Spells I Never Use

[Olaf the Stout]

Touch attack spells: The targets I am likely to use them on do not tend to miss on the AoO.

You do realise that trying to touch someone with a touch attack spell doesn't trigger an AoO for making an unarmed attack as the caster is considered "armed" with the touch attack spell.

Apologies if you do know that this isn't the case. That's just how it comes across.

Olaf the Stout

 

[Infiniti2000]

Based on the comment about recalculation, does no one here use a GM software package?

We explicitly don't allow or want computers at the table, not even the DM.

That said, I'm thinking I have an inherent dislike of soft-banning. I don't much care for the concept of what's good for the goose is not good for the gander. But, maybe giving the PC's the advantage like you're doing creates a fun, heroic feel.

 

[Sparafucile]

Exactly.

...but you still have to support the "suspension of disbelief" of the players. If I was a player in your game, and knew you wouldn't use those particular spells, I'd react accordingly.

What do you do about that?

Good point. I guess I'd say that my players don't know, unless they're reading this now.

Before I came up with the list this morning, I actually didn't know either. I just realized that I've been passively avoiding many of these spells from the beginning, and I thought I'd look at the PH and formally find them all.

One problem for PCs aware of a "soft ban" is that spells like Death Ward are no longer useful. Why would a cleric bother keeping a slot for it when there's no chance of facing a death attack or a level drain? Removing fear is also a heroic action, and the cleric never gets that chance to shine. I guess I could reconstitute all the spells to do specific ability score damage instead of "save or die," but then the spells have to be altered both ways, denying the PCs their "save or die" effects and opening up a whole can of extra rules for the agressive spells and the defensive spells that counter them. So far, this has worked out allright . . . but I can definitely see the inherent clunkiness you all are pointing out.

Maybe I can just do a 4th edition woogie, and justify it the same way that NPCs are justified in being denied Raise Dead? Hmm . . .

 

[Nyarlathotep]

Just curious about something. Do your casters not have good Concentration skills? If they cast defensively, there's no AoO to worry about. Using a touch spell in combat is considered an "armed" attack. And since you can hold touch spell charges, they could just cast it one round away from melee if they don't have good a Concentration skill, then next round move in for the attack.

They could also cast the spell (assuming they aren't threatened) move in and touch their target all in the same round without drawing an AoO (unless reach is involved).

 

[MarkB]

Confusion: I have never heard complaints about this spell before. What in particular is it that bugs you about the confusion effect? Too much book keeping, or the annoyance of randomly lost actions?

I've seen it slow down gameplay significantly. If you manage to catch a good half-dozen NPCs in its effect, that's a lot of extra percentile rolls and table look-ups to perform. And given that some of the results of those rolls will send the subjects scurrying across the battlefield in various directions, you can easily end up with them scattered amongst other combatants, making it necessary to carefully track who is affected and who is not.

 

[NightCrawler]

Has anyone else "soft banned" spells or abilities like this?

No, i ve never banned such spells in my games but i have semi ban other things such as Bo9s ( i told my players that if they want to use this book i will use it too against them and that scared them so we agreed not to use it in my campaign).

I think these spells are fun to use but not all the time.

Creating a really dangerous situation once in a while for the PCs are making the game more realistic. PC understand that if they let the mage cast they may die or something so they have to think carefully and play tactics.

A few days back the party mage lost his concentration check to make a spell and escape from sure death that was coming on the next round. We all were eager to see what will happen but in the last minute he said "Resist fate" (he is a fatespinner) and he made the roll again and he manage to escape leaving all party speechless, epesially me

 

[akbearfoot]

They could also cast the spell (assuming they aren't threatened) move in and touch their target all in the same round without drawing an AoO (unless reach is involved).

I'm pretty sure this is incorrect.

Delivering the touch can be done as part of the casting of the spell, which requires you to be adjacent to an enemy. If you aren't next to someone you still use your standard action and end up holding the charge. If you then move up to a bad guy now you've used your standard and move action for the round and have no more actions to make the attack.

Thats the way I always understood it at any rate.

 

[MarkB]

I'm pretty sure this is incorrect.

It isn't, but the specific rules text is well buried within the Combat chapter:

Touch Spells in Combat

Many spells have a range of touch. To use these spells, you cast the spell and then touch the subject, either in the same round or any time later. In the same round that you cast the spell, you may also touch (or attempt to touch) the target. You may take your move before casting the spell, after touching the target, or between casting the spell and touching the target. You can automatically touch one friend or use the spell on yourself, but to touch an opponent, you must succeed on an attack roll.

Emphasis added.

 

[akbearfoot]

neat....that means our gaming group has been playing it wrong for years.

 

[mvincent]

Has anyone else "soft banned" spells or abilities like this?

I would love to, but that includes almost everything in D&D at higher levels. Example:
In an encounter vs. 3 hezrou demons, everyone is hit with blasphemy, chaos hammer, unholy blight and three separate stenches every round. It's extremely complicated. I end up handing the players (as they are affected) cards describing:
1) Dazed (from blasphemy)
2) Slowed (Chaos Hammer)
3) Sickened (Unholy Blight, or if they succeed their save vs. one of the stenches)
4) Nauseated (if they fail their save vs. one of the stenches)

They then hand the cards back when the associated effect expires.

I also have someone write down (directly on the battlemat) the weakened Str penalties, duration and who's affected, crossing them off as they expire (since they overlap, it can get complicated after 5 rounds or so).

Luckily, the rounds go pretty quick because none of the PC's can do anything after being dazed, slowed, immobile from str penalties and/or nauseated.

I honestly don't know how the designers managed with all these abilities.