Should EL (and XP) be adjusted for player's actions?

[Dr_Rictus]

Now, I do understand if an encounter is overcome with diplomacy (for example) and aren't in any kind of danger, no, there shouldn't be full xp.

If there wasn't any kind of danger, then you aren't "overcoming" anything. If there is, it doesn't matter whether you overcome it with diplomacy or fireballs, you get the XP.

 

[Nail]

If there wasn't any kind of danger, then you aren't "overcoming" anything. If there is, it doesn't matter whether you overcome it with diplomacy or fireballs, you get the XP.

Absolutely!

PCs get XP for overcoming challenges -- the method of over-coming the challenge is irrelevant!

For example, if the PCs are able to fast-talk and pass the Half-fiend Troll Barbarian/Ranger guarding the gates of the Castle Blackhope ....well, then: they get XP for the Troll!

The only time I might be tempted to modify the XP is if the PCs used some sort of proxy. (Shrug)

 

[Matafuego]

I don't fully agree with the "good tactics don't mean less experience" although for different motives. I agree that, for example in the owlbear case, the party should be awarded full xp but IF after that fight they decide to go and hunt owlbears using the same tactics, for me it means they gain less and less experience than in the first place. Even more, if one day they go face to face melee with an owlbear I wouldn't give them the full xp of the owlbear neither (if they could use a proven tactic that worked but instead decided to charge for instance).
To sum up I feel xp should be handed out based on the difficulty of the encounter and on the known tactics of the group. (A proven tactic gives less and less xp, a new tactic gives full xp unless an old tactic could've done the trick, that is to say you do not gain full xp for "chaging tactics")
I don't agree with the CR system but that's another point.

 

[The Grackle]

Instead of just sitting and waiting for it to come to us, we split up and used ranged attacks while the wizard summoned creatures in it's way. We didn't take any damage at all, while we got it down to only a couple of hit points and it ran away.

You're DM is a fool.
Owlbears don't run away.

 

[Beholder Bob]

I give out xp for the EL, not the CR. If you meet goblins in a cave, they with good cover and missile weapons, you with at least a few rounds running through cave & getting pelted as you climb up, I'd treat it as a tougher (& therefore higher xp) encounter. The reverse is also true. If the PC's placed themselves high in alcoves and waited for a creature to blunder in, then pelt it while it struggles to get to them, less xp. The extreme version is a fighter on a flying carpet shooting a t-rex w/ his bow. No risk, no xp. If PCs come up with awesome tactics on the spot that neutralizes the threat, full xp. Using the tried and true method w/ little or no risk gets little or no xp. Just using the CR allows some outrageous encounters, such as fighting a white dragon while standing on a glacier (roll dex rolls each round or fall prone). This, I should think, is worth higher xp then fighting a grounded dragon backed up in a cave.

Then again, creatures should have 2 levels of CR. Standard encounter/ranged encounter. Fighting a T-rex at range, even if he can run up to you in a few rounds, lessens his risk greatly, while the new arrow demon should have a higher CR for ranged combat then when forced close to his foes. And dragons… a dragon able to fly is far more dangerous then the same dragon grounded.

In response to the initial question - no extra xp. On the spot plan went awry, but the encounter difficulty changed due to actions taken. If it had worked, I'd have award the same xp for defeating the entire encounter easily.

BB

 

[Lord Pendragon]

Using the tried and true method w/ little or no risk gets little or no xp.

Well, I don't run my game this way. There are only a finite number of effective tactics in the game, and only a finite number of monster types. If I gave diminishing returns to any tactic used successfully once vs. a particular type of threat, the PCs would be earning next to nothing by 8th-level. And really, it doesn't seem right to give the PCs less xp for using a proven tactic, but also less xp for not using that proven tactic. There's no way to win.

I also give xp based on EL. But it's based on the EL at the time I create the encounter. Once the PCs make contact, the xp is locked, and how the PCs defeat the encounter is up to them.

 

[Mouseferatu]

Personally, I avoid this problem entirely. In my campaigns, I give XP entirely as story awards, roleplaying awards, and awards for good ideas and problem-solving, rather than from specific encounters. Seems to work out pretty well for my groups, but I know it's not to everyone's taste.

 

[Jhulae]

If there wasn't any kind of danger, then you aren't "overcoming" anything. If there is, it doesn't matter whether you overcome it with diplomacy or fireballs, you get the XP.

Actually, I agree with this, don't get me wrong.

But, I think there is something in the DMG about altering exp if the encounter is easy (i.e., it was always meant to be overcome with diplomacy and the party was in no real danger, etc.)

Anyway, I'm still with the full exp for an encounter, no more, no less.

 

[Jhulae]

You're DM is a fool.

Agreed.

Owlbears don't run away.

But, if it didn't, he wouldn't have been able to screw us out of xp.

 

[Jhulae]

Personally, I avoid this problem entirely. In my campaigns, I give XP entirely as story awards, roleplaying awards, and awards for good ideas and problem-solving, rather than from specific encounters. Seems to work out pretty well for my groups, but I know it's not to everyone's taste.

I actually think that's a very good way of giving out exp, but I tend to think (my opinion anyawy) that you can't have random encounters then.

If the exp for the adventure is Y, and a random encounter happens that's very tough for the players, also resulting in Y, what happens then? Do you stick with your original plan or give them double what you'd intended?

And, if you have 'travel' encounters (when most partys hit random encounters, during travel) planned into the adventure, then they're not 'random encounters'.

So, while I do agree that story based awards are a good way to go, it tends to not fit with rolling encounters per the DMG.

Regardless, based on the discussion, xp shouldn't be added or subtracted.

Another thing to look at based on the initial scenario is this. An 11th level sorcerer (for example) would provide the same xp when defeated whether or not he uses attack spells or summoning spells. Same with outsiders. They provide a certain xp whether they're able to summon other outsiders or not.

I don't see the initial case as being any different.