Sleeping in armor?

[2eBladeSinger]

It wouldn't be a variant rule to rule that characters can't sleep in their armor, it would be filling in the gaps, adjudication, etc. The RAW don't cover everything, DMs need to use common sense. (Speaking of, did anyone notice that it doesn't forbid characters from swimming in their armor either? - at least not that I saw in the PHB).

There's nothing wrong with penalizing players, the game is all about that. It's called a challenge. It seems that some are concerned that not allowing PCs to sleep in armor penalizes defenders most... it does, but that's ok. That's a drawback to armor, you can and do have to take it off sometimes, it's not a built-in thing.

Personally, I'd let a PC sleep in his armor once if he felt he had to, doing nothing mechanically, but making him aware of aches and pains. If he wanted to do it again, endurance check DC15 and +5 for every successive night. Fail the check, either take it off or don't recover.

 

[Spido]

There's nothing wrong with penalizing players, the game is all about that. It's called a challenge. It seems that some are concerned that not allowing PCs to sleep in armor penalizes defenders most... it does, but that's ok. That's a drawback to armor, you can and do have to take it off sometimes, it's not a built-in thing.

Again, what's the *goal* for creating a rule to fill in this gap? Realism? Logic? If this is the case, we've go A LOT of work to do with 4e.

What are the drawbacks to a game for letting a character sleep in armor? Does it somehow give armor-wearers an unfair advantage? Does it cripple the DM's plots if the party isn't more vulnerable while resting?

What is the real problem that needs to be solved here with a house rule?

-Spido

 

[Surgoshan]

(Speaking of, did anyone notice that it doesn't forbid characters from swimming in their armor either? - at least not that I saw in the PHB).

Swimming is an athletics check, which is a physical skill and therefor takes an armor check penalty for heavy armors.

 

[ProfessorCirno]

Again, what's the *goal* for creating a rule to fill in this gap? Realism? Logic? If this is the case, we've go A LOT of work to do with 4e.

What are the drawbacks to a game for letting a character sleep in armor? Does it somehow give armor-wearers an unfair advantage? Does it cripple the DM's plots if the party isn't more vulnerable while resting?

What is the real problem that needs to be solved here with a house rule?

-Spido

You don't always just houserule out problems. You also houserule in flavor or mechanics you enjoy.

I don't think this is centered on realism or logic, although those definately play a role. I think it's more "We have an armor penalty, so let's USE it." Honestly, you're same logic could just as easily be applied to armor penalty itself. Or many other things in the game.

It's not always about pure balance.

 

[lukelightning]

I don't see anything wrong with people sleeping in armor. Unlike me, even a level 1 fighter is a battle-hardened trooper who can put up with all sorts of discomfort without adversity.

Me? Sleeping outside would probably eat up all my healing surges.

I think that if you must impose a penalty, then the use of the endurance skill, mentioned earlier, is the best solution. Level 26, almost a demigod, and you still can't sleep in your armor?

 

[Falstaff]

I'm curious - if it isn't important to know if a character has his armor on at a specific time, why do the rules tell us it takes 5 minutes to put on armor?

 

[burntgerbil]

My group was set to have a penalty imposed for sleeping in any armor - so I placed a quick call to customer service to see if the rule was accidentally left out.

They Service rep was very nice and he told me that there are no rules that prohibit sleeping in armor. I countered with the 5 minute-to-put-on argument and he went to go check with some other service reps. In less than a minute he came back and told me that the intention was to not impose a penalty for sleeping in armor - there is not penalty to sleeping in your armor and that is why it was not in the books.

 

[JoeBlank]

I'm curious - if it isn't important to know if a character has his armor on at a specific time, why do the rules tell us it takes 5 minutes to put on armor?

PCs walk into a room, kill the bad guys and take their stuff. They are being followed by more bad guys. The fighter wants to put on the fancy new armor they found in the room. Can he put it on before the next group of bad guys catches up to the PCs?

 

[Yaezakura]

The rules tell us it takes 5 minutes to put on armor to reinforce the idea that characters can't switch armors mid-fight. So, you can't fell a monster, swipe his +1 armor and change it out for your mundane armor and continue the fight. It simply takes too long, as you generally have multiple layers, belts and buckles to fasten, etc.

But as to the penalty... I don't see a need for it. Sleeping in armor isn't a big deal, especially once you're used to it. And one would assume the time a character spent growing proficient in the use of armor would cover "getting used to it". Sorta like how sleeping in a sleeping bag is very uncomfortable for someone who's never done it, but a seasoned camper feels as rested from it as from a nice, cozy bed. Even plate armor, if you've been wearing it for months or years, eventually becomes as natural to you as a second skin. You're aware of the limitations it imposes on your movement, but you've long forgotten any notions of discomfort that wearing it causes.

 

[Byronic]

My group was set to have a penalty imposed for sleeping in any armor - so I placed a quick call to customer service to see if the rule was accidentally left out.

They Service rep was very nice and he told me that there are no rules that prohibit sleeping in armor. I countered with the 5 minute-to-put-on argument and he went to go check with some other service reps. In less than a minute he came back and told me that the intention was to not impose a penalty for sleeping in armor - there is not penalty to sleeping in your armor and that is why it was not in the books.

Ease > Common Sense

If this disturbs you you can always wing it. And if the players complain that it wasn't in the rules simply say that its common sense not to sleep in armour.

Perhaps Endurance check with armour check penalty. +5 per day. Make the first one something a Heroic character should be able to do.

Now that we're talking about armour check penalties, they are a bit ridiculous. Plate Mail = -2. It's hardly worth noticing. Especially in comparison with the -6/7 penalty in 3.x where the average scores were lower as well.

We might as well admit that the ones amongst us who don't like 4ed emphasis on ease and balance might as well just put some of the elements from 3.x into 4.0. After exploring the game with a chronicle I might do just that.

Starting with importing the price list from 3.x The one in 4.0 is a bit empty. Or just discuss it with my players.