Running a marilith - strategy

[Bungus]

Repeated castings of Wall of Stone. Cleric-9 can pull it off, eventually (takes a LONG time, though - do you have any idea how many Create Water spells you'll need?)
The gestalt Sorcerer//Monk/Paladin (or Gestalt Sorcerer//Monk/Hexblade), who took Ascetic Mage (there's a couple others, but those are my two favorites for good Gestalt campaigns and non-good Gestalt campaigns).

I would think that while the Wall of Stones were being cast, the marilith would continually be slapping them down...

My guess is that the melee fighters will rush to engage, the cleric casts prayer the first round, the psion casts a defensive spell... next round, melee attacks, the cleric heals the most damaged combatant, the psion casts one of his ranged touch powers.

The party would need the cleric's healing ability (plus, a possible Revivify in there as well...) rather than casting Wall of Stone while dodging 400 pound boulders being tossed at her with the marilith's telekinesis.

Also, what do you mean about those two Gestalt characters? They have good touch ACs? Where can I get info on Gestalt characters?

 

[Jack Simth]

I would think that while the Wall of Stones were being cast, the marilith would continually be slapping them down...

Considering the number of rounds it'll take to drown a maralith anyway (Create Water doesn't actually create all that much water), you'll need to deal with that regardless.

My guess is that the melee fighters will rush to engage, the cleric casts prayer the first round, the psion casts a defensive spell... next round, melee attacks, the cleric heals the most damaged combatant, the psion casts one of his ranged touch powers.

The party would need the cleric's healing ability (plus, a possible Revivify in there as well...) rather than casting Wall of Stone while dodging 400 pound boulders being tossed at her with the marilith's telekinesis.

If she's confined to a particular room (that is, she can't melee unless you close), and she can't really run away, that's not how you want to run it.

Everyone pulls out the ranged weapons. Psion readies a touch-attack power to disrupt activation of her spell-like abilities (she doesn't have any offensive Su abilities by default), and everyone else stays outside her limit and attacks with ranged effects. As long as she can't close (and provided the Psion makes all the touch attacks, and provided the Maralith is "vanilla"), that'll kill her with much less in the way of risk.

Also, what do you mean about those two Gestalt characters? They have good touch ACs? Where can I get info on Gestalt characters?

Gestalt is a campaign variant introduced in Unearthed Arcana (or was that Arcana Unearthed?) and reproduced Here, as most of UA is Open Game Content.

And yes, those two characters get good touch AC's. Charisma as a primary casting stat for the Sorcerer side, Monk grants Wisdom to AC, and the Ascetic Mage feat (Complete Adventurer) changes the Monk's Wisdom to AC to Charisma to AC... and the Monk bonus applies to Touch AC.

You can also do it with a normal Sorcerer - it just takes an additional feat (Improved Unarmed Strike), and a particular item (Monk's Belt) (total cost for Charisma to AC, permanently: two feats, one Core item).

The two builds in question also get Charisma to saves...

If you press, you can get Charisma to AC/saves more than once... but that's rather cheesed out.

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

I agree with Frank that unless the marilith is hiding, she should have her unholy aura up. After that, there are a few questions:

1. What is the limitation of the magic circle. The standard D&D fiction magic circle cannot be broken from the inside, but if broken from the outside (by, say, shooting an arrow or casting an attack spell across it), it's a free-for all. A more durable circle might trap her inside unless something physical crosses the circle but be fine with the PCs casting spells across it. I don't see any reason why the circle would inhibit her spell like abilities though, so it's hardly an autowin for the PCs even if they can sit back and cast spells/shoot arrows at her. She has good saves, decent SR, a high AC, and spell like abilities that are just as potent as what the PCs are tossing at her. If she does decide that she wants to get up close and personal with the PCs, she could always use telekinesis to throw an object or person across the circle and break it, allowing her to move.

2. A general principle: Do not simply decide an order of abilities and repeat like WotC's trained monkeys suggested. Rather, keep in mind a few principles:

A. Her full melee attack at this level is likely to be more effective than any of her spell like abilities. Use it when possible.

A2. Grappling interferes with making a full melee attack. You have improved grab, so if you do get a line on the wizard, rogue, or cleric, take the -20 to grapple him without being considered grappled yourself. That way, you limit the PC's options without limiting your own. (You can even massacre the PC with swords afterward)

B. Her spell like abilties are more effective than a single melee attack. Use them when she cannot make a full melee attack.

But what about the spell like abilities? Consider a few non-obvious uses of telekinesis:

1. Disarm PCs. The archer with the holy bow probably doesn't have a good will save. Use the violent thrust option and smash his bow into the wall, into another PC or just into the ground next to you. If PCs are flying, this can be particularly effective as you can disarm one PC, slam their weapon into another PC for damage and then it will fall out of reach of any PC--ideally next to you so that you can keep the PCs from picking it up.
2. Move the PCs. What's better than slamming the archer into the ceiling 70 feet away and watching him fall to the floor and take more damage? Slamming the archer into the ceiling, and watching him fall to the floor take damage, and land prone right next to you. He didn't want to be in full attack range and now he is. You have reach and improved grab so he can't easily get out of improved grab range and he can't fire a bow while prone--so he can't make a full attack either. Wizards and non-battle clerics won't like that position much either. (If you can toss the PC through a blade barrier on the way to the ceiling, so much the better--and if he falls through the blade barrier again on the way down, it's just icing on the cake. (This is possible as follows: the character is thrown up, through the blade barrier and exits the top of the blade barrier before slamming into the ceiling, still above the blade barrier. When he falls, he will go through the blade barrier again)).

You'll notice that there is some synergy with blade barrier as well as with her melee attacks there. If the marilith has a choice, it would probably drop a blade barrier in round 1 if it can get 1/2 to 2/3 of the group in it and follow it up in round 2 either with a full attack (if any PCs were foolish enough to close with it) or a telekinesis in round 2 (ideally pulling a non-melee character through the blade barrier as many times as possible on his way to bouncing off the ceiling and landing next to the marilith). Then round 3, the marilith massacres the unfortunate. If there is a party member that is particularly effective, however, the marilith is well advised to skip the strategically planned steps and eliminate that threat as quickly as possible by disarming that foe or by pulling the foe to her--even if there is no blade barrier.

 

[Bungus]

She will have her unholy aura up, which I believe improves her regular AC and her touch AC, as well as gives her +4 to her saves and spell resistance (though, I don't think it's a double resistance with her SR already at 25...)

The magic circle can only be broken if the stones that created it are disturbed/broken. However, the area inside the circle is so overgrown with jungle that she has mad bonuses to hide if she does not want to be seen.

the party cleric is a follower of a Diana-like archery goddess, so she is the main archer in the party (she also has special magic arrows that can heal...) However, she has a great Will save.

the fighter & rogue both have less than ideal Will saves.

I like the blade barrier idea, followed by telekinesis to effectively Bull Rush a PC into the barrier.

 

[javcs]

Remember, the Marilith is chaotic, so it's okay to do something random from time to time.

Also - it wants out of the circle right? I expect that it has long since figured out how to get out of the circle/disable the circle, but needs someone else to do it. In such a case, it might attempt to BS the party into breaking the circle - it's got a pretty good Bluff modifier, so it should have a decent chance of convincing at least one party member into letting it out.
It will probably attempt this before launching an attack - probably, because it is, after all, an almost certainly very cranky Chaotic Evil Outsider.
It can hide and use SLA's (polymorph/project image) to appear as an Angel/other Good outsider (but a not very powerful one, because it lacks the abilities to support being a powerful one.

 

[Bungus]

Remember, the Marilith is chaotic, so it's okay to do something random from time to time.

Also - it wants out of the circle right? I expect that it has long since figured out how to get out of the circle/disable the circle, but needs someone else to do it. In such a case, it might attempt to BS the party into breaking the circle - it's got a pretty good Bluff modifier, so it should have a decent chance of convincing at least one party member into letting it out.
It will probably attempt this before launching an attack - probably, because it is, after all, an almost certainly very cranky Chaotic Evil Outsider.
It can hide and use SLA's (polymorph/project image) to appear as an Angel/other Good outsider (but a not very powerful one, because it lacks the abilities to support being a powerful one.

yes, it wants out of the circle...

BSing also sounds good.

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

She will have her unholy aura up, which I believe improves her regular AC and her touch AC, as well as gives her +4 to her saves and spell resistance (though, I don't think it's a double resistance with her SR already at 25...)

The magic circle can only be broken if the stones that created it are disturbed/broken. However, the area inside the circle is so overgrown with jungle that she has mad bonuses to hide if she does not want to be seen.

the party cleric is a follower of a Diana-like archery goddess, so she is the main archer in the party (she also has special magic arrows that can heal...) However, she has a great Will save.

the fighter & rogue both have less than ideal Will saves.

I like the blade barrier idea, followed by telekinesis to effectively Bull Rush a PC into the barrier.

You can also use the combat manuever version of telekinesis to disarm. It's weak sauce compared to the violent thrust disarm version but no will save is required.

Another interesting option if you do do the TK pull on the rogue, or fighter is to use grapple as a defense against archery. Remember that ranged attacks on a grappled opponent have a 50% chance of hitting either grappler. That's an option to keep in your back pocket if the cleric starts pelting you with arrows. (Also remember that blade barrier grants cover--that should help make it difficult for ranged attacks to hit the marilith).

 

[Jeff Wilder]

Remember that ranged attacks on a grappled opponent have a 50% chance of hitting either grappler.

Out of curiosity, Glyn, do you know where "50 percent" is codified? I've never been able to find anything except that the target is determined "randomly." I keep forgetting to see if the Rules Compendium clairifies this.

(My personal rule is that I use a ratio of base-sizes. So two Medium grapplers would be 50/50, but a Medium and a Large grappler would be 20/80. I like this primarily because it seems absurd to me that, say, a Colossal creature grappling a goblin sets up a 50/50 chance to hit either.)

 

[Bungus]

You can also use the combat manuever version of telekinesis to disarm. It's weak sauce compared to the violent thrust disarm version but no will save is required.

Another interesting option if you do do the TK pull on the rogue, or fighter is to use grapple as a defense against archery. Remember that ranged attacks on a grappled opponent have a 50% chance of hitting either grappler. That's an option to keep in your back pocket if the cleric starts pelting you with arrows. (Also remember that blade barrier grants cover--that should help make it difficult for ranged attacks to hit the marilith).

I think a violent thrust tossing 3-4 PCs into the blade barrier is a pretty good use of TK. With 5 PCs and 2 NPCs, though, I'm not sure how useful disarming one opponent would be, unless only 1 is engaged in melee with the marilith... which may be near suicidal if it can do a full attack on the PC.

 

[NewJeffCT]

I think a violent thrust tossing 3-4 PCs into the blade barrier is a pretty good use of TK. With 5 PCs and 2 NPCs, though, I'm not sure how useful disarming one opponent would be, unless only 1 is engaged in melee with the marilith... which may be near suicidal if it can do a full attack on the PC.

I would say keep 2 arms in "reserve" and have them exclusively disarming the PCs to prevent them from getting full attacks (if they do disarm)