punkorange
First Post
Anyone ever toyed with the idea of using spellcraft as sort of a "magic check" to cast spells?
spellcraft to cast spells
- Thread starter punkorange
- Start date
RangerWickett
Legend
If I were to do this, I'd switch out magic to be entirely skills based. Each school of magic would be a separate skill, and casting a spell would require a check.
Wizards would get 8 skill points per level (6 more than normal, so they could have many schools). Sorcerers would get 6 skill points per level (4 more than normal). There would be no spell slots. Instead, whenever you fail a spellcasting check, you suffer a cumulative -1 penalty to future casting checks until you sleep for an evening. If you fail by 5 or more, the spell mishaps somehow. To counteract their lesser skill points, sorcerers get a +1 bonus to spellcasting checks.
You do not have to 'know' spells; if you have ranks in the school of magic, you have the chance to create any effect of that school. To cast a spell you roll d20 and add your ranks in the appropriate skill. There is no key ability score that modifies this check. Instead, add your caster level to the check.
DC 05 - cantrip
DC 08 - 1st
DC 12 - 2nd
DC 17 - 3rd
DC 22 - 4th
DC 26 - 5th
DC 30 - 6th
DC 35 - 7th
DC 40 - 8th
DC 45 - 9th
In this system, the earliest you could reliably cast 9th level spells would be 18th level, with skill focus and 21 ranks in the skill.
Of course, in a perfect world we'd just revamp spells to be on a 20-pt. scale so that 5th level spellcasters could cast 5th level spells. But oh well.
Wizards would get 8 skill points per level (6 more than normal, so they could have many schools). Sorcerers would get 6 skill points per level (4 more than normal). There would be no spell slots. Instead, whenever you fail a spellcasting check, you suffer a cumulative -1 penalty to future casting checks until you sleep for an evening. If you fail by 5 or more, the spell mishaps somehow. To counteract their lesser skill points, sorcerers get a +1 bonus to spellcasting checks.
You do not have to 'know' spells; if you have ranks in the school of magic, you have the chance to create any effect of that school. To cast a spell you roll d20 and add your ranks in the appropriate skill. There is no key ability score that modifies this check. Instead, add your caster level to the check.
DC 05 - cantrip
DC 08 - 1st
DC 12 - 2nd
DC 17 - 3rd
DC 22 - 4th
DC 26 - 5th
DC 30 - 6th
DC 35 - 7th
DC 40 - 8th
DC 45 - 9th
In this system, the earliest you could reliably cast 9th level spells would be 18th level, with skill focus and 21 ranks in the skill.
Of course, in a perfect world we'd just revamp spells to be on a 20-pt. scale so that 5th level spellcasters could cast 5th level spells. But oh well.
punkorange
First Post
I really like that system. You could even do something like have damage dealt to the caster if you fail a check by 10 or more. Maybe 10 + amount failed beyond 10 damage. That way if a first level wizard tried to cast a fifth level spell it would probably be to much for them to handle and they would die from the uncontrolled power, but they would have a chance (we double mods on a natural 20, so 1st level has a 1 in 20 chance of getting dc 28).
I would also keep spellbooks, you cannot cast a spell if it isn't in your spellbook. You could even say your spellbook must be held in your hand as you cast the spell.
I would also keep spellbooks, you cannot cast a spell if it isn't in your spellbook. You could even say your spellbook must be held in your hand as you cast the spell.
Voldrath
Explorer
I've ben working on a spell system that's a combination of spellcraft, magic points, and epic spellcasting. It uses a base spell "seed" with listed modifiers to the spellcraft roll. Magic points are worth 5 points to the spellcraft check. In addition you can combine multiple "seeds" into the same spell. The system is verry freeform allowing for on the spot spell construction.
punkorange
First Post
Im very intrigued. I would be interested in seeing your system when it's done.
Dakkareth
First Post
Take a look at the Black Company Campaign Setting. The basic premise for magic there is to have a 'use magic' skill and basic effects (create fire, create figments, kinda like the seeds in the ELH) as feats. You can make up any combination and strength on the fly and cast it, if you manage the skill check against the resulting DC. Then you take non-lethal damage as 'backlash'.
Voldrath
Explorer
punkorange said:
I appreciate the intrest. I was working on it for a campain idea. The project is on hold for the moment, but I'll post it if I ever get it all typed up. It's a quadra elemental system with no divine, arcane split. It dose not mesh with the magic system as writen, and would have to be a total replacement.
punkorange
First Post
If you need any help drop me a message at punkorange@gmail.com
The Spectrum Rider
First Post
IMC, in order to cast a spell, the caster must make a d20 + 1/2(caster level) + key ability modifier roll vs. DC 5 + spell level.
Actually, we have an "open-ended d20" system, so that it's possible to roll less than 1 or more than 20.
We've defined Bonus Points and Fumbling. (I won't describe them in detail here, but you must make an unmodified roll above a 16 and beat your DC by more than 5 to get Bonus Points.) Bonus Points are added to the spell's save DC, and can affect range, duration, and area. They also give you a chance of getting the spell (or spell slot, if you don't memorize spells) back.
If you fail the roll, you lose the spell. If you Fumble, you get harmful or negative effects.
All spellcasters - divine and arcane - use this system.
The players have not complained. The DC is low enough that you usually succeed; and the sense that "anything might happen" - well, that's the fun part.
The Spectrum Rider
Actually, we have an "open-ended d20" system, so that it's possible to roll less than 1 or more than 20.
We've defined Bonus Points and Fumbling. (I won't describe them in detail here, but you must make an unmodified roll above a 16 and beat your DC by more than 5 to get Bonus Points.) Bonus Points are added to the spell's save DC, and can affect range, duration, and area. They also give you a chance of getting the spell (or spell slot, if you don't memorize spells) back.
If you fail the roll, you lose the spell. If you Fumble, you get harmful or negative effects.
All spellcasters - divine and arcane - use this system.
The players have not complained. The DC is low enough that you usually succeed; and the sense that "anything might happen" - well, that's the fun part.
The Spectrum Rider
RandomPrecision
First Post
punkorange said:
That's how epic spells work, is it not? You have to make a spellcraft check to develop the spell, and then make a spellcraft check to actually cast it. I'm not sure what DC's you'd use for each non-epic spell, but epic spells have DC's based on the seeds that they're created from, modified by positive and negative factors (bonuses to effect area, etc. are positive modifiers to DC, putting a backlash on a damage spell would be a negative modifier to the DC.)
Something else suggested in the Epic Handbook that one might keep in mind is that Clerics/Druids/Paladins/Rangers casting spells with spellcraft might be allowed to use their Wisdom modifier instead of Intelligence, and Sorcerers/Bards can use their Charisma modifiers, as a house rule.
