So THAT's why Regdar gets no love...

[roguerouge]

Sounds like marketing does not play DnD. If they did play DnD, they'd know that the way to handle Chaotics is to not force them to do things, but to appeal to their interests (philosophical or personal). Make artists bend to your will? Bad move. Make it a challenge where they can test themselves? Possibly a better one.

 

[buzz]

Now my question is... isn't this a self perpetuating attitude? If you believe white males will be turned off from a game by having a different ethnicity grace the cover of a book... well logic says the opposite is also true. I mean if you aren't trying to grow or expand your market... then it makes perfect sense. However if you are, then not so much.

I think it's worth noting that White Wolf turned themselves into the second-biggest RPG company on earth, at least in part, by actively pursuing diversity in their art and fluff. Not to mention expanded into demographics that were not playing RPGs at the time.

 

[Psion]

I think it's worth noting that White Wolf turned themselves into the second-biggest RPG company on earth, at least in part, by actively pursuing diversity in their art and fluff.

Like how the Savant and Sorcerer cover appeals to female gamers by putting butterflies on the cover?

 

[Barastrondo]

Like how the Savant and Sorcerer cover appeals to female gamers by putting butterflies on the cover?

Now why does nobody ever mention the bulging loincloth dude on the cover of Houses of the Bull God that came out immediately afterward? I swear, it's like people want to notice the cheesecake and not the beefcake.

Also, Harmonious Jade is the win.

 

[buzz]

Like how the Savant and Sorcerer cover appeals to female gamers by putting butterflies on the cover?

The exception that proves the rule.

 

[buzz]

Also, Harmonious Jade is the win.

QFT. She certainly didn't prevent Exalted from being one of WW's most successful creations, either.

 

[Matt Black]

Weird because I look at the covers on MALHAVOC PRESS product page and....

The Night of Dissolution - white male warrior
The Temple of Mysteries - Undetermined male warrior
The Book of Roguish Luck - white male
The Banewarrens - white male warrior (although it could be a dwarf?)
Mindscapes - white male
Requiem for a God - white males
Cry Havoc - White male warrior
The Bonds of Magic - white male
Iron Heroes - white male warrior
The Book of Hallowed Might - white male warrior
Book of Hallowed Might II - white male warrior
Book of Eldritch Might III - white male warrior

He seems to have plenty of the stereotype, certainly more than half except for the Arcana Evolved, product line.

It's true! And the characters that aren't white males are mostly either white females or non-human (mostly white non-humans). There's a black woman on Ruins of Intrigue, but I can't tell if she's meant to be a drow.

 

[Arnwyn]

Given how helpful they are to art orders and branding and how easy it is to license and merchandise their images, their absence is an enigma.

Someone must have put their foot down on this matter, and that person made the wrong call.

While I won't argue against the ease of making art orders for a business, the value of iconics to the consumer is questionable.

Really, AFAIC, iconics are bland, boring, and - most importantly of all - completely and utterly irrelevant. What's the point to the consumer? Branding? Meh. Looks like, for example in Pathfinder's case, some giant nobody/schmoe just plastered on the cover and getting in the way of some artwork that's actually cool.

Sure, Seoni's got a nice rack, but who are these other schmoes? For me, at least, not only are the iconics completely irrelevant, it's getting to the point that it could be seen that we're getting them shoved down our throats (the aforementioned prominent ruining of covers along with two wasted pages of - again, irrelevant - stats of these nobodies in the book itself).

Sounds like WotC made the right decision for 4e, from this particular consumer's point of view.

(But sure - maybe art ordering would have been easier for their business. Meh.)

 

[Psion]

Really, AFAIC, iconics are bland, boring, and - most importantly of all - completely and utterly irrelevant. What's the point to the consumer? Branding? Meh. Looks like, for example in Pathfinder's case, some giant nobody/schmoe just plastered on the cover and getting in the way of some artwork that's actually cool.

I like the Pathfinder iconics:
1) Visually/conceptually
2) I like that if I decide to play a game and players are in attendance without ready PCs, I can just pull one of the iconics out.

Feature 2, BTW, is a significant improvement in the way Paizo does iconics than the way WotC did them AFAIAC.

So yeah. This consumer finds value.

 

[Pinnacle]

Yup. Elves and dwarves are not racially diverse. They are tall, slender white people and short, stout white people. (As they are typically rendered, that is. I always liked how the Shield Dwarves in the FRCS were deep brown.)

Dwarves are described as medium-skin tone (I think?) but are usually depicted as white. Elves are described as usually fair-skinned, but Vadania is green and Mialee changes her skin color on a whim (usually orange-ish, but she's also been green and bright purple).

Looked at in this light, the only "iconic of color" in 3e was Ember the monk, unless you want to somehow count Krusk (which, honestly, I wouldn't).

She's the only black iconic, but what about Regdar, Alhandra, Hennet, and Naull?
Jozan's the only white human, except maybe Kerwyn (I can't tell with him).