SPOILER WARNING: A thread about the Harry Potter books

[Umbran]

Unless you speak them nonverbally, which Bellatrix seems to have done to a fox in HBP.

Somewhere in the mix of the books, I think casting without speaking is mentioned as difficult, but highly useful. A thing usually done by advanced mages, requiring extra concentration and such.

 

[WayneLigon]

There's a few ltitle hints, or so I take them, that you don't get much of a choice in going to Hogwart's or not. If you're a Wizard or Witch - and it's obvious that that is something you're born into - you get the letter when you turn 11 and that's that. They have only hinted about what's done with rogue wizards, but I get the idea that if you don't get training, and get it quick, your abilities contnue to manifest uncontrolled. That can't be a good thing.

If there are other books after the next, if Harry survives the experience, I'd like to see just what an Auror does. I suspect that at least part of their purview is to track down and deal with untrained wizards.

They also hint that what we've seen are the bare beginnings of what real wizard abilities are. They seem to have a small set of common abilities, the stuff you get in the school: flight, teleportation, levitation, potion making, energy control, transformations, curses and a handful of other things depending on your specific aptitude. (My own pet theory is that Hogwart's isn't really there is teach you magic, per se, it's there so they can keep an eye on you so you don't destroy yourself and others with your powers before you can control them). Then after that, people go off and experiment and develop their own particular paths and abilities.

 

[billd91]

If they simple summarily executed everybody the sorting hat picked for Slytherin the world would be a happier place. Seriously, between the fact that everybody who joins Voldemort (Including Voldy himself) is a Slytherin, the heir of Slytherin deal, the fact that the guy who founded Slytherin was a genocidal maniac, and the fact that apparently joining house Slytherin carries a mind-altering enchantment that turns you into an Ass, I can imagine no reason for the house to exist.

Except that most people who go through Slytherin didn't end up as followers of Voldemort. He had a substantial number of followers, sure, from that house. But since the main qualification for being in Slytherin is a fair amount of ruthless ambition, I would also bet that a substantial portion of the Ministry itself went through that house, politicians and civil servants being what they are.
Besides, Slytherin is a good stand in for that old British aristocratic snobbery in the schools and society.
I suspect that Rowling introduced Slughorn as a former head of Slytherin to be an antidote to the house being too dark. Slughorn may be a bit of a snob, but he's a genuinely decent and genial one... particularly if he thinks you'll end up a person of significance or exhibit a natural talent that he values (like Lily Evans and her potions work).

 

[billd91]

[sblock]Yeah, just like Hermione and Ron aren't going with Harry... wait! It's alright for them to join Harry, but if Ginny wants to help him, his words are final. Because Harry doesn't care if Ron or Hermione die and it's his fault? Understandable, with Harry being such a paramour and lovesick teddy-bear, being together with Ginny for so long and not really knowing these other two.

To me, it's another selfish decision from Harry; one he clearly can make, but it's selfish nonetheless, and the longer the books grow, the less I'm sure whether I'm supposed to like him. Of course, that is made up for by pondering what it means. Is the Voldemort soul gaining control over Harry (the "Slytherin" part of Harry)? At the moment, I'd say yes, and before being finally overcome and turned into Voldemort II, Harry will sacrifice himself. But I'm still angry at him [/sblock]

[sblock]One thing to remember is that Harry is still an adolescent. He'll make poor choices, particularly in affairs of the heart, just like we all did... and it's because we were dumb and inexperienced.
As far as being more protective of Ginny than Ron and Hermione, he's been getting into danger with them for years. They're grandfathered in. Harry thinks he's being noble, but I'll bet Ginny weighs in in the next book with a bit more force than Harry expects or the end of book six suggests. She's much more like Fred and George than Ron or Percy. She won't be that easy to put off.[/sblock]

 

[billd91]

- Hermione is clearly Harry's superior as a wizard, in every respect except flying magic.

Hermione is certainly just about the smartest wizard of her age, very clever, very well read. But Harry is quicker with his decisions and has proven to be very good at surviving. Certainly not things to be dismissed and generally more applicable to his ambition to be an auror.

- I wonder how many parents would place their children at Hogwart's, if such a place existed (if magic and Voldemort and all the rest actually existed.) If they would, would they tolerate Hogwart's treatment of their children. Would they, for example, tolerate the high injury rate associated with Quidditch? Would they tolerate life threatening detentions in the Forbidden Forest?

One thing to remember is that the wizard world has bona fide 'healers' and not just doctors. Magic can very quickly mend bones and other mundane sorts of injuries. And magic, while being immensely powerful on one hand, also seems to be relatively benign on the other. Most magical accidents seem to just end up in peope having bizarre behavioral quirks or other problems that, while serious, aren't critical or immediately fatal. It's almost like there's some kind of natural brake that gets put on magic that keeps it from being insanely destructive without the intention of making it so. The fact that the unforgivable curses seem to require you to really want to inflict that sort of pain or death on someone bears this out.

 

[Berandor]

[sblock]One thing to remember is that Harry is still an adolescent. He'll make poor choices, particularly in affairs of the heart, just like we all did... and it's because we were dumb and inexperienced.
As far as being more protective of Ginny than Ron and Hermione, he's been getting into danger with them for years. They're grandfathered in. Harry thinks he's being noble, but I'll bet Ginny weighs in in the next book with a bit more force than Harry expects or the end of book six suggests. She's much more like Fred and George than Ron or Percy. She won't be that easy to put off.[/sblock]

Yeah. I just hope she's not punished for it and Harry's proven right, that's all.

 

[Edena_of_Neith]

(is reading through your responses, appreciates the feedback)

 

[Edena_of_Neith]

As you may have noticed, there was a significant change between the first book and the second. Gone was a lot of the nonsensical stuff, like everyone singing a different song at the same time and Dumbledore stepping up to say a few words of gibberish.
It's Good vs Evil, but not simple fairy tale stuff.
Snape is an interesting character. You need to read the rest of the series to understand the position he occupies in the tale.
Magic is extremely dangerous. You either learn how to deal with it and survive, or you will quite easily kill yourself. Better to learn that in a controlled environment than experimenting on your own without help.

Point taken. I will be reading Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets/Prisoner of Azrabah (sp?) / Goblet of Fire very soon, so I can better discuss the subject. Obviously, I can't do that with just the films.
Based on what I know of Snape so far (from books 1 and 5) I would say he is justified in being angry and bitter, but that is irrelevant: all anger does is eat you up and destroy you, without addressing the problem that made you angry (just my opinion.) And I would expect better than this out of Severus Snape: he dishonors himself and disgraces himself by his grudge and resultant behavior.
Magic IS extremely dangerous. What a pity that most Slytherins and most Griffindors, half of everyone else, most in the Ministry of Magic, and occasionally Dumbledore and Company themselves don't seem to realize this (grits teeth over said attitude problem ... ) If Voldemort isn't an object lesson, what is? (There should be a class at Hogwarts, and it should be called Voldemort 101. I mean it!)

 

[Edena_of_Neith]

I'm not going to answer all of them - some because I don't feel like it and others from sheer ignorance (like not having read the Pinnochio book).

If you have the time, read Pinnochio. It's an interesting read, especially in the context of Harry Potter.

My opinion of her is not as good as yours. I wouldn't hesitiate to call her a Good Writer, but I'm not ready to put her up on the pedastal with Tolkien and Asimov (the two I would put on top of the fantasy/sci-fi rankings, respectively) quite yet. She's certainly Great at her strengths, but here weaknesses are Average or even Poor. I don't begrudge her riches; she pretty much deserved to do well.

Each to their own, of course. Only time will tell on that. (heh, get back to you in about 50 to 100 years on this!)

I beg to differ - magic is certainly not 100% the subject of the stories, but it is hardly 0% either! The stories seem to me to be all about a study of how magic might exist in a modern society without mimicing or replacing technology.

I just got the overwhelming impression that the books were primarily about growing up, about responsibility and accepting it, about the pitfalls and problems of the world, and about consequences. Just my take.
Yes, of course it's magic rich. Poor Muggles got left out of the fun, though.

Hermione clearly has more intelligence and skill than Harry, but Harry has more raw power. She'd probably analyze-and-lose in a couple of situations where Harry acted-and-won.

I don't understand. What do you mean when you say: Harry has more raw power. What do you mean back that? What do you mean by raw power? (confused look)

(snip)

I don't think they quite got all the kinks worked out with Wizard School yet... I mean they let the House of Slytherin exist, right? It's hard to tell how much of the danger's real, and how much was set up to instill some fear in the students and curb overconfidence.

I merely wish to comment that I would prefer to make my own choice concerning which House I was put into. I don't believe that Sorting Hat should be determining - for the rest of their lives - which way children will go. It hasn't got that right.
If I was put at Hogwart's (theoretically) back when I was 11, and the Sorting Hat put me in Slytherin, I'd leave the school. If forced to remain, I'd refuse to work, causing my forced expulsion. That Hat wouldn't force me to stay around the likes of the Slytherins when I didn't want to be around them. (That goes for any of the other Houses, too, where appropriate.)
Yes, perhaps, children arriving and being Sorted had tendencies towards one House or another - AT THAT TIME. But children change, and people change. Dumbledore is completely out of line here (anyone got a handy Sphere of Annihilation that Sorting Hat could be stuffed in? )

Not quite. They wouldn't be keeping themselves so secret if they weren't at least somewhat aware in the backs of their minds that Muggles and their technology could destroy them. Even Valdemort seems pretty circumspect in how he kills them.

Well, the muggles have nuclear weapons and whatnot. But in a Muggle versus Wizard war, I think it'd be quick and decisive for the Wizards. Just my take.
The really big What If, which I can only speculate on, is the historical role of magic. For example, what role did magic (and Hogwart's) play in World War I?
I do think the wizards are being elitist about muggles. All of the wizards all being elitist. And this just messes up an already Voldemort-messed-up situation further.

 

[Umbran]

The really big What If, which I can only speculate on, is the historical role of magic. For example, what role did magic (and Hogwart's) play in World War I?

That way lies madness - the separation of Muggle and Wizard in the Potter universe is fine for YA fiction, but it quickly falls apart under scrutiny, and so do all elements of muggle-wizard world interactions. It ain't pretty