RPGNow Expanding...

[Starglim]

Two words - Reduced exposure.

Actually, considering

What products do you look for most in PDF/Download format?
Out of Print Books 17%
Indie RPGs 15%
Small Press D20 26%
eProduct from established publishers 12%
General source material 15%

if these numbers bear any relation to actual purchases, rather than just being the distribution of opinion of people who like to answer polls, the top 100 may be rueing their status two months from now.

edit: Not that that would be a better result. A decline of the main site would be far worse for the industry.

 

[DaveMage]

Just for the record, as an occasional purchaser of .pdfs (and one, like many, who buys mostly print), whenever I have bought .pdfs, I have always used a direct link from a post on these message boards, or a set of Phil Reed's coupons.

So, basically, to me, it doesn't matter the website location, whether it's RPGNow, RPG Edge, or Bob's .pdfs.

You want to generate attention? Give me links in your sig, or better yet, give me a link to coupons in your sig. If your product looks interesting from the link - I may buy it.

 

[malladin]

eyebeams Quote:
Originally Posted by Roudi
The best place to break into the RPG industry has now become much more of a gauntlet.

Good.

Not Good. While OGL has always been about money, it has given people a chance to explore new ideas and share them with the gaming public at large. Many of todays big companies wouldn't be where they are without the opportunities the OGL and exposure from RPGNow gave them. Small companies have produced, and still do, some of the best material out there and an implied difference in quality best on your standing and name is wrong. So what if everything small publishers and hobbists produce isn't great. I see plenty of threads complaining about WOTC material, and you don't get a bigger more established player in this game. People are getting the chance to do something they may have wanted to all their lives, who's to say they can't, thats certainly not the spirit even if the reality, of the OGL. I don't think what RPGNow is doing is right, but I understand the business sense and respect the decision. To think stopping people trying their hand at writing and creating for the hobby they love and think its a good thing-that I can't agree with.

Nigel

 

[Roudi]

Well put, malladin.

From my point of view, I see a lot of the kind of people you describe - people with talent, who really want to break into the industry, but can't make the kind of financial commitment to it that some of the bigger names have.

Oh well. I'm not deriding the change in RPGNow, I'm just giving my opinion as to what effects this change is going to have. To be honest, despite this added difficulty, myself and others won't be stopped from breaking into the industry. If our drive was so weak as to be discouraged by this segregation, then it would have been an insubstantial drive to begin with.

See you on the Edge, folks.

 

[Vigilance]

People are getting the chance to do something they may have wanted to all their lives, who's to say they can't, thats certainly not the spirit even if the reality, of the OGL. I don't think what RPGNow is doing is right, but I understand the business sense and respect the decision. To think stopping people trying their hand at writing and creating for the hobby they love and think its a good thing-that I can't agree with.

Nigel

Except no one is stopping them. There is still a website for those with absolutely no credentials or experience to learn from.

 

[BryonD]

Well put, malladin.

Actually, it's pretty absurd.

RPGnow paved the way for gaming pdf publishing. For that the thanks they get is some presumption that they owe people a leg up? BS.

It isn't even a tiny little bit anyone else's responsibility or obligation to compensate for anyone else's financial capability. Not RPGnow's and not anyone else.

 

[malladin]

Quote: Except no one is stopping them. There is still a website for those with absolutely no credentials or experience to learn from.

But people are saying its a good thing for people to find it more difficult to publish, whether an accurate perception of whats happening at RPGNow or not and the differences of opinion on this thread are a testament to the mix of views on that. What i'm saying I don't think the concept of stifling peoples creativity and freedom of expression is one people should be pleased about, which has plainly been the case on some posts, nor is it one that is good for the industry in the long run. The hobby needs new writers and designers as much as new players to stay alive.

Quote:RPGnow paved the way for gaming pdf publishing. For that the thanks they get is some presumption that they owe people a leg up? BS.

It isn't even a tiny little bit anyone else's responsibility or obligation to compensate for anyone else's financial capability. Not RPGnow's and not anyone else.

If they owe nobody anything why should we owe them any thanks? Just a thought! However, i'm not arguing over business sense or making presumptions, I've said I respect the decision thats been made, but as an industry we need some ways to promote new talent and you hope to see that from industry leaders. I'm not talking about obligation but opportunity. There are arguments for both sides of the case over whats happening at RPGnow and frankly I feel the arguments here are just going to go round in circles. Only time will tell whether the changes are for the better or worse and being unable to see into the future I'll wait and see what happens.

And as a final comment for all those hardline capatalist free marketeers out there, here's one of my favourite pieces of wisdom "Be careful who you stand upon on the way up, you'll be seeing them again on the way back down."

I'm off to get my red berret and go to a cuban solidarity rally
Nigel

 

[eyebeams]

eyebeams Quote:
Originally Posted by Roudi
The best place to break into the RPG industry has now become much more of a gauntlet.

Good.

Not Good. While OGL has always been about money, it has given people a chance to explore new ideas and share them with the gaming public at large. Many of todays big companies wouldn't be where they are without the opportunities the OGL and exposure from RPGNow gave them. Small companies have produced, and still do, some of the best material out there and an implied difference in quality best on your standing and name is wrong. So what if everything small publishers and hobbists produce isn't great. I see plenty of threads complaining about WOTC material, and you don't get a bigger more established player in this game. People are getting the chance to do something they may have wanted to all their lives, who's to say they can't, thats certainly not the spirit even if the reality, of the OGL. I don't think what RPGNow is doing is right, but I understand the business sense and respect the decision. To think stopping people trying their hand at writing and creating for the hobby they love and think its a good thing-that I can't agree with.

Nigel

If it's about sharing your ideas, you can always put up a webpage or .pdf download for free and promote it here and elsewhere. There's no reason whatsoever that anyone else should be responsible for your need to create.

Nobody's stopping you from trying your hand at a thing. Nobody's coming and telling you you can't write or even sell anything. Why, then, do you feel you have a right to use RPGNow as a storefront for your work? You don't. The company is being extremely indulgent by splitting the site when they could well just kick off every company that's produced less than three coppers.

As for companies "banking on their name." They made a name for themselves. They put the work in to making a success of themselves. If you didn't, you just don't desrrve the same consideration.

As for the spirit of the OGL: It has none. It's a legal document. If, on the other hand, you're talking about the spirit of an open source community, redundant companies are a detriment to it, not for it. The point of open source is to allow the accumulation of a set of freely available solutions. This is not helped by the plethora of redundant solutions produced by small companies.

In fact, the root of open source is noncommercial production. The commercial end of open source is in useful dustributions of bundled applications. If you have smething to add to OGL material, nothing is crying out for you to charge for it. If you think you have a useful distro of collected concepts or implementations (an edventure or a deck plan is an example of this) to add . . . well, that's a different thing altogether. But few companies among he throng have proven that they have anything worthwhile to add as distribution or implementation.

Therefore, RPGNow can be a way for bad producers to disguise their inferior product -- inferiority which would be obvious if they presented noncommercial versions of the same concepts.

 

[Roudi]

RPGnow paved the way for gaming pdf publishing. For that the thanks they get is some presumption that they owe people a leg up? BS.

Incorrect assumption. I never once claimed RPGNow owed anyone an easy in to the industry. I was simply lamenting how much more difficult the process is going to be for folks such as myself.

Oh well. I'm not deriding the change in RPGNow, I'm just giving my opinion as to what effects this change is going to have. To be honest, despite this added difficulty, myself and others won't be stopped from breaking into the industry. If our drive was so weak as to be discouraged by this segregation, then it would have been an insubstantial drive to begin with.

See you on the Edge, folks.

 

[malladin]

Quote: As for companies "banking on their name." They made a name for themselves. They put the work in to making a success of themselves. If you didn't, you just don't desrrve the same consideration.

There is no call to make a personal remark. My comments are based on my own feelings towards gaming, not any perceived business success or failure on my part or that of any other gaming company. I don't resent any company their success and my expectations of achievement are my own to judge, not yours. Have you even bothered to find anything out about my compamy, its reputation, its projects before commenting that I resent other peoples success because I've haven't worked to succeed, its a fairly insulting comment! Where do I mention companies banking on their name. I say RPGNow allowed them to grow big, which it did. How does this imply I think I'm entitled to consideration. It implies I'd like to such opportunities occur for other companies and hope the industry will encourage this. Frankly, I write for pleasure and the money keeps me in CCGs. If that doesn't meet your standard of business commitment, well I'm not heartbroken and my cyberpunk cops deck is looking pretty good . Besides I know how good my material is and don't need you, commercial success or perceived industry status to tell me, god that sounds really arrogant , its thats mechanics maestros review arrgh that deafeats my own argument

Quote: The company is being extremely indulgent by splitting the site when they could well just kick off every company that's produced less than three coppers.

If they throw every less than three bronzes off, well hunky dorey, what am I supposed to do grovel to stay. Perhaps my comment on respecting their decision was unclear? THEY ARE A BUSINESS AND CAN DO WHAT THEY FEEL IS RIGHT FOR THEIR FUTURE SUCCESS. I can respect that right without having to agree with the decision or and state my ideas without having to make my arguments personal towards RPGNow, other companies or individuals.

As for your other comments, well see my last post, I've only got time for this one because I can't find my Fidel Castro flag

Solidarity small, uncommitted, second rate publishers of the world you have nothing loose but your lack of professionalism