So...anything on Craft?

[Jack99]

I'm going to assume that since 4e was designed with a very different playstyle in mind, that "my way" isn't very common.

That's odd. I run my prep/campaigns exactly like you described (except for the fudging of rolls), and I think that 4e is tailor made for me.

YMMV.

 

[Lanefan]

As for the other topic, of world design etc., all I can say is this: if the direction WotC is going will end up with them producing more adventure modules (which I can pillage) and less rulebooks (which I don't need) then I'm all for it!

Lanefan

 

[Lizard]

As for the other topic, of world design etc., all I can say is this: if the direction WotC is going will end up with them producing more adventure modules (which I can pillage) and less rulebooks (which I don't need) then I'm all for it!

Lanefan

See, I'm the opposite. I have every crunch book WOTC made for 3e, and mountains of same from other publishers, but pretty much no adventures. I got World's Largest Dungeon just 'cause, but I don't plan on ever running it. I think I bought the new hardcover Ravenloft on a whim. I have "Three Days To A Kill" because it was, y'know, the first. That's probably it, maybe there's one or two more lurking in the collection. OTOH, I've got about two large bookcases of general D20 crunch.

 

[Lizard]

That's odd. I run my prep/campaigns exactly like you described (except for the fudging of rolls), and I think that 4e is tailor made for me.

YMMV.

Well, maybe it will be for me, too, once I get past the paradigm shift. It's just such a pain having to deal with the disconnect between "What you see" and "what you get". Armor and weapons (for monsters) are cosmetic choices, most people don't have any skills, stats, or feats, all the little details that give an NPC character are subsumed into a generalized level modifier, etc.

I can see a need for a lot of exception-based design here. Basically, for anyone I don't expect to be disposable foe, I'll need to write up some background prose style, then extrapolate some modifiers from it.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

They simplified monster building and NPC creation so that WOTC can easily create adventures (and they won't mess up the math). Not necessarily for a better game, but so that WOTC can do their job easier.

Let's not forget the large numbers of DMs trying to cut back on their prep time. Lots of DMs write their own adventures, and would like to see rules that would make that easier.

As for the other topic, of world design etc., all I can say is this: if the direction WotC is going will end up with them producing more adventure modules (which I can pillage) and less rulebooks (which I don't need) then I'm all for it!

I think this strategy is full of win.

 

[MadMaligor]

Its been said before, and its still a good point. Professions are one of those roleplaying elements that while it might be nice to have a generic system for, its best left up to the DM to color the specifics. I would rather use my own and not have to compete with WotC's ideas about crafts, and have more pages in the manuals for the core mechanics.

Give me a stat block system thats versatile, an encounter system thats balanced, a combat system thats fun, a skill and powers system thats expandable, and a modular core system that lets me pick and choose what I want.

The roleplay system is mine thank you very much.

MM

 

[RandomCitizenX]

As for the other topic, of world design etc., all I can say is this: if the direction WotC is going will end up with them producing more adventure modules (which I can pillage) and less rulebooks (which I don't need) then I'm all for it!

Lanefan

This pretty much covers exactly why I bought KotS and why I will most likely buy H2-P3. I am busy with a 1 year old daughter and work. I don't always have time to draw up my own maps of dungeons. Instead I am going to strip mine the modules and drop them into the world and storyline I have had brewing since 4e info first started trickling in. Stuff I have time to write out myself will become filler sessions or flashback sessions (every few games I am planning to give players characters from the settings history to give them a more vested interest in the setting and backstory)

Back to the original topic. I am perfectly fine with things like background professions and whatnot being a handwaving affair since it allows the characters the ability to have them all on equal ground without the min-maxed character outstripping the roleplayers even more. I also think that some craft rules would be nice, but hardly necessary if the DM can think on his or her feet.

 

[JohnBiles]

Translation: Not important enough (in the designer's minds) to devote effort to.

That's their reading of the player base. We'll see. I know the people I play with like knowledge, craft, perform, and profession skills as ways to round out their character without it just being meaningless fluff text. Do most D&D players? Sales of 4e will tell...

My experience of 3E was that no one took Craft or Profession and very few people took much in the way of Knowledge skills; Perform got taken, but only by Bards. People simply didn't have enough skill points for them.

 

[Shadeydm]

3e was lego; 4e is duplo.

This is probably my biggest fear about the new edition. I suppose I will know the truth of it when my books arrive.

 

[Lizard]

My experience of 3E was that no one took Craft or Profession and very few people took much in the way of Knowledge skills; Perform got taken, but only by Bards. People simply didn't have enough skill points for them.

My swashbuckler/rogue had both Perform (Oratory) and Craft (Poetry), with not a single Bard level. Currently, my blood magus has ranks in just about every knowledge skill there is (He just picked up Nobility, hell, with a +5 int modifier, he gets a +6 with just one point!), and also has Craft (Alchemy). Why? In both cases, because they fit who the characters were and what they should be able to do. (And because buying alchemists fire for his Sudden Maximized Firebrands is getting pricey...)

I don't understand the attitude that anything which doesn't let you hit orcs better is mechanically irrelevant. I just don't.

About the only character I played who seriously was starved for skill points was my half ogre paladin. He got ONE SP/level, and by level seven had just enough ranks of K(R) to remember his god's name roughly half the time. He pretty much dumped everything into Ride just so he could stay on Clip-Clop in combat.