Hi all,
Apologies in advance for (temporarily) preempting the Bo9S discussion with a few Abyssal inquiries ....
It is my understanding that:
1. Outsiders (and I'm thinking of the Demons of the Abyss) have the extraplanar subtype when visiting the Material type, but lose the subtype when withing the Abyss.
From SRD:
2. Manes (and some other minor demons) (Fiendish Codex I) are the souls of Material plane petitioners who have died and wound up in the abyss. Since Manes are outsiders, death for them follows the above rule.
The flavor text in FCI indicates that higher demons are formed from the stuff of the abyss (though mortals can make pacts with Demon Lords to become a higher demon upon death) And that demons who die while 'extraplanar' are demoted / punished / etc.
My point is this ... the punishing of these reborn demons and the torture of the Manes must be well controlled (and I assume that Demons would be experts on this) since inflicting too much lethal damage would result in "no more demon without serious juju."
Still, this doesn't sit very well with me since I hate to imagine some 10HD demonic monstrosity intentionally inflicting subdual damage.
I realize this is much more a question of interpretation, but perhaps I've overlooked a rule (as opposed to needing to houserule.)
A possible solution might be that the lowest tier of demon (Manes et al.) is essentially immortal and that the first step of punishing a higher-tiered demon would be to transform them into a Mane.
Any advice on how other folks are handling this is appreciated.
Happy Gaming
Apologies in advance for (temporarily) preempting the Bo9S discussion with a few Abyssal inquiries ....
It is my understanding that:
1. Outsiders (and I'm thinking of the Demons of the Abyss) have the extraplanar subtype when visiting the Material type, but lose the subtype when withing the Abyss.
From SRD:
assuming that #1 is correct ...
2. Manes (and some other minor demons) (Fiendish Codex I) are the souls of Material plane petitioners who have died and wound up in the abyss. Since Manes are outsiders, death for them follows the above rule.
The flavor text in FCI indicates that higher demons are formed from the stuff of the abyss (though mortals can make pacts with Demon Lords to become a higher demon upon death) And that demons who die while 'extraplanar' are demoted / punished / etc.
My point is this ... the punishing of these reborn demons and the torture of the Manes must be well controlled (and I assume that Demons would be experts on this) since inflicting too much lethal damage would result in "no more demon without serious juju."
Still, this doesn't sit very well with me since I hate to imagine some 10HD demonic monstrosity intentionally inflicting subdual damage.
I realize this is much more a question of interpretation, but perhaps I've overlooked a rule (as opposed to needing to houserule.)
A possible solution might be that the lowest tier of demon (Manes et al.) is essentially immortal and that the first step of punishing a higher-tiered demon would be to transform them into a Mane.
Any advice on how other folks are handling this is appreciated.
Happy Gaming
