.
Some of Jordan's reading can be dry, but man, when he is on his game, he is awesome. I consider the Battle of Dumai's Wells at the end of book 6 one of the coolest climactic fantasy scenes I have read ever. And I have read a LOT of fantasy.
I have no interest in the prequel series. But that's more of a general thing against prequels than Jordan in particular. Anyway, I'm not such a devoted fan boy that I think the man can do no wrong. His story clearly got away from him in book 5. He reined it in in book 6, and then it got away from him again until book 9. I haven't read book 10 yet.
Some of Jordan's reading can be dry, but man, when he is on his game, he is awesome. I consider the Battle of Dumai's Wells at the end of book 6 one of the coolest climactic fantasy scenes I have read ever. And I have read a LOT of fantasy.
William Ronald
Explorer
I suppose I can justify trying to catch up on the series.
I last read book nine, but I did not pick up any of the more recent entries in the series. I think that Jordan could have told his tale a bit more briefly, and with greater dramatic effect.
Also, I found myself having a hard time to care much about many of the characters. I do not expect perfect heroes. Indeed, I prefer to have heroic characters to have their own flaws and doubts and to be fully realized characters.. However, I found that I cared more about Loial -- a minor character -- than many of the main characters. It is one thing to have doubts. It is quite another to spend pages whining, mistreating one's allies, rehashing old debates, and my wondering if the heroes will begin to act decisively. (I wonder if some of Jordan's critics are calling the series The Wheel of Whine?) Also, I have sometimes asked the same question about Rand that I asked myself about Elric -- if his power was any less, would he have the internal resources -- courage, insight -- to sucessfully deal with the challenges of his life.
I think that a certain amount of self doubt can be important, particularly if it causes a character to change. This can be seen in the First Chronicles of Thomas Covenant, where th e protagonist decides that it truly does not matter whether the Land is real or not, but that he has to take responsibility for his actions. (All this is proceeded by an incident where Covenant initially refuses the summons to the Land to save a girl bitten by a rattlesnake in our world. Only after saving her, does Covenant accept the summons to the Land. By the end of the series, Thomas Covenant is no longer the self-centered jerk from Lord Foul's Bane. There is a sense of sorrow, redemption, and triumph at the end of the series -- both for a troubled protagonist and the Land.) Sadly, all I have seen so far of Rand is someone who fights because he must, and does not seem to truly appreciate the people around him. While Rand is capable of risking himself and sacrifice, there seems to be something lacking to me. Perhaps it is his reluctance to turn to others for advice and support.
In the great wars of our own world, even the most competent leaders sought the wisdom and help of their allies. In World War II, Roosevelt and Churchill consulted with each other and their advisors. Similarly, generals like Eisenhower relied on many people. There have been times when I have felt that Rand was almost waging his personal war against the Dark One -- and forgetting that others are also fighting the same battle, and wish for the respect and support that he demands for himself. Despite the exciting action, such as the battle at Dumar's Wells, I feel somewhat disappointed in both the length of the series, the development of the characters, and how many of the heroes treat each other. Perhaps Robert Jordan will bring the series to a fitting conclusion. I hope so. However, I think he has shown the need of an author for a good editor and conciseness. I want to like the series, as there is much to love about the world of the Wheel of Time. I will give Jordan a chance, as he has had moments of greatness in his series. I just wished that Jordan was more consistent. It is one thing to have characters know regret. It is quite another to have that regret be the main thing that comes to mind about those characters.
I last read book nine, but I did not pick up any of the more recent entries in the series. I think that Jordan could have told his tale a bit more briefly, and with greater dramatic effect.
Also, I found myself having a hard time to care much about many of the characters. I do not expect perfect heroes. Indeed, I prefer to have heroic characters to have their own flaws and doubts and to be fully realized characters.. However, I found that I cared more about Loial -- a minor character -- than many of the main characters. It is one thing to have doubts. It is quite another to spend pages whining, mistreating one's allies, rehashing old debates, and my wondering if the heroes will begin to act decisively. (I wonder if some of Jordan's critics are calling the series The Wheel of Whine?) Also, I have sometimes asked the same question about Rand that I asked myself about Elric -- if his power was any less, would he have the internal resources -- courage, insight -- to sucessfully deal with the challenges of his life.
Joshua Dyal said:
I think that a certain amount of self doubt can be important, particularly if it causes a character to change. This can be seen in the First Chronicles of Thomas Covenant, where th e protagonist decides that it truly does not matter whether the Land is real or not, but that he has to take responsibility for his actions. (All this is proceeded by an incident where Covenant initially refuses the summons to the Land to save a girl bitten by a rattlesnake in our world. Only after saving her, does Covenant accept the summons to the Land. By the end of the series, Thomas Covenant is no longer the self-centered jerk from Lord Foul's Bane. There is a sense of sorrow, redemption, and triumph at the end of the series -- both for a troubled protagonist and the Land.) Sadly, all I have seen so far of Rand is someone who fights because he must, and does not seem to truly appreciate the people around him. While Rand is capable of risking himself and sacrifice, there seems to be something lacking to me. Perhaps it is his reluctance to turn to others for advice and support.
In the great wars of our own world, even the most competent leaders sought the wisdom and help of their allies. In World War II, Roosevelt and Churchill consulted with each other and their advisors. Similarly, generals like Eisenhower relied on many people. There have been times when I have felt that Rand was almost waging his personal war against the Dark One -- and forgetting that others are also fighting the same battle, and wish for the respect and support that he demands for himself. Despite the exciting action, such as the battle at Dumar's Wells, I feel somewhat disappointed in both the length of the series, the development of the characters, and how many of the heroes treat each other. Perhaps Robert Jordan will bring the series to a fitting conclusion. I hope so. However, I think he has shown the need of an author for a good editor and conciseness. I want to like the series, as there is much to love about the world of the Wheel of Time. I will give Jordan a chance, as he has had moments of greatness in his series. I just wished that Jordan was more consistent. It is one thing to have characters know regret. It is quite another to have that regret be the main thing that comes to mind about those characters.
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Orius
Unrepentant DM Supremacist
I'm looking forward to it. I haven't become completely disgusted with Jordan as some people have, although Book 10 was a letdown. At least he writes faster than that Martin guy. ![:]](http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/devious.png "Devious :]")
This statement gives me some hope that this book may be better:
So it would seem the bad editing blamed for some of the previous volumes is at least partially the fault of Tor; I suspect they cranked them out as fast as possible to cash in on them. Maybe Jordan read the last book and even he realized it was disappointing.
In any case, if the latest volume actually goes through some editing, then I have some hopes it will be stronger than Crossroads of Twilight was.
This statement gives me some hope that this book may be better:
So it would seem the bad editing blamed for some of the previous volumes is at least partially the fault of Tor; I suspect they cranked them out as fast as possible to cash in on them. Maybe Jordan read the last book and even he realized it was disappointing.
In any case, if the latest volume actually goes through some editing, then I have some hopes it will be stronger than Crossroads of Twilight was.
Jeremy
Explorer
w00t! New Jordan book!
And coolness... That http://www.dragonmount.com/Books/Knife_of_Dreams/ link has a PDF in it to recap me before book 11. So I don't have to read the series again like I did before 10 to be ready.
Not that I didn't enjoy it, just that I don't have time this time around.
And coolness... That http://www.dragonmount.com/Books/Knife_of_Dreams/ link has a PDF in it to recap me before book 11. So I don't have to read the series again like I did before 10 to be ready.
Not that I didn't enjoy it, just that I don't have time this time around.
LightPhoenix
First Post
With the exception of the last part of book... 9, 10, when
, RJ has stunk since book 7. I bet the part in spoilers is the part that said webpage refers to, btw.
Rand and Nynaeve cleansed the taint, possibly
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