Smasher

[Terwox]

2[W] + 15 at level 30, as an at-will, is nothing close to 7[W] dailies with bonus effects.

Terribly underpowered I'm afraid. Neat idea but it will likely take a lot of work to be competitive, and I doubt it will see much use -- there are ten year olds playing 4E as-is right now.

 

[Verdande]

Although I applaud your efforts and ambition, I don't think I've ever heard anybody say that 4e is too complex.

 

[ideasmith]

Well, I'm taking into account their strengths, actually. That they can run right through difficult

terrain makes sense from a "reducing the thinking" point of view (although I might require a running start to fit the

"momentum" idea). But running right through any enemy squares with no restriction means they right right up and kill

the spellcaster. It's good to have a simplified character class, but tactical movement is so important to everyone

else in the game that having this character just ignore it is really strong.

You've convinced me. The ability to move through enemies is on the 'remove' list. A 'no attack roll penalties for

running' ability will make at least a partial replacement.

On the subject of paragon paths and multiclassing: I actually don't think it should have those.

Instead, it should have a way to completely convert the character to another martial-power character class —

presumably after eight levels or so of this the player is going to be ready for more.

Or possibly both? Yes, some players will be ready for more. Others might not.

2[W] + 15 at level 30, as an at-will, is nothing close to 7[W] dailies with bonus effects.

Terribly underpowered I'm afraid. Neat idea but it will likely take a lot of work to be competitive, and I doubt it

will see much use -- there are ten year olds playing 4E as-is right now.

An at-will power that was anything close to a similar level daily would be way overpowerful.

 

[mattdm]

Or possibly both? Yes, some players will be ready for more. Others might not.

It should at least be strongly encouraged.

 

[ideasmith]

Although I applaud your efforts and ambition, I don't think I've ever heard anybody say that 4e is too complex.

Ease of play is, while related, not the same thing as complexity. The concern here is that all of the classes have a list of options to deal with. Some players prefer not to deal with that.

It should at least be strongly encouraged.

Something I should have mentioned earlier (sorry): Your 'completely convert character' idea is the main shtick of another class I am working on. If I added it to the Smasher, it might be a difficult to keep them from stepping on each others toes.

 

[Tehnai]

I understand your desire to make such a class, although I don't share it myself. But see it this way:

While at level 15, all other characters are doing awesome things, having deep tactics and actually thinking before they do stuff (thus the intellectual pleasure of dungeon-y violence), this guy is just running up to the bad guy, smashing, getting in one or two hits and getting his ass kicked. Really really hard.

Plus, doing the same 3 attacks, with almost no possible variation, for 30 levels (so, like, 2-ish years) is going to be mighty boring in the long run.

Your average kobold minion squad will make this guy jelly in 2 rounds (he won't kill more then 1-2). I mean, I can imagine the kobolds going : OMG THAT GUY IS INSANE! Focus fire, you scrawny lizards!. And boom, 30+ Hp won't be that useful if you can't keep it for 2 rounds.

I honestly don't see this class as neither viable, nor really fun or useful. It does less damage then non-striker classes, dies really really fast, and as no other use.

Okay, sure, it can daze... but still.

 

[mattdm]

Something I should have mentioned earlier (sorry): Your 'completely convert character' idea is the main shtick of another class I am working on. If I added it to the Smasher, it might be a difficult to keep them from stepping on each others toes.

Hmmm. If it's a morph-in-and-out sorta class, interesting. For a one-time conversion, though, I'm actually very strongly in support of allowing any player who wants to do it to be able to. (See this post — although also, I'd allow someone who really wanted to do it to retrain their ability scores initially so they can qualify for the multiclassing feat in the first place. I should probably add that to the post.) So I'm not suggesting that this would be a unique ability of the class, just that it'd be strongly encouraged.

 

[ideasmith]

I understand your desire to make such a class, although I don't share it myself. But see it this way:

While at level 15, all other characters are doing awesome things, having deep tactics and actually thinking before

they do stuff (thus the intellectual pleasure of dungeon-y violence), this guy is just running up to the bad guy,

smashing, getting in one or two hits and getting his ass kicked. Really really hard.

The whole point behind this class is that not everybody wants to think before they do stuff. You enjoy that, but not

everybody does.

Plus, doing the same 3 attacks, with almost no possible variation, for 30 levels (so, like, 2-ish

years) is going to be mighty boring in the long run.

Different people get bored by different things. I don't doubt that you would get bored. I am not sure whether I would

get bored. I am sure that not everybody would get bored. (I gather that you are assuming a human or half-elven

smasher.)

Your average kobold minion squad will make this guy jelly in 2 rounds (he won't kill more then 1-2). I

mean, I can imagine the kobolds going : OMG THAT GUY IS INSANE! Focus fire, you scrawny lizards!. And boom, 30+ Hp

won't be that useful if you can't keep it for 2 rounds.

How do the other strikers avoid this problem? If smashers can't avoid it the same way, then a fix is indeed needed.

I honestly don't see this class as neither viable, nor really fun or useful. It does less damage then

non-striker classes, dies really really fast, and as no other use.

Okay, sure, it can daze... but still.

While the smashers maximum damage is indeed less, the smasher gets to use that maximum a lot more often.

Hmmm. If it's a morph-in-and-out sorta class, interesting.

In fact, it is a play-now-choose-your-class-later sorta class. Think Garion in the earlier parts

of Pawn of Prophecy, or Bilbo Baggins in the earlier parts of The Hobbit.

For a one-time conversion, though, I'm actually very strongly in support of allowing any player who

wants to do it to be able to. (See this post — although also, I'd allow someone who really

wanted to do it to retrain their ability scores initially so they can qualify for the multiclassing feat in the first

place. I should probably add that to the post.) So I'm not suggesting that this would be a unique ability of the

class, just that it'd be strongly encouraged.

I get what you're saying now, and thanks for the link.

That is something to consider.