Soft Cover and Reach Weapons

[Egres]

From the Ask Wizards Archive: 8/22/06
Q: You determine cover with a reach weapon using the rules for ranged weapons. In the errata it says that cover from creatures (referred to as soft cover) only applies to ranged weapons. Does this mean that soft cover does or does not apply to weapons with reach?
--Judson

A: Wait a minute, this was the question for 08/02! That's right, and the answer we provided was wrong, wrong, wrong. For which, we apologize -- and extend the following, correct answer (courtesy of R&D's Andy Collins):

For purposes of determining cover, melee reach attacks use the rules for ranged attacks. Thus, soft cover applies to melee reach attacks (since it normally applies to ranged attacks).

 

[Exquisite Dead Guy]

From the PHB Errata (2/16/06)
Soft Cover
Player's Handbook, page 151
Soft cover works against ranged attacks, not melee
attacks.
In the first sentence of the paragraph, change “melee” to
“ranged.”

So it appears that the errata is now wrong and the original statement in the PHB is official?

 

[RangerWickett]

One of my DMs is the 'Judson' who asked the first question. Now he's going to be confused.

 

[Deset Gled]

So it appears that the errata is now wrong and the original statement in the PHB is official?

No, the errata is correct. Andy Collins is wrong. SSDD.

 

[kjenks]

The errata is confusing. It appears to contradict itself when making a melee attack against a target that isn't adjacent to you.

The PH/SRD says:

SRD
===
When making a melee attack against an adjacent target, your target has cover if any line from your square to the target's square goes through a wall (including a low wall). When making a melee attack against a target that isn't adjacent to you (such as with a reach weapon), use the rules for determining cover from ranged attacks.
===

PH Errata
===
Soft Cover
Player's Handbook, page 151
[Sentence 1] Soft cover works against ranged attacks, not melee attacks.
[Sentence 2] In the first sentence of the paragraph, change "melee" to "ranged."
===

So let's ignore Sentence 1 for a moment and see what happens to the Cover rule when you apply the change required by Sentence 2:

SRD with Errata Sentence 2
===
When making a RANGED attack against an adjacent target, your target has cover if any line from your square to the target's square goes through a wall (including a low wall). When making a melee attack against a target that isn't adjacent to you (such as with a reach weapon), use the rules for determining cover from ranged attacks.
===

Now let's deal with that pesky Sentence 1. It's perfectly fine if you consider "melee attacks" to be limited to attacking a creature in an adjacent square. It causes confusion when making a melee attack against a target that isn't adjacent to you, like with a reach weapon or if you have natural reach. That's clearly a melee attack. But when making a melee attack against a target that isn't adjacent to you, you're supposed to use the rules for determining cover from ranged attacks. So does soft cover apply or not?

This most recent clarification says that soft cover does indeed apply when making a melee attack against a target that isn't adjacent to you, clearing up this little ambiguity.

 

[Deset Gled]

The errata is confusing. It appears to contradict itself when making a melee attack against a target that isn't adjacent to you.

...

It causes confusion when making a melee attack against a target that isn't adjacent to you, like with a reach weapon or if you have natural reach. That's clearly a melee attack. But when making a melee attack against a target that isn't adjacent to you, you're supposed to use the rules for determining cover from ranged attacks. So does soft cover apply or not?

This most recent clarification says that soft cover does indeed apply when making a melee attack against a target that isn't adjacent to you, clearing up this little ambiguity.

I would like to point out the first sentance from the errata regarding soft cover:

Soft cover works against ranged attacks, not melee attacks.

I agree that the text in the PHB might be ambiguous, but the errata is as clear as it can be. Luckily, errata trumps the PHB per the Primary Source rule.

 

[Hypersmurf]

I would like to point out the first sentance from the errata regarding soft cover:
Soft cover works against ranged attacks, not melee attacks.

Indeed. And if your melee attack is against a non-adjacent target, we say:

A. Soft Cover works against ranged attacks.
B. Soft Cover does not work against melee attacks.

For purposes of determining cover against my non-adjacent melee attack, which rule do I use - A or B? I use A, the rule for ranged attacks. Soft Cover applies.

-Hyp.

 

[Moon-Lancer]

Ok. So the picture in phb 151 called cover in melee. If the orc does something to provoke an attack of opportunity, can you still not take the attack of opportunity.

1: on the same page under Cover and Attacks of opportunity, it says you cant execute an attack of opportunity against an opponent with cover relative to you. Is this still the way the game is played.

2: What about Soft Cover and Cover. Do they stack?

Lets say regdar or the gnoll was in between lidda and the orc on page 151 under cover against ranged attacks. Would this be a +8 to the orcs ac? she would also be shooting into melee wouldn’t she?


3: So I’m still not clear on reach weapons. Does soft cover apply or not?

 

[frankthedm]

3: So I’m still not clear on reach weapons. Does soft cover apply or not?

Common sence should tell you if you have something or someone between you and your foe you have a penalty to hit the foe.

IIRC Soft Cover does not block AoOs so if you are threatening a foe and a friend is between you two, that foe is not safe from your AoOs, though the -4 to be hit from having soft cover may be quite helpful to said foe.

 

[MarkB]

Common sence should tell you if you have something or someone between you and your foe you have a penalty to hit the foe.

IIRC Soft Cover does not block AoOs so if you are threatening a foe and a friend is between you two, that foe is not safe from your AoOs, though the -4 to be hit from having soft cover may be quite helpful to said foe.

The rule that cover prevents AoOs is mentioned before soft cover is defined, and the definition for soft cover does not indicate that AoOs are treated differently for soft cover than for hard cover.

So, if soft cover applies to melee attacks at all, then it also prevents AoOs.