Sleep + Coup De Grace

[ForbidenMaster]

The sleep keyword means that any monster immune to sleep is immune to the sleep spell and other future spells that have the sleep keyword, but not all effects that cause you to become unconscious.

So just from a quick look through of the MM, Constructs would be immune to sleep, but would be effected normaly by a rogues Knockout.

Also, note that the only two class powers that make a character become unconscious besides sleep, dont have the sleep keyword and both explicetly state that the unconscious character wakes up if it takes damage. IMO this gives even more evidence to the fact that the sleep spell, or more specifically any power with the sleep keyword, is magical sleep that can only be broken with a save.

 

[MeMeMeMe]

The effect of Sleep is the condition unconscious, and the power tells you the way that you escape from this condition (you make a save). Slapping doesn't help, and neither does being hit.

The Heal skill allows someone to make a saving throw, so maybe a slap would work - a gentle, healing slap
If heal can wake someone up, maybe being hit has a similar effect - granting a saving throw.

 

[hamishspence]

healing Slap

Hmm: condition: Hysterical: slap: allows person to make a saving throw. Nice. Remember in Star trek when Spock once needed slapping to cur e his medical problem? I see no problem with doing it that way.

That said, might be fair, in such cases (any cases) that coup-de-grace still has to hit to activate, as the rules seem to suggest. Maybe with overpowered sleep, coup-de-grace actually having to roll to hit the target (who has a big AC penalty) is not such as bad rule after all.