Sorcerer's got the Shaft! (reprise)

[EOL]

In the beginning...

When all things were getting the shaft (Half-Orc's, Rangers, Two-weapon fighters) the sorcerers were among those thought to have gotten "shafted". After nearly a year and a half under 3E what is your experience. Are sorcerer's the weaker cousin of the Wizard, do they hold their own, or do they actually surpass their less flashy cousins.

 

[SpikeyFreak]

I think the sorcerer could have gotten the feats, but that's not to great a disadvantage.

--Short Spikey

 

[whatisitgoodfor]

First of all, WHY!!! This has been done to death, just let it drop.


Secondly, why is this in rules? It should be in general.

 

[SpikeyFreak]

First of all, WHY!!! This has been done to death, just let it drop.


Secondly, why is this in rules? It should be in general.

On second though, I agree.

--Rethinking Spikey

 

[graydoom]

I vote for balanced. Sorcerers specialized for combat can outshine wizards due to the greater number of spells sorcerers have, but wizards are usually more broadly useful.

 

[EOL]

I would probably have rather put it in general but it seemed very D&D specific, but it is entirely possible (even probable that I erred) if a moderator sees fit to move it I would have no problem with that.

As to why we should revisit this subject I have only returned to serious perusal of these forums since the new board went into place and I assumed it was an issue that hadn't been visited in awhile. If the old boards collapsed under the weight of sorcerer balance flame wars spanning across dozens of pages then you have my sinceriest apologies.

As to the topic I was one who initially thought that sorcerer's were underpowered, but since seeing them in play I think with the correct selection of metamagic feats they can be far more flexible than an equal level wizard.

 

[apsuman]

If balance (relative to other classes in general and wizards in specific) were a range from -100 to 100 with 0 beign completely balanced, I think they would be in that range, but on the low end, -90 or so.

I don't it takes much extra to push sorcerer's out the top of that range.

I think these are all ideas on how to give the sorcerer something extra without destroying balance:

4 skill points per level

simply adding some (one?) CHA based class skill.

simple armor and shield profiencies (yes, seriously)

the choice of eschew materials, silent spell, still spell, or arcane preparation at first level.

one bonus feat every five levels from this list : any meta magic, extra spell, extra slot.

the ability to cast level x spells one character level lower than they know level x spells. I.e., they can cast 2 third level spells at character level 5 but they don't know any until character level 6.

a single bonus feat at level 10, but add some real good stuff here, like innate spell (with a lower level requirement).


just in case i was not clear, I mean adding one of these choices, not more than one, mind you.

g!

 

[Cloudgatherer]

Seems like a rules topic to me. I'm sure were going to start debating the merits of spontaneous casting versus preparation....

I said balanced. Even if they are not balanced, I think it's close enough for the vast majority of games.

 

[Xarlen]

the ability to cast level x spells one character level lower than they know level x spells. I.e., they can cast 2 third level spells at character level 5 but they don't know any until character level 6.

I don't see how that's useful; if they don't know the spells, how can they cast them?

Agreed, Sorcerors should get atleast a few more spells. Look at what they get at level 2. An added cantrip. A Cantrip. It's just not worth adding that 2nd level, for a CANTRIP.

I like the suggestion of getting a choice of those four selections, but why Arcane Preperation?

 

[Hypersmurf]

I don't see how that's useful; if they don't know the spells, how can they cast them?

Because it gives you slots for Metamagic.

You don't know any second level spells, but you can cast a Silent Sleep spell... good for sneaking up on those goblin sentries before they ring the bell...

-Hyp.