Sins of Our Fathers - 2/10 - Final Update

[Seule]

To review:

[1] I won't skip portions of the story.
[2] I will attempt to better share the POV amongst the party members.

To be clear, I commented on [1], and this applies to [2] as well: Don't stop doing these things, just make sure not to overdo them. Or in the case of [2], the reverse.
The first time you skipped something and covered it after the fact it was cool. Just don't do it too much, and we'll all be happy.
Okay, we're all happy anyway. We'll be even happier. Whee!

--Seule

 

[Destan]

If you're here, it means you're reading about a group of PC's who are adventuring around Ostia Prim.

Would you like to be one?

I'm conducting a little experiement and will be running a Play-by-Post game here on ENWorld. I'm looking for players. The info may be found here:


The Sins of Our Fathers PbP Game

Any questions or comments should be addressed to me via email or on that thread; let's not clutter this one with PbP stuff.

Enjoy the last of your weekend!
D

 

[neg]

Feedback

First off Destan, new readers do come to your story hour. I found your post in the “Pimp your SH” thread on the General Discussion board. I just finished all of the posts and was dismayed to learn that I caught up so quickly to your current postings. I was intrigued by the feedback you listed especially PC’s comments that you can write.

You can, and very well at that.

You also have a good group of players it would seem to me. Most of their characters are drawn deeply and boldly. I think Vath is a wonderful creation and his worship of Illmater makes him utterly unique in his love to both give and receive misery. John of Pell is a particular favorite of mine, and I think yours as he often leads us through the story. Kellus intrigues me greatly with his off/on faith and stark view of what life has to offer us all. Baden catches my attention with his deliberate range of emotions. His anger I can feel from your writing. His confusion and rage is evident. Raylin is a more calm and collected individual, a loner type, and less rounded in description than the others. Ameylssan is the least fleshed out character in my opinion. I would especially like to hear more from Raylin and Amelyssan in future posts, I think most of us would. I would like to read what they think about each other and the situation they find themselves in.

All in all, your characters/players allow for a nice beginning to your stories. They are varied and seem to have similar and differing motivations that allow your creativity to flourish.

As a writer you talent is obvious to us all. You pace well. You can dramatize a situation without going over the top, or making it campy. You draw the personality of the characters and of your world in descriptive, image evoking phrases that leave lasting impressions on your readers minds and hearts. You make us care, and pull forth emotions for the good AND the bad guys. Your world is gritty and appeals to those that like that material.

Too gritty? Hardly…If someone thinks it is, they need to go back and read the Iliad. There is a book that is moist with all the fluids that surface in a battle. You need not fear you are pushing the envelope. I argue that you are not pushing it far enough….

Why?

You are a natural storyteller. There are many writers out there, but very few solid storytellers.

I work for a large New York publisher that has an imprint that publishes large amounts of Science Fiction/Fantasy. It is Tor books and we publish Robert Jordan. I want to make it clear that I don’t work in New York, I am not a writer, I am not an editor, I am not a publisher, and I am not in marketing. I am a book sales representative for my territory in Minnesota. I call on bookstores in my area and pitch them the latest and greatest books each season. As such I read A LOT of material in order to be prepared to speak intelligently on the material I am selling. I have read countless poor writers, and but a handful of actual storytellers. I am in the midst of preparing for my next season, and I am reading reams of material to prepare. But I had to finish your SH, it kept calling me back, it was that good.

My only critique is the SH is episodic. We need time to see you stretch the story over several installments to see how you can carry the plot, and keep us coming back for more. This leads me to my next inquiry.

As I read your story hour, you mentioned early on that you had been working on a novel or had completed one. If that is the case, I would be curious to know your plans for it. Is it a stand alone, or part of a longer series? Is it based on your RPG? Is it even fantasy? I would be interested in knowing. I would also encourage you, if you are truly serious, to get an agent, and get your book submitted for publication to a large fantasy house (if it is fantasy). You do have what it takes to carry a novel. You could use guidance and a good editor, but your starting point is so far beyond many of the published authors that I read now that I think you would receive serious consideration. You would also not have to be hamstrung by the concern that your audience would be offended by your writing. A novel would allow you the creative freedom that I see you craving in you non-SH posts.

This is an honest opinion of someone who has been in bookselling/publishing for eleven years now. But I am still a small cog in the larger machine that is publishing. If you are serious, I can offer some guidance and point you in a few directions. I wouldn’t have an agent in mind, but I can point you to publishers who would best be able to publish and more importantly market your work.

If you want to talk about this by email, feel free to drop me a note, otherwise you can post here. I will be back. Sorry for the long post.

Take or leave this as you see fit. I am a lurker who finds little time to read, and less to post. I just felt compelled to write you something as a form of encouragement and thanks. Continue to push yourself, keep growing, keep thinking and turning over idea, but mainly just keep writing.

Best-

Neg

John Edwards

P.S. On your recommendation, Seph’s story hour is next.

 

[Destan]

If you want to talk about this by email, feel free to drop me a note, otherwise you can post here. I will be back.

John -

Thanks for the post, the comments, and the advice. It's all appreciated. I'll be sending you an email shortly, but thought I might post portions of information that may be applicable to other writers who happen upon this thread.

About eight years ago I finished my first novel. I sent out a number of form letters to various, reputable literary agencies. An agent contacted me within a week, I signed a two-book contract, and we (read: they) began to market my work. How easy it was! I thought - 'Why the hell didn't I do this earlier?' Soon, I thought, I would be rubbing elbows with Stephen King and giving Dutch-rubs to John Grisham.

At my agent's recommendation, I immediately began to write the sequel.

Newsflash: Don't write a sequel to an unpublished book - not unless you are ready to do so.

My little story, though it starts with such promise, ends on a different note. My agent could not find a willing publisher. Oh, a few companies liked the book, but they said it'd never sell. One publishing house said they would take a 'very serious second look' at my novel if - and only if - I would rewrite the story and add a significant female heroine. It's a testament to my lack of artistic dignity that I made the attempt. I failed. I found that I just couldn't write something that I didn't, well, enjoy writing.

Alas, by that time, my real life work (military pilot) heated up and I put aside my keyboard for other issues.

Eventually my agent conceded defeat. The sequel was about 70% finished at that time. It remains 70% finished now, eight or more years later. The contract has ended.

And, you know what? Those books didn't deserve to be published. They weren't that well written. I'm not being modest; I'm being honest. Ask a couple of my friends and players - they've read those books, or portions thereof.

A couple lessons learned from this whole experience that may be applicable to other writers:

1) Finding an agent is infinitely easier than finding a publisher.

2) Your story may be publishable but not marketable, and hence will never see the light of a book store. You may have written the Best Book of Collected Rodent Recipes, but if there's no customer base for that sort of thing, you're outta luck.

3) If you think you've written a good story, set it aside and come back to it months down the road. Then read it. And be honest. I've found this allows me to see what I've written as opposed to what I intended. It works the same way with earlier updates on this story hour. When I wrote them, I liked them, yet - now - I see how I could have changed things to make them significantly better. Writing is re-writing.

Ok, I'm leaping off my soapbox now. Thanks for reading.

D

 

[gerg_861]

ACK! Already current with this SH, and I only had to put off 2 days worth of homework to do it! Really though, incredible writing. I've quit reading the Forgotten Realms book that I was reading and began over the past 2 weeks only read SHs and yours is my favorite so far. When I read something of the caliber that you have written I truly bemoan the hours that I spent reading about a certain absurd dark elf. If you still want any criticism I can only say that I wish I had a better mental picture of some of the characters, for example I don't know off the top of my head more than the fact that Vath is in dire need of a dermatologist and that Jon needs some "Just for Men". Thanks for all the time that you've put into this SH!

 

[Piratecat]

You do such a good job writing from memory, I can't wait to see what happens when reality sneaks in. Go update!

 

[Dakkareth]

On a somewhat related note - do new readers come along when story hours are this far advanced? I know, personally, it was somewhat intimidating to dive into story hours that include so many updates. Piratecat's excellent tale could (and should) encompass four to five novels!

Actually for me it's usually the opposite - if a story hour consists only of a few posts, there's no time to get to know the characters, get a glimpse of a meaningful story and even, if it is outstanding, it's still too short and many SHs are discontinued after a short time. Yours is an obvious exception to this 'rule' of mine, but with the well-deserved praise being sung up and down the board even in the early stages I figured, I couldn't be wrong here - and I wasn't.

That said I'll go back to reading up on the events of the last few weeks - being away from the SH forum for several weeks and then returning is like opening presents on Christmas - so many new updates


Edit:

This last part was outstanding. Not only do we get a look on some of the bad guys and on how bad exactly they are, we also get to see them cut down with contempt and drama. Finally a truly epic conclusion to the matter of Poridel's fate - or rather a resolution to 'make them pay'. The description Baden's anger was great as was the thought behind it - it felt as if I was there.

On the matter of mature themes I have to say, that I'm a big fan of Steven Erikson, of whose books your SH reminds me somewhat in its graphic description of both terrible violence and profoundly humane feelings. It is far from me to be appalled at the exploring of dark themes or gore as it is no goal in itself, but serves to show the whole picture of reality.

[1] I won't skip portions of the story.
[2] I will attempt to better share the POV amongst the party members.
[3] I won't change the writing style or the tone of the story hour.
[4] I'll stop being overly self-conscious regarding the mature theme.

 

[Destan]

Already current with this SH, and I only had to put off 2 days worth of homework to do it!

Nothing gives me more pleasure than knowing I'm causing students to falter in their studies. Down with academia! Muwahahha!

You do such a good job writing from memory, I can't wait to see what happens when reality sneaks in.

I think, when it's all said and done, I'll have liked doing it from my faltering memory as opposed to reality. Much easier to mold the story that way. Now I'll have to be...honest. Ugh.

...and many SHs are discontinued after a short time. Yours is an obvious exception...

I bet some folks were beginning to wonder if, indeed, this story hour had any life left.

Well, my loyal readers (because if you're here reading this after such a long hiatus, then I'll forevermore count you as 'loyal'), a lot has happened since we last saw Raylin throwing down his Entangle spell. Both in-game and out-of-game.

Let's start with the latter. I had started a little play-by-post experiment. It was, alas, short-lived. This is because I recently received a contract offer to develop Ostia Prim into a d20 supplement. My writing time, as it is, will now be largely devoted to that endeavor.

A couple things that might preempt any questions you might now have:

1) I'd rather not get into the details of the proposed contract. I'm not sure if I'm allowed to do so, and nothing's been finalized as of this posting.

2) After some soul-searching, I've decided that I'd very much like to continue this story hour. Updates may be infrequent (or they may not). I'm just not sure how things will progress.

3) EN World has made this situation possible. And EN World is you. I am not so blind as to not realize that fact. I sincerely appreciate each and every one of you who have stumbled upon this thread and read it - either in one sitting or in several. If I can utilize the immense creativity and talents of you cats in this contractual thing, I would love to do so.

Thanks for sticking with this thing. I'll do my best to get a good, bloody story hour update on these boards within the next couple days.

D

 

[Len]

Congratulations, Destan! It's great to get a paying gig out of this, even if it means less Story Hour for us.

 

[Avarice]

I think, when it's all said and done, I'll have liked doing it from my faltering memory as opposed to reality. Much easier to mold the story that way. Now I'll have to be...honest. Ugh.

D

Nonsense! Lie to us as much as you like, so long as you continue to do it well.

I bet some folks were beginning to wonder if, indeed, this story hour had any life left.

Well, my loyal readers (because if you're here reading this after such a long hiatus, then I'll forevermore count you as 'loyal'), a lot has happened since we last saw Raylin throwing down his Entangle spell. Both in-game and out-of-game.

Let's start with the latter. I had started a little play-by-post experiment. It was, alas, short-lived. This is because I recently received a contract offer to develop Ostia Prim into a d20 supplement. My writing time, as it is, will now be largely devoted to that endeavor.

A couple things that might preempt any questions you might now have:

1) I'd rather not get into the details of the proposed contract. I'm not sure if I'm allowed to do so, and nothing's been finalized as of this posting.

2) After some soul-searching, I've decided that I'd very much like to continue this story hour. Updates may be infrequent (or they may not). I'm just not sure how things will progress.

3) EN World has made this situation possible. And EN World is you. I am not so blind as to not realize that fact. I sincerely appreciate each and every one of you who have stumbled upon this thread and read it - either in one sitting or in several. If I can utilize the immense creativity and talents of you cats in this contractual thing, I would love to do so.

Thanks for sticking with this thing. I'll do my best to get a good, bloody story hour update on these boards within the next couple days.

D

Wow, congratulations Destan. Guess I'll be adding one more product to my 'must buy' list!