Sorcerer variant- balanced?

Sadrik, your variant seems fair enough to me considering that sorcerers are a bit inferior to wizards in most campaigns (though still useful) and kinda pigeonholed or hard to explain depending on the setting or flavor of the sorcerer. In my current homebrew campaign, Rhunaria, there are three kinds of sorcerer; natural or "blood" sorcerers, who have a powerful creature in their ancestry; talisman or "fetish" sorcerers, who have an unexplainable arcane connection to a particular kind of item, a reagent that they must expend with each spell; and spirit sorcerers, who have a mysterious connection to certain worldly spirits, who provide spell effects for favors, friendship, and probably a willing ear, though the spirits might nag them to death...... Each has slightly different extra benefits; i.e. natural sorcerers get bonus feats, talisman sorcerers learn extra spells and get +1 to spell DCs, and spirit sorcerers get a small combination of minor spirit senses and bonus feats. Basically the extra benefits are equivalent to a wizard's five bonus feats, and this gives more flavor/variety; the PCs in my campaign include 1 spirit sorcerer, 1 talisman sorcerer, and 1 blood sorcerer.

An alternate sorcerer variant that I devised some time ago and have been wanting to use is as follows, which better fits the PHB description of them as more physical than wizards and less preoccupied time-wise with developing their magic.

SORCERER
Alignment: Any.
Hit Dice: d6.
BAB: +1 / 2 levels.
Saves: Fort weak, Ref strong, Will weak.
Base Skill Points: 4/level.
Class Skills: Balance, Bluff, Climb, Concentration, Diplomacy, Disguise, Gather Information, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge (Arcana), Perform, Scry, Spellcraft, Swim, Use Magic Device.
Proficiencies: All simple weapons.

Spells: As per the 3.0 PHB sorcerer.

Unstable Sorcery: Any time a sorcerer casts a spell with this class, there is a 10% chance the spell will fail as though it were interrupted, separate from any Arcane Spell Failure. Also, each time the sorcerer attempts to cast a spell with this class, there is a separate 15% chance that the sorcerer will be stunned until the end of his or her next turn, starting immediately after the spellcasting attempt. If the sorcerer fails both of these d% rolls for a given spell, resulting in stun and spell failure, they suffer 1d6 subdual damage from magical backlash as well, which cannot be reduced or prevented by any means, but may be healed as usual.

Component Conversion: Sorcerers never use material components or focus components for their spells with this class. Instead, a sorcerer pays experience points or suffers hit point damage, from the mystical strain or fatigue of supplying that power themselves. Each time the character casts a sorcerer spell that would normally have such a component, they instead suffer an amount of XP loss and/or hit point damage to cover the full cost of these components, and they choose how they wish to divide this special cost each time. Each hit point or experience point spent in this manner will replace up to 25 gp worth of material components, or 50 gp worth of arcane focus components. Material and focus components are compensated for separately. The sorcerer cannot spend any amount of XP in this manner that would cause them to lose a level. Likewise, they cannot spend any number of hit points in this manner that would drop them to 0 HP or less. The sorcerer cannot cast any given spell, at any given time, if it would force them to violate these limits at the time. Hit point damage suffered in this way does not affect the character's spellcasting, does not require a Concentration check, and does not affect any Concentration checks.

Familiar: As per the 3.0 PHB sorcerer, except as follows. The sorcerer may give up the Familiar ability at 1st-level in order to gain Inherant Magic instead, permanently replacing the Familiar ability. If they do not give up their Familiar ability, however, the sorcerer gains a few minor improvements to their familiar. At 9th-level, then again at 15th, 17th, and 19th-level, the familiar gains a bonus feat of their master's choice, for which the familiar can ignore one skill, feat, ability score, or base attack bonus requirement for the chosen feat. For instance, the familiar could gain Power Attack as a bonus feat this way even if they do not meet the Strength requirement, or they could gain the Mobility feat even if they do not meet the Dodge feat requirement, or they could gain the Improved Critical feat even if they do not meet the normally-required base attack bonus.

Awaken Talent: At 2nd-level and again every two additional levels, at 4th, 6th, 8th, 10th, 12th, 14th, 16th, 18th, and 20th, the sorcerer gains a +1 bonus on a particular skill. The sorcerer cannot choose the same skill twice in a row, but may later choose a previously-selected skill. Each time, they choose any skill that is a sorcerer class skill for them.

Spell Negation: The sorcerer eventually learns how to cancel out certain types of magical effect. At 3rd-level, and again at every fourth level thereafter, the sorcerer chooses a particular school of magic and a specific spell level. The sorcerer can only choose a spell level with which they know at least one sorcerer spell of the chosen school. The sorcerer may henceforth counter any spell of that level or lower, as long as it belongs to the chosen school, by expending one spell slot for the day of a spell level equal to or higher than the spell to be countered. The sorcerer still must ready an action to counterspell, and must still identify the spell with a Spellcraft check before countering it, unless some other ability or feat changes these. A new school, new spell level, or both, may be chosen each time, but the requirements must be met for each new selection. Any previous Spell Negation benefits are still retained.

Inherant Magic: A sorcerer who gives up the Familiar ability gains the Inherant Magic ability, which is then automatically gained at 1st-level in this class, then again every fourth level thereafter, at 5th, 9th, 13th, and 17th. Available Inherant Magic abilities are listed below, and each states how many times it may be chosen.

Expanded Repertoire: You have worked to draw out a new spell from your sorcerous nature. You learn one new sorcerer spell from the sorcerer spell list, of any level lower than the highest spell level you can currently cast with this class. Expanded Repertoire may be gained multiple times, and grants a different spell each time.

Minor Metamagic: You have developed a particular metamagic technique with one sorcerer spell you know. Choose either Enlarge Spell, Extend Spell, Silent Spell, or Still Spell each time you gain Minor Metamagic. You may apply the effects of that metamagic feat with the chosen sorcerer spell, once each time you cast the spell, even if you do not have the feat. This does not increase the spell's casting time, nor does it increase the level of spell slot used to cast the spell. Minor Metamagic may be gained multiple times, and must be applied to a new spell each time.

Spell Affinity: You have grown accustomed to a particular sorcerer spell which you know. When gaining Spell Affinity for any given spell, choose whether that Spell Affinity will grant either +1 on attack rolls with the spell, +1 to the spell's save DC, or +2 on your effective caster level with the chosen sorcerer spell. Spell Affinity may be gained multiple times, and must be applied to a new spell each time.

Detect Magic: At 7th-level, the sorcerer gains Detect Magic as a spell-like ability, useable at will. Treat the sorcerer's level in this class as their caster level for this spell-like ability. If the sorcerer already knew Detect Magic as a sorcerer spell, then they automatically learn a new 0-level sorcerer spell in its place as Detect Magic becomes spell-like.
 

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Thats funny some of my house rules are similar to what some of you guys posted already.

All casters gain Eschew Materials as a bonus feat.
All casters gain bonus 0 level spells for a high stat 10-17 1 18-25 2 etc.
Spells with a gold cost can be ignored by paying 1/25 the gold cost as an XP cost.
You can simply spend the gold instead of needing to find a specific component (such as pearl dust).
Divine casters do not have somatic components if they have their focus (holy symbol) on their person; otherwise, they suffer arcane spell failure.

The Draconic feats are neat and quite good at 1st level dumping your magic missiles for 2d6 area of effect attacks is pretty neat. But again, its the you are the dragon guy, which is neat but gets kind of old.

Oh yeah and I would remove that bit about the meta-magic as a full round action thing.

Arkhandus, your sorcerer is really strong mechanically, a little roguish with the good ref save and skill list. The detect magic ability is a wash though since what else are they going to blow all those zero level slots on. unstable sorcery is a little harsh too, btw. intead of spell negation just give them improved counterspell feat.

What about giving spell casting stat to the sorcerer known list.

Sadrik
 

Sadrik said:
What about giving spell casting stat to the sorcerer known list.

Sadrik

Along with the other mentioned changes, I give Sorcerers knowledge of spells of one cleric domain - it gives their spell selection a theme and gives them 2 spells to know whenever they get a new spell level.

They do NOT get the domain power.
 

Arkhandus said:
Unstable Sorcery: Any time a sorcerer casts a spell with this class, there is a 10% chance the spell will fail as though it were interrupted, separate from any Arcane Spell Failure. Also, each time the sorcerer attempts to cast a spell with this class, there is a separate 15% chance that the sorcerer will be stunned until the end of his or her next turn, starting immediately after the spellcasting attempt.

Good grief! This can't be serious! :p

Spell Negation: The sorcerer eventually learns how to cancel out certain types of magical effect. At 3rd-level, and again at every fourth level thereafter, the sorcerer chooses a particular school of magic and a specific spell level. The sorcerer can only choose a spell level with which they know at least one sorcerer spell of the chosen school. The sorcerer may henceforth counter any spell of that level or lower, as long as it belongs to the chosen school, by expending one spell slot for the day of a spell level equal to or higher than the spell to be countered. The sorcerer still must ready an action to counterspell, and must still identify the spell with a Spellcraft check before countering it, unless some other ability or feat changes these. A new school, new spell level, or both, may be chosen each time, but the requirements must be met for each new selection. Any previous Spell Negation benefits are still retained.

I will only comment on this one in detail, since it struck me as very odd, how you designed it.

The first school you choose will automatically be the weakest, even though it's the one you then have the most practice in, unless you choose to gimp yourself by choosing the same school again later, thereby reducing your overall options. ;)

You really should rather make it that the schools chosen automatically improve one step, whenever a new choice comes up, and you replace the lowest ability with a new school.

I.e. at 3rd level you choose Evocation (1st or lower); then at 7th level you choose Enchantment, which will then be (1st or lower) and Evocation will be (3rd or lower); at 11th level you choose Necromancy, resulting in it being (1st or lower), Enchantment being (3rd or lower) and Evocation being (5th or lower).

Makes more sense that way, or not? :)

Bye
Thanee
 

the Lorax said:
Along with the other mentioned changes, I give Sorcerers knowledge of spells of one cleric domain - it gives their spell selection a theme and gives them 2 spells to know whenever they get a new spell level.

They do NOT get the domain power.
Hmm, interesting. It is a nice little boost. Gives them a set spell list to base their character on. Why not just let them add any spell, like I was proposing? Then they wouldnt feel like they were forced to take a dead spell at a particular level, I suppose they are a bonus... So it is not like you are asking them to lose something.

Here are my thoughts on the sorcerer:
1. Choose any spell.
2. Add stat bonus to spells known too.
3. Meta-magic works like with the wizard.

Is that balanced? even close?

Sadrik
 

Sadrik said:
Hmm, interesting. It is a nice little boost. Gives them a set spell list to base their character on. Why not just let them add any spell, like I was proposing? Then they wouldnt feel like they were forced to take a dead spell at a particular level, I suppose they are a bonus... So it is not like you are asking them to lose something.

Here are my thoughts on the sorcerer:
1. Choose any spell.
2. Add stat bonus to spells known too.
3. Meta-magic works like with the wizard.

Is that balanced? even close?

Sadrik

The domain gives their spell knowledge base a theme - a bit of homage to the idea that their access to power comes from some distant conection to supernatural beings (be they outsiders, dragons, fey or something else). I've been fairly liberal in the source of selected domains, and given the number of domains out there in 3rd party products, my campaign setting guide itself, or even in WoTC products there are a signifigant number of groups of spells.
 

I have a great idea, talking with a freind last night I came up with this:

At 1st level Sorcerers have every Meta-magic feat (except for the Sudden ones).
They are virtual and can only be used with the sorcerer spells. No other changes to them.

So they still have to use a full round action to use a Meta-magic feat. It makes them more Psion like.

That is an interesting variant I think...

Sadrik
 


Phaedrus said:
EVERY feat? Including from all the splat books? That's a LOT of feats.
Yeah!, They still have to use a full round action and they still have to spend the higher spell slot. I dont see a problem, those meta magic feats are supposed to be balanced by forcing you to spend higher spell slots. Ok, there are a few that are likely not appropriate (divine meta-magic) but in concept, yes all.

Sadrik
 

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