Solving the Called Shot Problem
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Lalato
Adventurer
What if called shots were based on an opposed check. If the PC wins the opposed check, the called shot goes off as normal. If the PC loses the opposed check, the called shot does not go off and the PC has a penalty to his attack and/or damage.
In this way, called shots could be tempered by the negative effect of possibly missing entirely. The opposed check mechanic is already used for Trips and Grapples... this wouldn't be much different. Heck, you could even say that like those types of attacks... a Called Shot results in an AoO unless the PC has the feat Improved Called Shot.
The results of the Called Shot itself I'll leave to others.
--sam
In this way, called shots could be tempered by the negative effect of possibly missing entirely. The opposed check mechanic is already used for Trips and Grapples... this wouldn't be much different. Heck, you could even say that like those types of attacks... a Called Shot results in an AoO unless the PC has the feat Improved Called Shot.
The results of the Called Shot itself I'll leave to others.
--sam
Lord Zardoz
Explorer
The only reason to have a called shot system of any sort is to allow the players to achieve some sort of special effect or advantage that they cannot otherwise accomplish in the existing rules.
The problem with most called shot systems is that the definition of what a called shot should accomplish is always too wide open.
Most uses for called shots that I can think of fall under one of the following:
- Seeking an advantage to hit by targeting an unprotected area
- Seeking an advantage for damage by targeting a vital area
- Seeking to inflict a penalty to hit or damage
Called shots may add plenty of 'flavor' to a game, but that flavor is suspiciously similar to cheese. What ends up happening is that if the called shot is worth doing at all, than it is typically better than making a normal attack. And once you reach that point, combat gets bogged down as every melee attack becomes an attempt to hit someone in the eyes, throat, groin, or where ever.
My only advice is to work out what effects your comfortable with letting a called shot achieve, and leave the specific hit locations abstract. With concrete effects, you avoid arguments about what a called shot to some particular tendon or limb should achieve.
END COMMUNICATION
The problem with most called shot systems is that the definition of what a called shot should accomplish is always too wide open.
Most uses for called shots that I can think of fall under one of the following:
- Seeking an advantage to hit by targeting an unprotected area
- Seeking an advantage for damage by targeting a vital area
- Seeking to inflict a penalty to hit or damage
Called shots may add plenty of 'flavor' to a game, but that flavor is suspiciously similar to cheese. What ends up happening is that if the called shot is worth doing at all, than it is typically better than making a normal attack. And once you reach that point, combat gets bogged down as every melee attack becomes an attempt to hit someone in the eyes, throat, groin, or where ever.
My only advice is to work out what effects your comfortable with letting a called shot achieve, and leave the specific hit locations abstract. With concrete effects, you avoid arguments about what a called shot to some particular tendon or limb should achieve.
END COMMUNICATION
DungeonMaester
First Post
I have not read 'Torn Asunder' but for called shot I use the normal sunder rules using str for hardness and con for hp. On a failed attempt to sunder, it does damage that bypass hardness.
Effectively, you deal little damage, or cleave a arm in twine.
But, when using called shots in your campaign make it clear to the players the difference between a called shot a CDG. This saves alot of headache down the road and will make the called shots work with ease.
---Rusty
Effectively, you deal little damage, or cleave a arm in twine.
But, when using called shots in your campaign make it clear to the players the difference between a called shot a CDG. This saves alot of headache down the road and will make the called shots work with ease.
---Rusty
Kahuna Burger
First Post
action points seem a little valuable to spend on trying for a called shot, esp if there is also a attack penalty. If you want to use that mechanic, I would use them to turn a crit into a called shot, or something similar. But then, I'm not a fan of uses of action points that might not do anything.
edit : you could also have the attack penalty first then spend an action point for the called shot after you hit.
edit : you could also have the attack penalty first then spend an action point for the called shot after you hit.
Scarbonac
Not An Evil Twin
Awakened said:
That is totally too much.
In our games, it's more like "Hey, he's holding a powerful artifact! We should be able to knock it out of his hand!"
The 2e Complete Fighter had a reasonable system for called shots; insta-kills and dismemberment weren't allowed, but disarming, pinning ("stapling", actually) limbs, stunning, numbing, temporary blindness, all kinds of Robin Hood/William Tell/Lone Ranger stunts were.
Allowing called shots for flavor or tactics is fine, but insta-kills/crippling?
Not so much.
Mustrum_Ridcully
Legend
One of the difficulties with called shots (in my experience) is that the effects are hard to balance with the regular Hit Point mechanic. Anything that inflicts penalties bypasses your character's hit points, and hitpoints are one of the major D&D abstractions. (Spells change this to some extent but you can't do spells endlessly. But even then, Hitpoints are tied to Hit Dice which in turn determine saving throws)
I think it is best to try staying in the system as close as possible and not trying to apply penalties that usually don't exist (like an abritary -2 penalty if your arm was damaged or something like that).
I would personally prefer using Massive Damage Threshold (like in D20 Modern or SAGA) and critical hits as a base for all called shots.
Maybe this way:
Called Shots:
You can make Called Shots as a standard action that provokes an attack of oppertunity. This is a regular melee or ranged attack against the target, but it allows you to inflict a special penalty upon your target by striking a particular vital spot.
If the damage you deal is enough to exceed a value equal to 20 + your opponents Fortitude Save Bonus, you can choose to inflict one of the following penalties:
- 2 points of ability damage (except constitution)
- Sickened (1 Minute)
- Base Speed Reduced by 5 ft (1 Minute) (apply armor penalties after applying this one)
Improved Called Shot (General)
Prerequisite: Dex13+
You can take a penalty up to your Base Attack Bonus and add the same number to you effective damage for determining whether you reach the threshold given above. If you're using a light weapon or a weapon you use the weapon finesse feat with, you can apply twice this value.
You still deal damage normally (do not apply the above penalties or bonuses).
Greater Called Shot (General)
Prerequisite: Dex13+, Improved Called Shot; BAB 6+
You no longer provoke an attack of oppertunity when making a called shot.
Instead of this benefit, you can also attempt to apply one of the following penalties:
- Nauseated (1 round), and sickened (1 minute)
- Blinded (1 round), and dazzled (1 minute)
- 4 points of ability damage (no constitution damage)
I think it is best to try staying in the system as close as possible and not trying to apply penalties that usually don't exist (like an abritary -2 penalty if your arm was damaged or something like that).
I would personally prefer using Massive Damage Threshold (like in D20 Modern or SAGA) and critical hits as a base for all called shots.
Maybe this way:
Called Shots:
You can make Called Shots as a standard action that provokes an attack of oppertunity. This is a regular melee or ranged attack against the target, but it allows you to inflict a special penalty upon your target by striking a particular vital spot.
If the damage you deal is enough to exceed a value equal to 20 + your opponents Fortitude Save Bonus, you can choose to inflict one of the following penalties:
- 2 points of ability damage (except constitution)
- Sickened (1 Minute)
- Base Speed Reduced by 5 ft (1 Minute) (apply armor penalties after applying this one)
Improved Called Shot (General)
Prerequisite: Dex13+
You can take a penalty up to your Base Attack Bonus and add the same number to you effective damage for determining whether you reach the threshold given above. If you're using a light weapon or a weapon you use the weapon finesse feat with, you can apply twice this value.
You still deal damage normally (do not apply the above penalties or bonuses).
Greater Called Shot (General)
Prerequisite: Dex13+, Improved Called Shot; BAB 6+
You no longer provoke an attack of oppertunity when making a called shot.
Instead of this benefit, you can also attempt to apply one of the following penalties:
- Nauseated (1 round), and sickened (1 minute)
- Blinded (1 round), and dazzled (1 minute)
- 4 points of ability damage (no constitution damage)
Patryn of Elvenshae
First Post
Lord Zardoz said:
... which, btw, works really, really well in Fallout.
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