Ryan Dancey on Phase II

[kenjib]

The Diomen guys, that much I know.

The Twin Crowns people seem to have moved toward LARPing. I don't know if they count or not.

It was just in the EN news - maybe a week ago - that Otherworld Creations will be putting out regional sourcebooks for Diomin via RPGNOW. They are also working on the Solid! blaxploitation d20 game.

The Twin Crowns folks put out "Streets of Silver" and "Spellbound" recently. Larry Fitz was also just asking people on this board what they would think of a book on economics for d20.

http://enworld.cyberstreet.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49406

Were there some other press releases that aren't on the news sections of their web sites about them giving up?

 

[2WS-Steve]

Old RPG publishers never die, they just fade away. I think Fantasy Games Unlimited is still sort of a publisher even though they have made anything new in a long time.

 

[Henry]

First of all, Ryan Dancey is indeed a smart man. I have great respect for him.

However, I see his "Phase II" column as more of "pulling a picture together" than making a prediction. These things are already happening, and he's pointing them out and saying they will continue.

But in regards to his desire to make d20 the only game in town, I don't see it. I've never seen him make a statement to that effect, and in fact in his forum on Gamingreport.com has made numerous statements to the contrary.

Also, Many people see the OGL as equalling d20, but the fact is, ANYBODY's system reference they wish to release under the OGL can be used. GURPS could, if Steve Jackson chose, take all its rules systems, strip all flavor and specifics from them, and release them as the "Jackson System Reference Document" and all strictures for OGL would be binding, particularly the intermixing of mechanics from the two systems, but mainly the point being that other companies could use them as OGL content, and creating their own game systems. The news of Gold Rush Games' Action System being released under the Open Game License is unique in that it is the the first time a non-d20 based system falls in that license specifically. Other games have had open content, but none have been released under the SAME OGL. Here we have it, the thing that Ryan said a year ago other publishers had available, but were not taking advantage of.

 

[barsoomcore]

Oh. I thought Ryan was talking about this.

I'm sure he's very clever and all, regardless.

 

[BiggusGeekus]

Were there some other press releases that aren't on the news sections of their web sites about them giving up?

No, I just was apparently out of the loop for a bit and missed those releases. Mea Culpa!

 

[ced1106]

There will always be multiple systems. You won't ever have to worry about that. If anything the expansion of D&D under the OGL could even help them.

Yep. The "Oh, I can create a better D&D product than this" is pretty much analogous to the "Oh, I can create a better **roleplaying game** than this".

Indeed, we've also seen "Oh, I can create a better **style of roleplaying** than this" sorta rpg's, such as LARPS and storytelling games.

D&D is one great gateway drug...!


Cedric.
aka. Washu! ^O^

 

[ced1106]

Small publishers can still put out stuff using the OGL license but without using any of the d20 mechanics or license. You could, for example, put out a new version of GURPS or HERO under the OGL with a new branding license similar to the d20 license.

If this strategy worked so well for WotC, then why is this the exception rather than the norm right now among other game systems? Does D&D's traditional market dominance give them a special position where only they can benefit substantially from a licensing scheme like this?

What would happen if HERO came out with a d20-style licensing scheme? What if a smaller print run game like Riddle of Steel game out under OGL?

IMO, following the OGL or d20 doesn't inherently add value to your product. The lack of success with Deadlands d20, SAS d20, and Rokugan d20 (?) told third-parties to stick with their own systems, not risk the additional costs of another line.

OTOH, For **new** systems, OGL (and d20) are good ideas. AEG's Spycraft d20, Md20, and EQ RPG OGL (?) come to mind. Certainly Monte Cook's AU will attract a greater audience because it's OGL, not an entirely new system.

In other words, OGL/d20 is strong enough to sell a D&D-compatible product, opens new systems to the d20 player's base, but doesn't add enough value for systems with existing customers.

Either that, or I'm still getting OGL and d20 mixed up...


Cedric.
aka. Washu! ^O^

 

[Davelozzi]

Judging by the rate at which AEG continues to put out products in the line, I'd venture to guess that d20 Rokugan is doing quite well.

 

[Dismas]

SSZ? Not familair with this one.

Space Ship Zero. Non d20.

Think of Cliffhanger Buck Rodgers and Flash Gordon Sci-FI mixed with CoC.

Based on a non-existant radio serial / German TV remake / soon to be film of the same name.

 

[ichabod]

I just don't buy it. The d20 market is not trimming the junk out of the market. The introduction of the OGL/d20 introduced a glut of junk into the market, much like the introduction of MtG introduced a glut of bad CCGs. The ammount of junk in the market is just returning to normal.

And market forces are not going to trim down the ammount of junk in RPGs. This is not an industry of professionals trying to make money. This is a group of hobbyists trying to put out their favorite games. Market forces are going to have a much smaller impact in RPGs than real industries like steel production.

Besides, the market forces don't even work the same in RPGs. d20 cannot handle the range of things people are looking for in RPGs without becoming so unlike D&D as to lose the benefit of being d20. And if the system wars have taught us anything, it's that no matter how similar two systems are, some will despise one and love the other.