"Rules: Saiyans" by Anubis

Anubis

First Post
Okay, I've been working on a conversion for Saiyans, and I am posting my work here. I have put A LOT of my personal time into this, and hope you all find my work to be useful and enjoyable. Included herein are the rules for everythign related to Saiyans. I would like to note that Saiyans were originally created by Akira Toriyama, and I'm simply converting them into this great game.

Some of the feats mentioned herein are of my own design, and can be found here:

http://enworld.cyberstreet.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=24624

Saiyans are usable in nearly any campaign, as they are balanced very well for all but the "weakest" of campaigns.

That said, Saiyans are EXTREMELY powerful, but as I said before, they are reasonably balanced. If you play in a low-magic or lower-power campaign, however, be EXTREMELY cautious when considering the use of Saiyans.

Here it is, "Rules: Saiyans"! This post will be updated as necessary with additions, corrections, errata, etc. ENJOY!



SAIYAN

Medium-Size/Colossal Shapechanger
Hit Dice: 10d8+40+50 (135 hp); 10d8+140+50 (270 hp)
Initiative: +4; +2 (Dex)
Speed: 30 ft.; 20 ft.
AC: 17 (+2 bonus, +5 Saiyan battle armor); 31 (-2 Dex, -8 size, +2 bonus, +5 Saiyan battle armor, +24 natural)
Attacks: Unarmed strike +15/+12/+9; 2 slams +27 melee, bite +22 melee
Damage: Unarmed strike 1d10+8; slam 4d8+28, bite 8d6+14
Face/Reach: 5 ft. by 5 ft./5 ft.; 40 ft. by 40 ft./25 ft.
Special Attacks: Oozaru form, monk abilities
Special Qualities: Tail weakness, power adaptation, monk abilities
Saves: Fort +13, Ref +7, Will +7; Fort +23, Ref +5, Will +5
Abilities: Str 27, Dex 11, Con 19, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 8; Str 67, Dex 7, Con 39, Int 6, Wis 6, Cha 4
Skills: Balance +6, Bluff +0, Jump +14, Knowledge (fighting) +9, Tumble +10
Feats: Saiyan's Toughness, Improved Initiative, Great Fortitude

Climate/Terrain: Any land and underground
Organization: Solitary, pair, unit (2-5), company (5-20), or legion (101-200)
Challenge Rating: 10
Treasure: Standard
Alignment: Usually neutral evil
Advancement: By character class

Saiyans are a powerful mercenary shapechanging race composed almost entirely of warriors. They sell their services to the highest bidder, and frequently take over entire planets in order to sell salvaged goods, people captured to be used as slaves, and even the planets themselves to whoever is willing to meet their price. This warlike race is unmatched in power and brutality.

Saiyans are powerfully built, with wild hair and dark eyes. For the most part, however, they look frighteningly human, and are unable to be distinguished from humans by the untrained eye.

What makes the Saiyan race even more frightening, however, is their ability to transform into colossal apes in the light of a full moon. When in their Oozaru form, they destroy everything and kill everyone in their paths, leaving a wake of death and destruction.

COMBAT

Saiyans have a natural gift for fighting, able to fight unarmed just as a monk, and also able to defend himself or herself as a monk could as well. Saiyans live to fight. Saiyans rarely do anything other than fight directly in combat, not caring for the use of tactics when power will usually suffice. A Saiyan is rendered powerless, however, by grabbing its tail.

In Oozaru form, Saiyans merely smash and eat everything in sight, using its devastating breath weapon on those out of reach. These terrible monsters are ten times as powerful as a normal Saiyan, and are nearly impossible to defeat in physical combat. Only by removing the light of the moon or cutting off the Saiyan's tail can the Oozaru be forced back into its normal Saiyan form.

Oozaru Form (Su): In the light of a full moon, Saiyans revert to a primordial state in the form of a colossal ape. In this form, the Saiyan is in a constant state of rage, and will destroy anything and everything around it. A Saiyan must have his or her tail to transform. When the light of the full moon is gone, the Oozaru will change back into its normal Saiyan form. Removing the tail of the Oozaru also causes the Saiyan to change back to his or her normal form. A Saiyan in Oozaru form receives maximum hit points per hit die upon transforming.

Breath Weapon (Su): While in Oozaru form, a Saiyan is sometimes attacked from afar and unable to pummel or eat the attacker. Sometimes a Saiyan in Oozaru form is simply in a really bad mood. In these instances, the Oozaru breath weapon is invaluable. Line of energy, 400 feet; damage 1d10 per HD/level, Reflex half DC 29.

Monk Abilities (Ex): Saiyans attack as monks, using the monk's favorable number of attacks per round, as well as dealing damage as a monk of a level equal to the sum of the Saiyan's hit HD and levels. Saiyans also gain the benefits of the Improved Unarmed Strike Feat, as well as access to the monk's Flurry of Blows and Stunning Attack. In addition to monk attack forms, Saiyans gain a bonus to their AC as monks of a level equal to the sum of the Saiyan's HD and levels, including a Wisdom bonus to AC whenever applicable.

Tail Weakness: By grabbing the tail of a Saiyan, you can stun him or her. This condition lasts as long as the tail is tightly held. This is ineefective against a Saiyan in Oozaru form. If a Saiyan's tail is removed while he or she is in Oozaru form, he or she immediately changes back to his or her normal form. Whenever a Saiyan's tail is removed, he or she must succeed at a Fortitude save (DC 30) or be stunned for a number of rounds equal to the amount the save was missed by, double that number if a natural "1" is rolled. The tail has a 1 in 6 chance of growing back in 1d12 months two weeks before the next full moon. Without his or her tail, a Saiyan's loses 8 Strength and 4 Constitution, and is unable to transform into an Oozaru.

Power Adaptation (Ex): Saiyans are very hard to kill, and only gain more power if they survive an otherwise fatal attack. When a Saiyan is reduced below 0 hit points, once he or she recovers, he or she gains 100 experience points for each point below 0 he or she went, and receives a permanent cumulative +1 bonus to Strength and Constitution; if the added experience points give him or her enough to gain a level, he or she gains that level immediately. For example, if a Saiyan is reduced to -10 hit points and then healed with a Heal spell, the Saiyan immediately gains 1,000 experience points. If the Saiyan had 54,500 experience points before, he now has 55,300 experience points and gains a level. *A Saiyan can only be killed by reducing it to a negative number of hit points equal to it's Constitution score plus its total Effective Character Level. In other words, if a Saiyan has four character levels and a Constitution score of 16, he or she must be reduced to -30 hit points to be killed, not counting the effects of Saiyan's Toughness. A normal Saiyan must be reduced to -49 hit points to be killed, factoring in Saiyan's Toughness

*In the Chaotic Worlds campaign, all characters follow this rule. In the Chaotic Worlds campaign, Saiyans are harder to kill due to the Saiyan's Toughness feat.

SAIYAN SOCIETY

Saiyans are an extremly militant race. Saiyans live for war, fighting, and power. Only the strongest survive, and the strong will rule over the weak. Saiyans are loyal to the most powerful of their kind.

Saiyans are well organized in fighting armies, all with extreme amounts of power. Saiyans' teamwork is second to none, but if one shows weakness, his or her comrades will show no remorse in disposing of the weakling. This race strived to increase their power in the universe, and will routinely take over planets, strip a planet of its natural resources, kill all opposing males, take opposing females as slaves for harems, and sell opposing children into slavery. Most Saiyans are pure evil. although because of their warlike nature, many die before fulfilling their true potential.

Saiyans usually live approximately as long as humans do.

SAIYAN CHARACTERS

A Saiyan's favored classes are fighter and martial artist (a monk variation), and Saiyan leaders tend to be fighter/martial artists and fighter/monks. Saiyan clerics are few and far between and worship "The Legendary Super Saiyan", and can choose two of the following domains: Destruction, Strength, and War. The Effective Character Level of a normal Saiyan is +10.

SAIYAN WARRIOR CLASS

Most Saiyans are Saiyan Warriors. These are their powers.
Hit Die: d8

Requirements
To qualify to become a Saiyan Warrior, a character must fulfill all of the following criteria.
Race: Saiyan or half-Saiyan
Knowledge (fighting): 9 ranks

Class Skills
The Saiyan Warrior's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (fighting) (Int), Sense Motive (Wis), and Tumble (Dex). See Chapter 4: Skills in the Player's Handbook for skill descriptions.

Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Int modifier

Code:
The Saiyan Warrior

Class       Base       Fort    Ref   Will
Level   Attack Bonus   Save   Save   Save   Special
1st          +0         +2     +2     +2    Damage reduction 5/+1
2nd          +1         +3     +3     +3 
3rd          +2         +3     +3     +3    Evasion
4th          +3         +4     +4     +4 
5th          +3         +4     +4     +4 
6th          +4         +5     +5     +5    Fortified Body
7th          +5         +5     +5     +5 
8th          +6         +6     +6     +6 
9th          +6         +6     +6     +6    Fortified Blood
10th         +7         +7     +7     +7    Damage reduction 10/+2
11th         +8         +7     +7     +7 
12th         +9         +8     +8     +8    Wholeness of Body
13th         +9         +8     +8     +8 
14th        +10         +9     +9     +9 
15th        +11         +9     +9     +9    Fortified Soul
16th        +12        +10    +10    +10 
17th        +12        +10    +10    +10 
18th        +13        +11    +11    +11    Improved Evasion
19th        +14        +11    +11    +11 
20th        +15        +12    +12    +12    Damage reduction 15/+3

Class Features

Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Saiyans are born warriors, and have no need for weapons or armor of any kind. The only armor a Saiyan will ever wear is Saiyan battle armor. Saiyan battle armor is the same as Mithral Breastplate.

Fortified Body: At 3rd level, a Saiyan Warrior gains control over his body's immune systems. He gains immunity to all diseases except fpr magical diseases such as mummy rot and lycanthropy.

Fortified Blood: At 6th level, a Saiyan Warrior is in such control of his own metabolism that he gains immunity to poison of all kinds.

Fortified Soul: At 9th level, a Saiyan Warrior gains spell resistance. His spell resistance equals his level + 10. In order to affect the Saiyan Warrior with a spell, a spellcaster must roll the Saiyan Warrior's spell resistance or higher on 1d20 + the spellcaster's level.

Wholeness of Body: At 12th level, a Saiyan Warrior can cure his own wounds. He can cure up to twice his current total ECL in hit points each day, and he can spread this healing out among several uses. Wholeness of Body is a supernatural ability.

Evasion: At 15th level, a Saiyan Warrior gains evasion. If exposed to any effect that normally allows a character to attempt a Reflex saving throw for half damage (such as a fireball), he takes no damage with a successful saving throw. Evasion can only be used if the rogue is wearing light armor, no armor, or Saiyan battle armor. It is an extraordinary ability.

Improved Evasion: At 18th level, a Saiyan Warrior's evasion ability improves. He still takes no damage on a successful Reflex saving throw against attacks such as a dragon's breath weapon or a fireball, but henceforth he only takes half damage on a failed save.

SAIYAN ELITE EPIC PRESTIGE CLASS

The few . . . The proud . . . The Saiyan Elite . . . These are the most powerful warriors of the Saiyans.
Hit Die: d10

Requirements
To qualify to become a Saiyan Elite, a character must fulfill all of the following criteria.
Race: Saiyan or half-Saiyan
Base Attack Bonus: +20
Knowledge (fighting): 30 ranks
Knowledge (ki): 15 ranks
Feats: Conceal Ki, Control Oozaru Form, Energy Manipulation, Tail Weakness Immunity, Penetrate Damage Reduction

Class Skills
The Saiyan Warrior's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (fighting) (Int), Knowledge (ki) (Int), Listen (Wis), Search (Int), Sense Motive (Wis), Spot (Wis), and Tumble (Dex). See Chapter 4: Skills in the Player's Handbook for skill descriptions.

Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Int modifier

Code:
The Saiyan Elite

Saiyan
Elite
Level    Special
1st      Damage Reduction 20/+4, SR 30
2nd      Superior Initiative*
3rd      Abundant Step
4th      Bonus Feat
5th      Natural Armor +1
6th      Epic Endurance*
7th      Ki Focus*
8th      Bonus Feat
9th      Smite 1/day
10th     Damage Reduction 25/+5, SR 40, Natural Armor +2
11th     Epic Saiyan's Toughness*
12th     Bonus Feat
13th     Mettle
14th     Greater Ki Focus*
15th     Natural Armor +3
16th     Bonus Feat
17th     Epic Dodge*
18th     Smite 2/day
19th     Great Smiting*
20th     Damage Reduction 30/+6, SR 50, Bonus Feat, Natural Armor +4

Class Features

Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Saiyans are born warriors, and have no need for weapons or armor of any kind. The only armor a Saiyan will ever wear is Saiyan battle armor. Saiyan battle armor is the same as Mithral Breastplate.

*These are all bonus feats that a Saiyan Elite acquires automatically, regardless of whether or not he meets the prerequisites for the feat.

Abundant Step: At 3rd level, a Saiyan Elite can slip magically between spaces, as per the spell dimension door, at will. This is a spell-like ability that effects only the Saiyan Elite himself, and the Saiyan Elite's effective casting level is one-half his actual level (rounded down).

Bonus Feats: A Saiyan Elite gets a bonus feat at 4th level and an additional bonus feat every four levels thereafter (8th, 12th, 16th, and so on). These bonus feats must be chosen from the following list: Armor Skin, Damage Reduction Break, Detect Ki, Empower Ki, Energy Ball, Energy Explosion, Enhance Ki, Epic Energy Ball, Epic Energy Explosion, Epic Energy Manipulation, Epic Ki Blast, Epic Reflexes, Great Constitution, Great Dexterity, Great Strength, Improved Energy Ball, Improved Energy Explosion, Improved Ki Blast, Improved Ki Strike, Ki Blast.

Smite: Once per day, a Saiyan Elite of 9th level of higher may make a single melee attack an attack bonus equal to his Saiyan Elite level and a damage bonus equal to his total effective character level (if he hits). The Saiyan Elite must declare the smite before making the attack. At 18th level, the Saiyan Elite can smite twice per day. This form of smite is an extraordinary ability that does not stack with any other smite ability.

Mettle: A Saiyan Elite's powerful body and force of will allows him to shrug off most attacks that would otherwise harm him. If subjected to an attack that allows a Will or Fortitude save for half damage, the Saiyan Elite takes no damage on a successful save.



SUPER SAIYAN

The legendary Super Saiyans are beings with power the likes of which most mortals will never witness. When a Saiyan is pushed beyond the normal limits of power, he becomes a Super Saiyan.

CREATING A SUPER SAIYAN

"Super Saiyan" is a template that can be added to any creature with any amount of Saiyan blood. Half-Saiyans born after a Saiyan parent has gone Super Saiyan can themselves go Super Saiyan quite easily, although all Half-Saiyans can go Super Saiyan more easily than full Saiyans. Those with less than half Saiyan blood get increasingly diminished returns from going Super Saiyan. There are four known "levels" of Super Saiyan, although more may exist (DM's discretion). Note: Whenever a Super Saiyan loses consciousness, he automatically reverts back to his original form. In addition, if he takes enough damage in a single hit to reduce his hit points by 50% of his maximum, he must make a Fortitude save (DC 10 + damage dealt) or revert back to his normal form. Initial Super Saiyan transformations require an entire minute.

When a Saiyan goes Super Saiyan, his hair turns gold and spikes up in a thick manner. In addition, his eye color changes to a deep glossy sky blue and he becomes surrounded by a golden aura. The power of a Super Saiyan is so great that it can not be concealed, hidden, or disguised in any way. A Super Saiyan takes 1d6 points of subdual damage per round he remains as a Super Saiyan. Any Super Saiyan transformation after the first is a move-equivalent action.

When a Saiyan goes Super Saiyan 2, his hair spikes up even more although it becomes a bit thinner than before. In addition, a Super Saiyan 2 is surrounded by a harmless field of electricity. Except as noted, a Super Saiyan 2 looks exactly like a Super Saiyan. A Super Saiyan 2 takes 4d6 points of subdual damage per round he remains as a Super Saiyan 2. Any Super Saiyan 2 transformation after the first is a full-round action.

When a Saiyan goes Super Saiyan 3, his hair grows out thick and to a length equal to half the Saiyan's height. In addition, his eyes glow and his eyebrows disappear, giving the Super Saiyan 3 a barbaric or villainous look. Except as noted, a Super Saiyan 3 looks exactly like a Super Saiyan 2. A Super Saiyan 3 takes 9d6 points of subdual damage per round because of the immense amount of power and stress involved in remaining in the form. Any Super Saiyan 3 transformation after the first requires three rounds.

For a full Saiyan to become a Super Saiyan, his heart must be pure (DM's discretion) and he must then go through a traumatic, horrific, or utterly frustrating experience (In Dragonball Z, Goku went Super Saiyan in response to the death of his best friend, Krillin. Vegeta went Super Saiyan out of pure frustration that two other Super Saiyans existed while he, the Saiyan Prince, had not yet attained such power.); in addition, he must have at least 20 class levels. For a full Saiyan to reach Super Saiyan 2, he must have already attained the ability to transform into a Super Saiyan and have at least 50 class levels. For a full Saiyan to transform into a Super Saiyan 3, he must have already attained the ability to transform into a Super Saiyan 2 and have at least 100 class levels.

For a Half-Saiyan (born BEFORE his Saiyan parent became a Super Saiyan) to become a Super Saiyan, he must have at least 16 class levels. For a Half-Saiyan (born BEFORE his Saiyan parent became a Super Saiyan) to become a Super Saiyan 2, his heart must be pure (DM's discretion) and he must then go through a traumatic, horrific, or utterly frustrating experience (In Dragonball Z, Gohan, who felt unending pain and frustration due to his continuous cowardice and inability to save his friends from dying at the hands of evil, finally snapped when Cell killed Android 16, who had assured him that there was no shame in using all of his power to help those he cared about.); in addition, he must have at least 40 class levels. For a Half-Saiyan (born BEFORE his Saiyan parent became a Super Saiyan) to transform into a Super Saiyan 3, he must have already attained the ability to transform into a Super Saiyan and have at least 80 class levels.

For a Half-Saiyan (born AFTER his Saiyan parent became a Super Saiyan) to become a Super Saiyan, he must have at least 12 class levels, and must have seen a Saiyan transform into a Super Saiyan at least once. For a Half-Saiyan (born AFTER his Saiyan parent became a Super Saiyan) to become a Super Saiyan 2, his heart must be pure (DM's discretion) and he must then go through a traumatic, horrific, or utterly frustrating experience (In Dragonball Z, Trunks and Goten, the only Half-Saiyans born after their Saiyan parents had become Super Saiyans, never reached the level of Super Saiyan 2; as such, this is an educated guess based on the requirements for Gohan to go Super Saiyan 2.); in addition, he must have at least 30 class levels. For a Half-Saiyan (born AFTER his Saiyan parent became a Super Saiyan) to transform into a Super Saiyan 3, he must have already attained the ability to transform into a Super Saiyan and have at least 60 class levels, and must have seen a Saiyan transform into a Super Saiyan 3 at least once.

Although they are not divine or immortal, Saiyans who have attained Super Saiyan powers are considered deities for purposes of determining whether or not certain Salient Divine Abilities can work on them.

HD: A Super Saiyan always has maximum hit points.
Speed: Super Saiyan x2, Super Saiyan 2 x4, Super Saiyan 3 x8
*AC: All Super Saiyans have a deflection bonus to their AC equal to their Dexterity bonus (if any). In addition, a Super Saiyan gains a +20 natural armor bonus, a Super Saiyan 2 gains a +40 natural armor bonus, and a Super Saiyan 3 gains a +80 natural armor bonus. Note: Super Saiyans with less than half Saiyan blood receive only a +5 natural armor bonus.
Attacks: Super Saiyans may make an unlimited number of attacks as determined by his base attack bonus. Super Saiyans do not automatically fail on a natural attack roll of 1.
**Special Qualities: Super Saiyan: damage reduction 100/+10, SR +20; Super Saiyan 2: damage reduction 200/+20, SR +40; Super Saiyan 3: damage reduction 400/+30, SR +80
*Saves: A Super Saiyan gains a +20 resistance bonus to all saving throws, a Super Saiyan 2 gains a +40 resistance bonus to all saving throws, and a Super Saiyan 3 gains a +80 resistance bonus to all saving throws. Note: Super Saiyans with less than half Saiyan blood receive only a +5 resistance bonus to all saving throws.
*Abilities: Super Saiyan: Str +20, Dex +20, Con +20, Int +10, Wis +10, Cha +10; Super Saiyan 2: Str +40, Dex +40, Con +40, Int +20, Wis +20, Cha +20; Super Saiyan 3: Str +80, Dex +80, Con +80, Int +40, Wis +40, Cha +40. Note: Super Saiyans with less than half Saiyan blood receive only Str +5, Dex +5, Con +5, Int +1, Wis +2, Cha +2.
Challenge Rating: Super Saiyan: ECL +20, Super Saiyan 2: ECL +40, Super Saiyan 3: ECL +80 (Half-Saiyans: Super Saiyan: ECL +10, Super Saiyan 2: ECL +20, Super Saiyan 3: ECL +40) Note: Super Saiyans with less than half Saiyan blood are ECL +5.

* Half-Saiyans receive only half of these bonuses for the various levels of Super Saiyan.
** Those with less than half Saiyan blood receive limited Super Saiyan power, and thus do not get these Super Saiyan qualities. Furthermore, those with less than half Saiyan blood can never achieve any level beyond that of Super Saiyan.
 
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I think your saiyan race is WAY too powerful. Just curious, but what would be their ECL? Probably too high to make them useful as player characters. The basic problem that I see is that you are creating a race that accounts for all the cool powers and abilities possesed by characters of the Saiyan race. All the powers and abilities possesed by Gohu, and Vegita were due to the fact that they were powerful WARRIORS not just that they were Saiyans(all though that had alot to due with it.) For this reason I don't think you should give them Monk class abilities.


You should use Raditz, (Goku's brother, and the first and weakest Saiyan encountered) or a very young Goku as a basis for a Saiyan race. Vegita, Nappa, and adult Goku are just too powerful to use as a basis for a balanced race. Goku as a child is far stronger and faster than the average human. This translates into at least a +4 bonus to Strength and Dex and a bonus to base speed. Additionally, his Ki was stronger than average. Thats a bonus to Wisdom (or whatever one would use to simulate Ki in D20) but not a bonus to Wisdom skills as he wasn't necessarily more perceptive. He was also tougher, so he gets a natural AC bonus, a bonus to CON, and two or three extra hit dice. None of the Saiyans were particularly smart, so they get at least a -2 to Int.

Your rules for Oozaru seem pretty good, but I would change it so its more similar to changing shape using lycanthrope (ie involuntary changes, and a skill that allows one to take some control over the change).

As for the rules for Saiyans becoming more powerful after a brush with death, I would leave it out or change the power so the bonuses granted are only temporary. The way the rules are now, it is too easy for a player to do just what Vejita tried to do, bring themeselves do the brink of death, and have themselves healed so they are stronger and more powerful. Sure this doesn't fit with the way Saiyans are presented by Toriyama, but in DBZ, they are by far the most powerful race and most powerful characters in the whole series. Even without this ability they literally tower over all other races.

Bottom line, if what you were aiming for is a race of supermen, any one of which is capable of wiping out life on a whole planet, your Saiyan race as written is fine. If however, you want a somewhat over balanced race thats not campaign breaking and your not too afraid to let your players use, see above.
 


Witness said:

I think your saiyan race is WAY too powerful. Just curious, but what would be their ECL?

If you had read the entire thing, you would know that Saiyans are ECL +15.

Witness said:

The basic problem that I see is that you are creating a race that accounts for all the cool powers and abilities possesed by characters of the Saiyan race. All the powers and abilities possesed by Gohu, and Vegita were due to the fact that they were powerful WARRIORS not just that they were Saiyans(all though that had alot to due with it.) For this reason I don't think you should give them Monk class abilities.

Actually, I didn't give all of their "cool" powers to the race. Notice that the Saiyan *race* ONLY gets Oozaru form, monk abilities, tail weakness, and power adaptaion. This follows the Dragonball premise that Saiyans are, in fact, natural-born warriors.

The reason I chose the monk offensive and defensive abilities is because Saiyans obviously have more natural offensive and defensive capability than all other races, and so I gave them abilities of the class that gives more natural offensive and defensive capability.

Considering they're ECL +15, I believe it is perfectly balanced. A Saiyan with only 1 class level is Level 16 by default!

Witness said:

You should use Raditz, (Goku's brother, and the first and weakest Saiyan encountered) or a very young Goku as a basis for a Saiyan race.

Young Goku maybe, but not Raditz. Raditz was a Saiyan Elite. Therefore, I based the Saiyan Elite Epic Prestige Class on Raditz. The power is appropriate, because remember, Raditz was seven times more powerful than the most powerful human at that time.

Witness said:

Goku as a child is far stronger and faster than the average human. This translates into at least a +4 bonus to Strength and Dex and a bonus to base speed.

I disagree. Remember, Goku was born a bit weaker than other Saiyans. Normal Saiyans translate to Strength +16 and Constitution +8, and this goes down if the Saiyan loses his tail.

Witness said:

Additionally, his Ki was stronger than average. Thats a bonus to Wisdom

NO NO NO! No one, even in Dragonball, is "born" with any amount of ki! Ki is learned, not innate! (That's why Goku learned his FIRST energy attack from Roshi, that being the Kamehameha Wave!) Also, Wisdom is a VERY bad stat to use from ki, and furthermore, Ki should not be a numerical value, nor is it. Ki is a person's life force, and therefore, the closest thing to a numeric ki value is, in fact, hit points. For ki, go to the link to "The Big Big Book of Feats".

The Saiyan can't possibly be evaluated until you have read the feats and taken the system as a whole. You can't import just one section, because that would be ineffective. To use this, you must also consider the feats!

Witness said:

He was also tougher, so he gets a natural AC bonus, a bonus to CON, and two or three extra hit dice.

Tougher is accounted for not by a natural armor bonus to AC, but by the 8 HD, Constitution bonus, and monk ability AC bonus.

Witness said:

None of the Saiyans were particularly smart, so they get at least a -2 to Int.

Actually, I foundthem to be the same as humans in terms of intelligence. They weren't smart, but neither were they stupid. They were literate, meaning no penalty to Intelligence.

Witness said:

Your rules for Oozaru seem pretty good, but I would change it so its more similar to changing shape using lycanthrope (ie involuntary changes, and a skill that allows one to take some control over the change).

I disagree. No Saiyan was able to control his Oozaru form until the middle of Dragonball GT when Goku first did it, and even then, it was the Golden Oozaru form, not the regular Oozaru form. It is not quite the same as lycanthropes. I did, however, base the Oozaru form on a lycanthrope template, so you weren't far off. You didn't see that?

Witness said:

As for the rules for Saiyans becoming more powerful after a brush with death, I would leave it out or change the power so the bonuses granted are only temporary. The way the rules are now, it is too easy for a player to do just what Vejita tried to do, bring themeselves do the brink of death, and have themselves healed so they are stronger and more powerful. Sure this doesn't fit with the way Saiyans are presented by Toriyama, but in DBZ, they are by far the most powerful race and most powerful characters in the whole series. Even without this ability they literally tower over all other races.

As a race, they are supposed to tower over most other races. That's why they're ECL +15.

Basically, you overlooked the fact that most of the Saiyan power comes not from the race but from the two classes they can take. Once a Level 20 Saiyan Elite, however, we're talking about a MINIMUM of a Level 46 character, which is more powerful than most deities. With a Level 20 Saiyan Warrior, you're still already Level 35, so this balances out perfectly.

This does fit into any campaign, but you must remember that the power level needs to match. Saiyans are nearly Epic from the beginning, so use them with caution and as nearly Epic characters, because that's what they are. Ecl +15. Remember that.

If you thought this was powerful, wait until you see the Super Saiyan rules!
 
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Witness said:
Hae you written up any other classes or races based on DBZ? I would really like to see a Namekian race.

At this point, there are no plans for bringing in anything except for Saiyans. My next project I am working on is Tyranids.

Namekians may be useful, however, since hte Dragonballs ARE in my campaign. Who knows?
 

Originally posted by Anubis
I disagree. No Saiyan was able to control his Oozaru form until the middle of Dragonball GT when Goku first did it, and even then, it was the Golden Oozaru form, not the regular Oozaru form. It is not quite the same as lycanthropes. I did, however, base the Oozaru form on a lycanthrope template, so you weren't far off. You didn't see that?

I disagree, you must not have watched the the episodes when Goku was fighting Vegita on earth, Vegita transformed into an Oorzau and could control himself.
 

DeBhaal said:


I disagree, you must not have watched the the episodes when Goku was fighting Vegita on earth, Vegita transformed into an Oorzau and could control himself.

Watch it agian. Yes, he could talk and think, but he was not "in control" per se. To be honest, I would liken it more to a Barbarian's Rage ability than Lycanthropy. Maybe a combination of both.
 

IIRC, Raditz himself wasn't an Saiyan Elite, just a Saiyan.

Nappa and Vegeta were the first Saiyan Elite encountered (the notable trait of not having the Tail Weakness).

And I believe it fits, as even the Young Goku exhibited greater strength than even the majority of 'physically strong' fighters (although this may have been more so due to his 'learning from fights' aspect).

Quite possibly, Vegita and others are able to 'control' their oozaru rage/form more so through training (ie, ranks in Control Shape or whatever that Lycanthrope feat is), whereas Goku and the others shunned their Oozaru form and never really exploited it. The Golden Oozaru form is a bit more odd, since to achieve that (And the more common 'Super Saiyan' status) you need to focus on your rage, also why Goku isn't able to 'control'/attack with the spirit bomb with the Androids movie while Super (but instead draws it into himself).

[ Add ]

Err hit send to soon :).

In all it's pretty good and I like it, just some comments :).
 
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