D&D 5E Running NPC allies

I guess you're unfamiliar with WotC's 5e adventures - recently, they love handing out allies... :p

I understand all that - I guess I was hoping for some actual play experiences?

That is based on my actual play experiences. And I believe only OOTA and SKT do this, I know LMOP and POTA do not. That's part of the reason I haven't run or played the first two (because of the reviews critical of all the NPC's that get tacked onto the party).

As for OOTA and SKT, I would make sure the NPCs are significantly weaker than the players. Even if that means I have to adjust the scripted challenges so the party can defeat them without much help from the allies.

But, sounds like you have since worked things out and sorry my original response wasn't helpful or what you were looking for.
 

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S

Sunseeker

Guest
What are some better ways to handle this? The most obvious one, of course, is to have the players run the allies, but are there others? And, if the players do end up running them, what kind of information do the players need (beyond a stat block) to make it work smoothly?

I would let the players run them during combat. But if the NPC holds some kind of plot purpose, I wouldn't let the PCs run them for that.

Also, typically I don't really "roll" for NPCs, they hit when it's necessary for them to lend a hand in a fight, they miss when it's useful to have them go hide in a corner or make the players cover their butts. NPCs are IMO, plot devices, nothing more.
 

Shiroiken

Legend
If you are going to use NPC allies, I'd suggest you always have them hit about 25/50/75% of the time, based on their attack modifier, and all damage dice are averaged (conveniently placed in the stat block). This keeps you from rolling too much, and you can quickly get past the NPC's turn.
 

pukunui

Legend
There's also this, from Dead in Thay:

Capture.JPG
 

ClaytonCross

Kinder reader Inflection wanted
So I am GMing a game for my wife. She had never played D&D before and was interested to play but afraid to play with others, at least until she has played it a little and gotten used to Role playing and general game mechanics. I started her by herself teach mechanics and it was fun but she quickly asked me "who do you play?". I laughed and told here EVERYONE but you. But despite the interaction with story board NPCs she was not getting involved with characters because she would run missions alone. Also, without support and at least another character to interact with during missions the game was lacking.

So I was faced with the same reality the OP is bring up. She needed a partner for support, emergencies, story, someone to bring up other options, and also as a method of be dropping some suggestions in character to a new player without telling her how to play and allowing her to go her own way. I needed to play it for many of the same reasons. Most of all I needed it not out shine her. I thought about it and came up with working solution.

NPC character requirements
- Minor Timid/dumb/foolish/cowardly nature : The character needs to lack the ability to lead so that her character can chart the course. However, if the NPC is timid it still needs to be willing to speak up and engage in conversation but as a more of a response not a driving force. If the character is dumb or foolish it works better if the character is not entirely clueless so you use them to interject if the player has what "appears" to be a really bad idea but you can also play on that by having "jump in front" on bad ideas so you might lose an NPC instead of your player. Demonstration through giving an example of what NOT to do not by heroically leading the way. Player starts down the hall no checks or anything, (you know the hall has 3 traps) NPC says "race you to the end!" runs into first trap, player might get a dex check to pull the NPC out of the way and be a hero or at least does not take the damage and hopefully leads the now careful path forward. Cowardly makes a character instantly not a hero no matter there states but they need to be willing to self sacrifice for he characters in order to be useful.

- Sub optimal BUT useful. So my wife is playing a high dex high wisdom High Elf monk as one might do (she doesn't know the game well enough to optimize its just what she wanted to play based on my descriptions of things which may have flavored her choses but she defiantly went strait for what she wanted.) So I built her NPC ally also as a monk because she is starting in a monastery. I didn't want high intellect, wisdom, or dexterity so that she would shine as the stealthy observant character and I wanted to make any "Master"/"Guide" intelligence character separate NPCs that she might seek for guidance but that would not travel with her. So ... I built a strength and constitution human variant monk with the healer feat. This is working great so far because when ever she is short on strength the NPC can step in to assist making it useful, also since it has low AC but high health he is the stumbling meat shield so he looks like he is being useless but is in a way saving her character by taking the damage, then as a medic he restores them both out of combat in what I make story planning the next move moments. Which due to his lack of confidence (a result of his sub par skills) he mostly defers to her. Since its out of combat in story healing it doesn't seem like a shining moment and more of a subtle assist.

- Needs to level with the players. Why? Well at lower levels the hit point difference is huge and a one shot drops the NPC out right making them useless. I tend to think its better to let the NPC take a beating then to not survive. A sub optimal, design and character flaw that discourages heroism will be enough to ensure the player(s) shine brighter. At higher levels they need to be roughly the same to stay relevant but optionally you could have multiple lower NPCs instead and allow some of them to die.

So far it is working out. Just my take on the "Ally NPC".
 

robus

Lowcountry Low Roller
Supporter
So I am GMing a game for my wife. She had never played D&D before and was interested to play but afraid to play with others, at least until she has played it a little and gotten used to Role playing and general game mechanics. I started her by herself teach mechanics and it was fun but she quickly asked me "who do you play?". I laughed and told here EVERYONE but you. But despite the interaction with story board NPCs she was not getting involved with characters because she would run missions alone. Also, without support and at least another character to interact with during missions the game was lacking.

So I was faced with the same reality the OP is bring up. She needed a partner for support, emergencies, story, someone to bring up other options, and also as a method of be dropping some suggestions in character to a new player without telling her how to play and allowing her to go her own way. I needed to play it for many of the same reasons. Most of all I needed it not out shine her. I thought about it and came up with working solution.

NPC character requirements
- Minor Timid/dumb/foolish/cowardly nature : The character needs to lack the ability to lead so that her character can chart the course. However, if the NPC is timid it still needs to be willing to speak up and engage in conversation but as a more of a response not a driving force. If the character is dumb or foolish it works better if the character is not entirely clueless so you use them to interject if the player has what "appears" to be a really bad idea but you can also play on that by having "jump in front" on bad ideas so you might lose an NPC instead of your player. Demonstration through giving an example of what NOT to do not by heroically leading the way. Player starts down the hall no checks or anything, (you know the hall has 3 traps) NPC says "race you to the end!" runs into first trap, player might get a dex check to pull the NPC out of the way and be a hero or at least does not take the damage and hopefully leads the now careful path forward. Cowardly makes a character instantly not a hero no matter there states but they need to be willing to self sacrifice for he characters in order to be useful.

- Sub optimal BUT useful. So my wife is playing a high dex high wisdom High Elf monk as one might do (she doesn't know the game well enough to optimize its just what she wanted to play based on my descriptions of things which may have flavored her choses but she defiantly went strait for what she wanted.) So I built her NPC ally also as a monk because she is starting in a monastery. I didn't want high intellect, wisdom, or dexterity so that she would shine as the stealthy observant character and I wanted to make any "Master"/"Guide" intelligence character separate NPCs that she might seek for guidance but that would not travel with her. So ... I built a strength and constitution human variant monk with the healer feat. This is working great so far because when ever she is short on strength the NPC can step in to assist making it useful, also since it has low AC but high health he is the stumbling meat shield so he looks like he is being useless but is in a way saving her character by taking the damage, then as a medic he restores them both out of combat in what I make story planning the next move moments. Which due to his lack of confidence (a result of his sub par skills) he mostly defers to her. Since its out of combat in story healing it doesn't seem like a shining moment and more of a subtle assist.

- Needs to level with the players. Why? Well at lower levels the hit point difference is huge and a one shot drops the NPC out right making them useless. I tend to think its better to let the NPC take a beating then to not survive. A sub optimal, design and character flaw that discourages heroism will be enough to ensure the player(s) shine brighter. At higher levels they need to be roughly the same to stay relevant but optionally you could have multiple lower NPCs instead and allow some of them to die.

So far it is working out. Just my take on the "Ally NPC".

Cool - sort of a Watson to her Sherlock Holmes :) Sounding board and ham-fisted ally!
 

Dausuul

Legend
So it keeps happening that the PCs manage to end up with some NPC allies and I, as DM, run them. But it's really starting to grate on me as I end up rolling dice against myself and basically playing alone while the players sit and watch. It's a bit ridiculous and I feel awkward about it (especially if there is a number of allies...) I feel bad if I don't run the allies optimally (because I'm not giving the full aid) and I also feel bad if I run them too well (and end up outshining the PCs!)

What are some better ways to handle this? The most obvious one, of course, is to have the players run the allies, but are there others? And, if the players do end up running them, what kind of information do the players need (beyond a stat block) to make it work smoothly?

My approach:

#1: Look for any excuse to have NPCs refuse to go with the party.

#2: If I can't think of such an excuse, make up a stat sheet and hand it to a player to run in combat, with the caveat that I can step in if the player abuses this control (no, the NPC is not going to do something stupid and suicidal to save your sorry butt). Outside combat, I run the NPC but they stay in the background.
 

robus

Lowcountry Low Roller
Supporter
My approach:

#1: Look for any excuse to have NPCs refuse to go with the party.

#2: If I can't think of such an excuse, make up a stat sheet and hand it to a player to run in combat, with the caveat that I can step in if the player abuses this control (no, the NPC is not going to do something stupid and suicidal to save your sorry butt). Outside combat, I run the NPC but they stay in the background.

Yep - I think that's what I will do in future if this comes up again. That way the players get the chance to use the allies to their best advantage (or not) as they see fit.
 


Xaelvaen

Stuck in the 90s
So many lucky people here, hah. I've been playing with my core home group for many years now, and I'm not allowed to not run a character alongside them when I DM. Anytime I start up a campaign, they make sure I have a character ready to go too. I usually fill in the gaps with what is missing from the party (though I refuse to ever run the alpha-personality sort, and they accept this).

Relating to this issue, there's never a point where I don't have an NPC in the party, because I can't run my 'character' entirely like the rest of the players. I have to cleverly arrange skills so as to not hit all the passive perception DCs, or have the knowledge for certain situations, or quite the opposite - play the NPC that lends the PCs information they want or need.

Occasionally I get lucky, and I can play a 'character' that doesn't have to always go with them to those dangerous dungeons and such. "Oh.. I'm playing an elderly wizard. You need to go explore the lost ruins of Blatherington? I... can't go, I have to research the ruins in the library! But here's a Sending Stone and I'll give you the information you need." The grognards I play with don't buy this often.

There is an upside, though - when my whole group feels like playing the oddball character, sometimes they don't crunch quite as hard, and the party can't really support certain types of adventures. Rather than having to exclude those, the npc can be the face-smasher they need. With the experienced group I have, deathblows and glory and all that is meaningless, unless that is the focus of one of their characters, at which point, I obviously play the healer or the 'storyteller' to sing deeds of their handiwork.

The only time I ever get to -just- DM, is when I'm doing new groups down at the FLGS. It's a relief to not have to work twice as hard, admittedly, but nothing beats playing with your decades-long friendships, even if they do make you work so so much harder.

To the Original Question
My insight into the situation is limited, but I do make a "Roll Chart" for my 'character' and the NPCs that sometimes end up in the party. I pre-roll about 30 d20s and record them down on a list in order. Then, when my npc or whatnot needs to make a check or roll, I put a tic by one of the rolls, in order. If I finish the whole list, I just run it in reverse with a second line of tics. This works quickly and efficiently for me.
 

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