Sample Character request: Warrior/Mage
Daelkyr
First Post
I threw together a Half-elf Fighter with Arcane Initiate. His Elf power keys off of his actual class so as far as I can see, he doesn't negate that when taking Arcane Initiate because he only meets *some* Wizard pre-req's but doesn't count as a full blown Wizard.
Is he the most efficient gish, I don't know. I've never played one. But this guy does very decent damage from his Fighter side of the field and has two ranged area attacks from his heritage and feat multi-classing to help with mob control. He's a little light on the hp (for 4e) so his daily power allowing him to use a healing surge will give him that little bit extra.
Is he the most efficient gish, I don't know. I've never played one. But this guy does very decent damage from his Fighter side of the field and has two ranged area attacks from his heritage and feat multi-classing to help with mob control. He's a little light on the hp (for 4e) so his daily power allowing him to use a healing surge will give him that little bit extra.
neceros
Adventurer
Firstly, a Warlord/Wizard build with the Warlord taking Tactical options is probably better suited then a Fighter would be.
Secondly, multi classing is entirely used for concept retrieval. If you want your Fighter to have Fireball, then he can. IT may not be optimal, but it's possible and you can still try to optimize it.
The true hero of 4e are classes. Eventually, I imagine they'll be releasing all sorts of combos that we recognize as PrCs, like the Duskblade, Warmage, Beguiler, etc.
Just have to wait.
Secondly, multi classing is entirely used for concept retrieval. If you want your Fighter to have Fireball, then he can. IT may not be optimal, but it's possible and you can still try to optimize it.
The true hero of 4e are classes. Eventually, I imagine they'll be releasing all sorts of combos that we recognize as PrCs, like the Duskblade, Warmage, Beguiler, etc.
Just have to wait.
Nifft
Penguin Herder
Okay, let's see what we can do with a staff dwarf:
Stocken MacThunderpole, Dwarf Wizard 1
Str: 14
Con: 16 (14 +2 racial)
Dex: 10
Int: 16
Wis: 15 (13 +2 racial)
Cha: 8
Powers:
* Thunderwave (Close blast 3, Int vs. Fort, push back Wis squares)
* Cloud of Daggers (1 square for 1 round, Int vs. Reflex on initial target, Wis damage to those who later pass through)
Feat: Toughness
HP: 31
- - -
Low AC (14), but not terrible for an unarmored dude. We'll fix that next level.
Level 2 feat: Leather armor proficiency (AC 17, including 2nd level bonus).
Level 2 power: Shield (+4 AC and Reflex as an interrupt).
- - -
Level 3's attack power will be either Color Spray or Fire Shroud. The latter is nice because it's a big burst that ignores allies.
- - -
Level 4 gives us a +1 to Int and Wisdom, and a new feat: Hide armor proficiency. So we've gained another +2 AC this level (+2 for half level, +3 for mundane hide armor). Now our AC is 10 +3 Int +3 armor +2 level +1 staff = 19. That's comparable to a 4th level Fighter or Cleric in Chainmail.
- - -
Level 6 feat: Weapon Focus (quarterstaff)? +1 damage, it's nice, whatever. Alternately, one of the spell weapon bonus feats: Dark Fury and Burning Blizzard are both available. If you find you're taking too much damage in combat, Durable (+2 healing surges) is nice, and if you're fighting big critters, Dodge Giants is available. Finally, Expanded Spellbook is great if you don't already have all the spells you want.
- - -
Level 8 feat: See level 6. Also, +1 Int (18 total) and +1 Con (17 total).
- - -
Level 10 feat: See level 6. At level 10, though, you get access to a phenomenal Utility power: Blur. You just plain can't be targeted by foes more than 5 squares away from you.
- - -
Level 11: Paragon time! Your first feat is Dwarven Durability (+2 healing surges, and each surge cures +4 hit points).
Later feats: Armor specialization (hide), Solid Sound, Devastating Critical, and Resounding Thunder would be my picks, but a case could be made for Improved Second Wind or Fleet Footed, too.
- - -
Paragon Paths: There are a couple you could take. Battle Mage is nice, Blood Mage is fine, or you could take the (useless) Fighter multi-class feat and go into Kensei.
It's very possible to build a highly defensive Wizard of the Spiral Tower, but that involves some strategy shifts over the course of your career. Basically, you'd go:
Levels 1-4: Staff Wizard, get armor proficiency (as above)
Levels 6-10: Longsword proficiency, Light shield proficiency, Heavy shield proficiency, and don't actually use any of them yet.
Level 11: Reduce your beloved staff to residuum and pick up a nice Longsword & Shield. Take Armor Specialization (hide), then Dwarven Durability, then catch up on your missing Heroic tier feats: Expanded Spellbook for sure, then possibly Powerful Charge, Durable, Defensive Mobility, Dodge Giants, Burning Blizzard, etc. Consider taking the Ranger multi-class feat if your group has trouble with solo monsters or if boss fights are particularly tough.
- - -
Finally, a sneaky option: take Longsword proficiency, go into Spiral Tower, but keep using your good old staff. You'll save two feats on Shield specialization, and you'll actually qualify for the Epic level Bludgeon Mastery feat (4e's version of Improved Critical for staves), while it would have been impossible for you to qualify for Heavy Blade Mastery.
* * *
That's what I've figured out so far on building a valid blocker & smacker who can also lay down some Arcane smack of his own. There are tons of great Close attack spells (including your at-will Thunderwave), so you don't have to worry about being mobbed -- not for long anyway. He relies only on Str, Con, and Int, with some benefit granted by Wis. This means he can actually keep Strength up while always putting points in Int.
You could do something similar with an Eladrin (10 levels of longsword in one hand, staff in the other), but he'd focus on Dexterity in place of Strength. He'd get +1 attack & damage on his Wizard powers, but his melee damage would be pitiful until 11th level, and he'd be far less durable.
Cheers, -- N
Stocken MacThunderpole, Dwarf Wizard 1
Str: 14
Con: 16 (14 +2 racial)
Dex: 10
Int: 16
Wis: 15 (13 +2 racial)
Cha: 8
Powers:
* Thunderwave (Close blast 3, Int vs. Fort, push back Wis squares)
* Cloud of Daggers (1 square for 1 round, Int vs. Reflex on initial target, Wis damage to those who later pass through)
Feat: Toughness
HP: 31
- - -
Low AC (14), but not terrible for an unarmored dude. We'll fix that next level.
Level 2 feat: Leather armor proficiency (AC 17, including 2nd level bonus).
Level 2 power: Shield (+4 AC and Reflex as an interrupt).
- - -
Level 3's attack power will be either Color Spray or Fire Shroud. The latter is nice because it's a big burst that ignores allies.
- - -
Level 4 gives us a +1 to Int and Wisdom, and a new feat: Hide armor proficiency. So we've gained another +2 AC this level (+2 for half level, +3 for mundane hide armor). Now our AC is 10 +3 Int +3 armor +2 level +1 staff = 19. That's comparable to a 4th level Fighter or Cleric in Chainmail.
- - -
Level 6 feat: Weapon Focus (quarterstaff)? +1 damage, it's nice, whatever. Alternately, one of the spell weapon bonus feats: Dark Fury and Burning Blizzard are both available. If you find you're taking too much damage in combat, Durable (+2 healing surges) is nice, and if you're fighting big critters, Dodge Giants is available. Finally, Expanded Spellbook is great if you don't already have all the spells you want.
- - -
Level 8 feat: See level 6. Also, +1 Int (18 total) and +1 Con (17 total).
- - -
Level 10 feat: See level 6. At level 10, though, you get access to a phenomenal Utility power: Blur. You just plain can't be targeted by foes more than 5 squares away from you.
- - -
Level 11: Paragon time! Your first feat is Dwarven Durability (+2 healing surges, and each surge cures +4 hit points).
Later feats: Armor specialization (hide), Solid Sound, Devastating Critical, and Resounding Thunder would be my picks, but a case could be made for Improved Second Wind or Fleet Footed, too.
- - -
Paragon Paths: There are a couple you could take. Battle Mage is nice, Blood Mage is fine, or you could take the (useless) Fighter multi-class feat and go into Kensei.
It's very possible to build a highly defensive Wizard of the Spiral Tower, but that involves some strategy shifts over the course of your career. Basically, you'd go:
Levels 1-4: Staff Wizard, get armor proficiency (as above)
Levels 6-10: Longsword proficiency, Light shield proficiency, Heavy shield proficiency, and don't actually use any of them yet.
Level 11: Reduce your beloved staff to residuum and pick up a nice Longsword & Shield. Take Armor Specialization (hide), then Dwarven Durability, then catch up on your missing Heroic tier feats: Expanded Spellbook for sure, then possibly Powerful Charge, Durable, Defensive Mobility, Dodge Giants, Burning Blizzard, etc. Consider taking the Ranger multi-class feat if your group has trouble with solo monsters or if boss fights are particularly tough.
- - -
Finally, a sneaky option: take Longsword proficiency, go into Spiral Tower, but keep using your good old staff. You'll save two feats on Shield specialization, and you'll actually qualify for the Epic level Bludgeon Mastery feat (4e's version of Improved Critical for staves), while it would have been impossible for you to qualify for Heavy Blade Mastery.
* * *
That's what I've figured out so far on building a valid blocker & smacker who can also lay down some Arcane smack of his own. There are tons of great Close attack spells (including your at-will Thunderwave), so you don't have to worry about being mobbed -- not for long anyway. He relies only on Str, Con, and Int, with some benefit granted by Wis. This means he can actually keep Strength up while always putting points in Int.
You could do something similar with an Eladrin (10 levels of longsword in one hand, staff in the other), but he'd focus on Dexterity in place of Strength. He'd get +1 attack & damage on his Wizard powers, but his melee damage would be pitiful until 11th level, and he'd be far less durable.
Cheers, -- N
Peter LaCara
Explorer
Here's a character I posted up on RPGnet.
[sblock=Eladrin Fighter/Wizard 11 (Wizard of the Spiral Tower)]
Str 18 Con 11 Dex 16 Int 20 Wis 14 Cha 9
Hp 86 Blood 43
Surge 21 Per Day 9
AC 27 Fort 24 Ref 24 Will 20
Perception +7 Initiative +8 Speed 6
Skills:
Arcana +17 Athletics +13 Endurance +9 Heal +12 History +17
Race:
+5 to save vs. charm
Class:
Combat Challenge
Combat Superiority (+2)
One Handed Weapon Talent
Paragon:
Corellon's Implement (Use a Longsword as a Wand)
Spiral Tower Action (Spend an AP to regain a wizard encounter power)
Feats:
Arcane Initiate
Novice Power
Acolyte Power
Adept Power
Eladrin Soldier
Feywild Protection
Heavy Blade Opportunity (may use an at will power when making opp attacks)
Basic Attacks:
+2 Lifedrinker Longsword +15vAC; 1d8+8
+1 Thunderburst Longbow (20/40) +11vAC; 1d10+4
At Will:
Cleave +15vAC; 1d8+8, 4 dmg to adj enemy
Reaping Strike +15vAC; 1d8+4; 4 dmg on miss
Encounter:
Thunderwave (close blast 3) +12vFort; 1d6+7 thunder and push 2
Spectral Ram (rng 10) +12vFort; 2d10+7 force and push 3
The One Sword +16vRef; 2d8+9 and Sec Atk: +16vWill; dazed (turn) and this power is not expended
Steel Serpent Strike +15vAC; 2d8+8 and slowed and can't shift (turn)
Sweeping Blow (close burst 1) +17vAC; 1d8+8
Daily:
Ice Storm (area burst 3 within 20) +12vFort; 2d8+7 cold and immobilized; half dmg and slowed on miss; Effect: area is difficult terrain until end of encounter
Rain of Steel (minor, stance) Any enemy that starts its turn adj to you takes 1d8+4
Comeback Strike +15vAC; 2d8+8 and you can spend a healing surge
Utility:
Fey Step (encounter, move) teleport 5 and +2 all defs until end of next turn
Blur (daily, minor) +2 to all defs and enemies more than 5 squares away can't see you
Battle Awareness (daily) +10 initiative after roll
No Opening (encounter, interrupt) cancel combat advantage against one opponent
Gear:
Hide Armor +3
Lifedrinker Longsword +2 (gain 5 temp hp when you drop an enemy with it)
Cloak of Resistance +3 (daily, minor: gain resist all 10 until end of next turn)
Light Shield of Defiance (daily, reaction: when an enemy crits you, spend a healing surge)
Thunderburst Longbow +1 (daily, minor: next attack targets fort and deals thunder dmg in burst 1)
760gp[/sblock]
[sblock=Eladrin Fighter/Wizard 11 (Wizard of the Spiral Tower)]
Str 18 Con 11 Dex 16 Int 20 Wis 14 Cha 9
Hp 86 Blood 43
Surge 21 Per Day 9
AC 27 Fort 24 Ref 24 Will 20
Perception +7 Initiative +8 Speed 6
Skills:
Arcana +17 Athletics +13 Endurance +9 Heal +12 History +17
Race:
+5 to save vs. charm
Class:
Combat Challenge
Combat Superiority (+2)
One Handed Weapon Talent
Paragon:
Corellon's Implement (Use a Longsword as a Wand)
Spiral Tower Action (Spend an AP to regain a wizard encounter power)
Feats:
Arcane Initiate
Novice Power
Acolyte Power
Adept Power
Eladrin Soldier
Feywild Protection
Heavy Blade Opportunity (may use an at will power when making opp attacks)
Basic Attacks:
+2 Lifedrinker Longsword +15vAC; 1d8+8
+1 Thunderburst Longbow (20/40) +11vAC; 1d10+4
At Will:
Cleave +15vAC; 1d8+8, 4 dmg to adj enemy
Reaping Strike +15vAC; 1d8+4; 4 dmg on miss
Encounter:
Thunderwave (close blast 3) +12vFort; 1d6+7 thunder and push 2
Spectral Ram (rng 10) +12vFort; 2d10+7 force and push 3
The One Sword +16vRef; 2d8+9 and Sec Atk: +16vWill; dazed (turn) and this power is not expended
Steel Serpent Strike +15vAC; 2d8+8 and slowed and can't shift (turn)
Sweeping Blow (close burst 1) +17vAC; 1d8+8
Daily:
Ice Storm (area burst 3 within 20) +12vFort; 2d8+7 cold and immobilized; half dmg and slowed on miss; Effect: area is difficult terrain until end of encounter
Rain of Steel (minor, stance) Any enemy that starts its turn adj to you takes 1d8+4
Comeback Strike +15vAC; 2d8+8 and you can spend a healing surge
Utility:
Fey Step (encounter, move) teleport 5 and +2 all defs until end of next turn
Blur (daily, minor) +2 to all defs and enemies more than 5 squares away can't see you
Battle Awareness (daily) +10 initiative after roll
No Opening (encounter, interrupt) cancel combat advantage against one opponent
Gear:
Hide Armor +3
Lifedrinker Longsword +2 (gain 5 temp hp when you drop an enemy with it)
Cloak of Resistance +3 (daily, minor: gain resist all 10 until end of next turn)
Light Shield of Defiance (daily, reaction: when an enemy crits you, spend a healing surge)
Thunderburst Longbow +1 (daily, minor: next attack targets fort and deals thunder dmg in burst 1)
760gp[/sblock]
neceros
Adventurer
Ginger, Eladrin Martial Wizard 10
"Do you see the magic bristling down my blade? Feel the power of the Ancients judging you!"
STR 18 +4 HP 64 BLOODIED 32
CON 13 +1 SURGE 16 QTY 7
DEX 12 +1 AC 26 (27 with staff)
INT 20 +5 FORT 21; REF 22; WILL 20
WIS 10 +0
CHA 8 -1
Racial:
+2 DEX +2 INT
+2 Arcana +2 History
Eladrin Education: Pick another skill to be trained in.
Eladrin Weapon Proficiency: Longsword.
Eladrin Will: +1 racial to Will, also +5 racial to saves vs charm.
Fey Origin: Considered Fey.
Trance: Instead of sleep, rest for 4 hours in a trance while being fully aware of your surroundings.
Fey Step: Use Fey Step once encounter.
Class:
Proficiencies: Cloth, Dagger, Quarterstaff
Implement: Staff; +1 to AC; once encounter con mod to ac
Bonus to Defense: +2 Will
Cantrips: Ghost Sound, Light, Mage Hand, Prestidigitation at-will.
Ritual Casting: Gain feat for free.
Spellbook: Gain two Daily or Utility when told to gain 1. Only one may be readied. Gain 3 Rituals for free.
Skills:
Arcana +17, Nature +10, History +17, Diplomacy +9, Athletics +14, Perception +10
Feats:
Eladrin Soldier: +2 damage and proficiency longswords and spears.
Student of the Sword: Gain fighter skill; Once Encounter mark target and gain +1 to attacks for one swing.
Novice Power: Swap a power for a fighter power.
Armor Proficiency Leather.
Armor Proficiency Hide.
Toughness: +5 hp every tier.
Basic Attacks:
Magic Missile: +10 vs Reflex; Ranged 20; One Creature; 2d4+int Force damage.
Longsword: +14 vs AC; Melee; 1d8+str+2 damage; versatile
At-Will:
Magic Missile: +10 vs Reflex; Ranged 20; One Creature; 2d4+int Force damage.
Scorching Burst: +10 vs Reflex; Area Burst 1 in 10; 1d6+int Fire damage.
Encounter:
Burning Hands: +10 vs Reflex; Close blast 5; 2d6+int Fire damage.
Fire Shroud: +10 vs Fortitude; Close Burst 3; 1d8+int Fire damage, ongoing 5.
Iron Bulwark: +14 vs AC; Melee Weapon; 2[w]+str+2 damage; +1 or +2 to AC until end of next turn.
Daily: (Only ready 3 per day)
Sleep: +10 vs Will; Area Burst 2 in 10; Target slowed. If fails save, asleep.
Flaming Sphere: +10 vs Reflex; Ranged 10; One Creature adjacent to sphere; sustain for more damage.
Fireball: +10 vs Reflex; Area Burst 3 in 20; 3d6+int Fire; miss half.
Web: +10 vs Reflex; Area burst 2 in 20; Area immobilized 5 minutes.
Mordenkainen's Sword: +10 vs Reflex; Ranged 10; Conjure a sword to attack enemies for you 1d10+int Force damage; sustain Minor;
Wall of Fire: Area wall 8 in 10; 3d6 or 1d6 Fire damage to adjacent creatures; sustain minor.
Utility: (Only ready 3 per day)
Shield: Immediate Interrupt: +4 power bonus to AC and Reflex to end of next turn.
Feather Fall: Ranged 10; Free Action; fall to ground safely.
Dimension Door: Move Action; Teleport 10 squares.
Invisibility: Ranged 5; Target invisible until end of next turn; sustain standard.
Resistance: Ranged 10; Gain resistance level + int mod 5 minutes from chosen type.
Arcane Gate: Ranged 20; unoccupied squares; those squares teleport to each other; sustained minor.
Rituals:
Pick three first level.
Equipment:
Spellbook, Staff, +3 Magic Hide Armor; +2 Lifedrinker Longsword, +2 Amulet of False Life, 4200 gp
"Do you see the magic bristling down my blade? Feel the power of the Ancients judging you!"
STR 18 +4 HP 64 BLOODIED 32
CON 13 +1 SURGE 16 QTY 7
DEX 12 +1 AC 26 (27 with staff)
INT 20 +5 FORT 21; REF 22; WILL 20
WIS 10 +0
CHA 8 -1
Racial:
+2 DEX +2 INT
+2 Arcana +2 History
Eladrin Education: Pick another skill to be trained in.
Eladrin Weapon Proficiency: Longsword.
Eladrin Will: +1 racial to Will, also +5 racial to saves vs charm.
Fey Origin: Considered Fey.
Trance: Instead of sleep, rest for 4 hours in a trance while being fully aware of your surroundings.
Fey Step: Use Fey Step once encounter.
Class:
Proficiencies: Cloth, Dagger, Quarterstaff
Implement: Staff; +1 to AC; once encounter con mod to ac
Bonus to Defense: +2 Will
Cantrips: Ghost Sound, Light, Mage Hand, Prestidigitation at-will.
Ritual Casting: Gain feat for free.
Spellbook: Gain two Daily or Utility when told to gain 1. Only one may be readied. Gain 3 Rituals for free.
Skills:
Arcana +17, Nature +10, History +17, Diplomacy +9, Athletics +14, Perception +10
Feats:
Eladrin Soldier: +2 damage and proficiency longswords and spears.
Student of the Sword: Gain fighter skill; Once Encounter mark target and gain +1 to attacks for one swing.
Novice Power: Swap a power for a fighter power.
Armor Proficiency Leather.
Armor Proficiency Hide.
Toughness: +5 hp every tier.
Basic Attacks:
Magic Missile: +10 vs Reflex; Ranged 20; One Creature; 2d4+int Force damage. Longsword: +14 vs AC; Melee; 1d8+str+2 damage; versatileAt-Will:
Magic Missile: +10 vs Reflex; Ranged 20; One Creature; 2d4+int Force damage.
Scorching Burst: +10 vs Reflex; Area Burst 1 in 10; 1d6+int Fire damage.
Encounter:
Burning Hands: +10 vs Reflex; Close blast 5; 2d6+int Fire damage.
Fire Shroud: +10 vs Fortitude; Close Burst 3; 1d8+int Fire damage, ongoing 5.
Iron Bulwark: +14 vs AC; Melee Weapon; 2[w]+str+2 damage; +1 or +2 to AC until end of next turn.
Daily: (Only ready 3 per day)
Sleep: +10 vs Will; Area Burst 2 in 10; Target slowed. If fails save, asleep.
Flaming Sphere: +10 vs Reflex; Ranged 10; One Creature adjacent to sphere; sustain for more damage.
Fireball: +10 vs Reflex; Area Burst 3 in 20; 3d6+int Fire; miss half.
Web: +10 vs Reflex; Area burst 2 in 20; Area immobilized 5 minutes.
Mordenkainen's Sword: +10 vs Reflex; Ranged 10; Conjure a sword to attack enemies for you 1d10+int Force damage; sustain Minor;
Wall of Fire: Area wall 8 in 10; 3d6 or 1d6 Fire damage to adjacent creatures; sustain minor.
Utility: (Only ready 3 per day)
Shield: Immediate Interrupt: +4 power bonus to AC and Reflex to end of next turn.
Feather Fall: Ranged 10; Free Action; fall to ground safely.
Dimension Door: Move Action; Teleport 10 squares.
Invisibility: Ranged 5; Target invisible until end of next turn; sustain standard.
Resistance: Ranged 10; Gain resistance level + int mod 5 minutes from chosen type.
Arcane Gate: Ranged 20; unoccupied squares; those squares teleport to each other; sustained minor.
Rituals:
Pick three first level.
Equipment:
Spellbook, Staff, +3 Magic Hide Armor; +2 Lifedrinker Longsword, +2 Amulet of False Life, 4200 gp
Last edited:
Wizard of the Spiral Tower doesn't work
Just a quick note. Lots of our gish characters use the Wizard of the Spiral Tower paragon path. This doesn't work, because p171, your longsword counts as an implement that you've specialized in. However, you can't specialize in an implement unless you're actually a wizard. Wizard training doesn't give you implement specialization.
So I think no gish in 4e. Unless you want a pure wizard with a token melee encounter attack power.
Just a quick note. Lots of our gish characters use the Wizard of the Spiral Tower paragon path. This doesn't work, because p171, your longsword counts as an implement that you've specialized in. However, you can't specialize in an implement unless you're actually a wizard. Wizard training doesn't give you implement specialization.
So I think no gish in 4e. Unless you want a pure wizard with a token melee encounter attack power.
neceros
Adventurer
How else would you define gish?loisel said:
Having been a big gish fan in 3.5, I think it's simply irrelevant in this edition. You don't need to multiclass to gish. Take the feats to give you the abilities you want and use a sword and armor. Take Toughness to get extra hitpoints.
What else involved being half fight? You have to give to be able to receive, and you can't have best of both worlds.
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