Scarred Lands: Ask the Sage

[Nightfall]

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I hope so too. There aren't many things that would make me give up buying scarred land book, if quality stays about this level, but this would be one of them.

I rather see them inventing new place where same gods *might* be known with different names, and perhaps with slightly altered domains. I wouldn't really mind about having mention of some demi-god that used to exist. Well, as long as they don't go recurrecting that one in their next offical meta-plot.

And I hope they use more original ideas, what comes to Asharak (or whatever that continent was named).

We little personal thing I'd like to see in Scarn, is to keep it so, that one can't tell if dragon is good/evil just by of it's color/metallic-hint.


What you think about that Nightfall?

Zelda, I don't think we have to worry about another demi-god coming back. Mostly because I still hold to the idea they won't make Miridum some kind of Mystra. That doesn't leave a lot of KNOWN demi-gods left.

As for them being known by different names, it's possible. After all, the Cabalists have access to the "secret" names of the Gods. So why shouldn't there be more for them to use?

It's Asherak and I'm sure there will be there as well as in Fenrilik, the Frozen Lands.

As for that "metallic good/chromatic bad" thing, I honestly don't know but I do know most people see black dragons as bad things. Virduk is already proving that. But will that always be true? Hard to say. But do understand facing off against dragons in any continent of the Scarred Lands is worthy of an epic these days. Even ones that are just wrack dragons.

 

[Zelda Themelin]

Zelda, I don't think we have to worry about another demi-god coming back. Mostly because I still hold to the idea they won't make Miridum some kind of Mystra. That doesn't leave a lot of KNOWN demi-gods left.

Hehe, I certaily hope not. Mirudum -> Mystara would be for me about most bad thing that could happen to scarn. I sort of dislike strongly the whole concept through my fr-experience with game masters who loved those seven sisters.

Of demi-gods slain, there is of course Haradus, son of Belsameth, slain by slarecians, but that's about known end of it.

About Virduk and dragon flag. Well, dragon is sort of symbol for power and rulership. They are on top as far as species go, after all.
Wasn't that flag in existance before Virduk too? I am not really sure, didn't bother to check what has been written (or changed from what was written earlier). Oh, woudn't any overlord want to have cool symbol, maybe even something stolen from old Ledean days of grory.

Heraldic symbols alone don't really tell so much stories of good or evil.

 

[Nightfall]

Hehe, I certaily hope not. Mirudum -> Mystara would be for me about most bad thing that could happen to scarn. I sort of dislike strongly the whole concept through my fr-experience with game masters who loved those seven sisters.

Of demi-gods slain, there is of course Haradus, son of Belsameth, slain by slarecians, but that's about known end of it.

About Virduk and dragon flag. Well, dragon is sort of symbol for power and rulership. They are on top as far as species go, after all.
Wasn't that flag in existance before Virduk too? I am not really sure, didn't bother to check what has been written (or changed from what was written earlier). Oh, woudn't any overlord want to have cool symbol, maybe even something stolen from old Ledean days of grory.

Heraldic symbols alone don't really tell so much stories of good or evil.

Yeah well I don't see it happening. Miridum MIGHT come back but no way she'll be in complete control of all arcane magic. She might get wizards under her sway but no way she'll ever get any sorcerers under her wing. For myself I'm glad she's dead and she should STAY dead.

Hadraus though we never knew what he did. And then there's that nameless orb god in SLCS: Termana. But I don't think he's coming back either.

I don't believe it was. I believe they had something else in place, but Virduk adopted it as his own. But even then heraldry do tell stories of good or evil. I mean look at the serpents. I mean who else but followers of Mormo would use them as their symbol? Not many. The point is there's an ingrained believe that black dragons are bad. So therefore I don't see that changing.

 

[Zelda Themelin]

I mean who else but followers of Mormo would use them as their symbol? Not many. The point is there's an ingrained believe that black dragons are bad. So therefore I don't see that changing.

Mmh, then again, in monster manual black dragon is chaotic evil, and Virduk is pretty much lawful. So, that's for correct symbolism anyway.

I could as well ask, why would Virduk pick being of chaos to his symbol, maybe because dmg has *black*guards eh?

And who says dragons are creations of Mormo in the first place. They aren't snakes after all. Can't find even kobold in offical list or her creations.

And if all about Mormo is evil, woudn't that mean all dragons are evil, or neutral at best?

But whatever. I've always seen dragons as beings of elements, more than of alignment. In world of dragonlance I see that color/metal hue have sort of mythic history imprortance. I don't see this kind of thing appearing in scarn. Then again, magical lizards are not pointed out to be most important beings in cosmos either.

Whack dragons are another story of course.

In our game dragons weren't created by titans, as neither were slarececians. Those races came elsewhere. Dragons were just so cool and powerful beings of primal elements that titans started copying them. But that's just in our game.

Hehe, well, I don't really care so much what they do with dragons. As long as it is original. And not rip-offs of Dark Sun Dragonkings. I kind of smelled such possiblity in certain template in savage species.

"Do not bring back Mirudum please" is much more important.

Of bringing back business, I still don't see why they called "the Faithful and The Forsaken" that still. There wasn't that forsaken part anymore, after the metaplot event and that all-cure thing they seemingly pushed there too.

It was more like "The Faithful and the Forgiven" to me, or something.

 

[Trickstergod]

For myself I'm glad she's dead and she should STAY dead.

Ahh, now if only that were the case with all the demigods...

Sorry, feeling cantankerous. Expect more cantankerousness sometime soon.

But even then heraldry do tell stories of good or evil. I mean look at the serpents. I mean who else but followers of Mormo would use them as their symbol? Not many. The point is there's an ingrained believe that black dragons are bad. So therefore I don't see that changing.

Real world-wise, the serpent has been associated with healing, not to mention Moses turning his staff into a snake. Then there's also the couatl from the Monster Manual, which, while never given a definitive place in the Scarred Lands, doesn't mean it doesn't exist there in some form. Mormo's also been given associations with healing and being a motherly deity akin to Denev as of late. Perhaps not quite the same, but she's been shown in a relatively more benign light than how she has in past books. In either case, there's plenty of non-Mormo, or non-baleful associations with serpents that could conceivably show up in the Scarred Lands. Not to mention I certainly doubt Virduk would choose a symbol that he related in anyway to Mormo; he worships Chardun, after all.

Considering the supposed rarity of dragons in the Scarred Lands, anyway, it's quite likely most people, even sages and scholars, might have no clue about the moral differences between metallic and chromatic dragons, or that they're divided along those lines in the first place. The dragon and the color black likely came together separately, as opposed to specifically chosen for being a black dragon. Dragon, as a symbol of power and might, black, as an imposing color which one might readily associate with Chardun.

Not to mention I'd imagine outside of the forsaken elves, likely most folk of the Scarred Lands believe most dragons are bad. They're huge, monstrous creatures who exist more in legend than fact. Your average peasant likely wouldn't think much better of a gold dragon than a red one. Or for that matter, even a king, necessarily.

 

[Trickstergod]

Of bringing back business, I still don't see why they called "the Faithful and The Forsaken" that still. There wasn't that forsaken part anymore, after the metaplot event and that all-cure thing they seemingly pushed there too.

It was more like "The Faithful and the Forgiven" to me, or something.

That's because the faithful are the forsaken elves, who never gave up faith even when their god was dead, and arguably epitomized faith in, for the most part, maintaining their faith in the god even after his demise. The forsaken are the charduni, who worship their god arguably about as faithfully as the forsaken elves, but who do not have the love of their god return in kind. Chardun has forsaken the charduni.

The little playing around with the title and just who was being referred to was one of the more amusing points in the book in my opinion. One of the unfortunately few.

Cantanck, cantanck, cantanck.

 

[Zelda Themelin]

That's because the faithful are the forsaken elves, who never gave up faith even when their god was dead, and arguably epitomized faith in, for the most part, maintaining their faith in the god even after his demise. The forsaken are the charduni, who worship their god arguably about as faithfully as the forsaken elves, but who do not have the love of their god return in kind. Chardun has forsaken the charduni.

The little playing around with the title and just who was being referred to was one of the more amusing points in the book in my opinion. One of the unfortunately few.

Cantanck, cantanck, cantanck.

Ah, now I see. That's a good one.
Thanks for insight

Unfortunaly I noticed that book was set 'after metaplot' time-line half-way of reading the book. Doh.

 

[Trickstergod]

Ah, now I see. That's a good one.
Thanks for insight

Unfortunaly I noticed that book was set 'after metaplot' time-line half-way of reading the book. Doh.

No problem.

And, yeah. All I ever do with my freetime is troll around role-playing messageboards, so I knew what to expect out of the Faithful and the Forsaken, but, ahh...yeah. Bleah, bleah, bleah.

All right. I'm done for now, I think.

 

[Nightfall]

Mmh, then again, in monster manual black dragon is chaotic evil, and Virduk is pretty much lawful. So, that's for correct symbolism anyway.

I could as well ask, why would Virduk pick being of chaos to his symbol, maybe because dmg has *black*guards eh?

And who says dragons are creations of Mormo in the first place. They aren't snakes after all. Can't find even kobold in offical list or her creations.

And if all about Mormo is evil, woudn't that mean all dragons are evil, or neutral at best?

But whatever. I've always seen dragons as beings of elements, more than of alignment. In world of dragonlance I see that color/metal hue have sort of mythic history imprortance. I don't see this kind of thing appearing in scarn. Then again, magical lizards are not pointed out to be most important beings in cosmos either.

Whack dragons are another story of course.

In our game dragons weren't created by titans, as neither were slarececians. Those races came elsewhere. Dragons were just so cool and powerful beings of primal elements that titans started copying them. But that's just in our game.

Hehe, well, I don't really care so much what they do with dragons. As long as it is original. And not rip-offs of Dark Sun Dragonkings. I kind of smelled such possiblity in certain template in savage species.

"Do not bring back Mirudum please" is much more important.

Of bringing back business, I still don't see why they called "the Faithful and The Forsaken" that still. There wasn't that forsaken part anymore, after the metaplot event and that all-cure thing they seemingly pushed there too.

It was more like "The Faithful and the Forgiven" to me, or something.

Zelda,

Well I always thought Black Dragons as LE myself. But I dunno. Maybe that will change in the Scarred Lands No idea. I think the reason is more of the image of dragons as you said.

Secondly, when I said serpents I meant SNAKES, not dragons. Thus Mormo is more closely associated with that.

As for what they are, I don't necessarily agree they are creatures of elements but I do think they are closely tied to them yes.

And it's wrack, not whack unless you're just being sarcastic.

In my game they are basically the same deal. The titans didn't create them but I felt the universe did and thus they are more akin to the gods in some respects as well. I'm sure we'll find out sooner or later Zelda.

Agreed about keeping Miridum dead.

Won't really comment on such things as choosing titles but we'll see. I will say though that there are still forsaken elves even with the return of Jandaveos. Just ask Trick.

Trick,

I was talking in an SL context not a real world thing. But I understand the cantankerous reasons you feel. I felt it was the other way around myself. Even with their god and slightly more united, the forsaken elves still have remnants that won't comply with their god for what ever reason. The Charduni might be a little forsaken but I have a feeling Chardun might yet get bored with humans if they don't do more conquering soon.

 

[HonJull]

You guys keep talking about a god that was ressurected, but I haven't seen that in my readings yet. Where is there more information on that, and is there an actual moduel to make it happen in your campaigns if you want?