[SPOILERS] THE Return of the King Thread

[kengar]

Furthermore, this has got to be the worst job in all of Gondor; sitting your whole life on some snowcovered mountaintop watching for a fire that hasn't burned in centuries...

LOL

My co-worker saw ROTK midnight opening day & I took the day off to see it that afternoon. Thursday we went to lunch & yammered about the film and this was our comment on that scene.

Her: "Wow! That scene was awesome!"
Me: "Yeah, but what Gondorian colonel did you have to tick off to get that assignment!?
Her: "EXACTLY!"

 

[Orius]

Not to mention things which were missing which distracted me in their absence, but which perhaps aren't really low points in the movie, just things which bugged me as a Tolkien fan.
- Aragorn never directly challenges Sauron. There's this great moment where Aragorn grabs a Palantir and directly challenges Sauron. It's a big part of his accepting the mantle as King, and a big part of why the distraction works.
- Pippin's friendship with the son of the guard in Minas Tirith.
- Faramir + Eowyn in the Houses of Healing
- Aragorn proving his right to rule by fulfilling the prophecy about being a healer.
- No wrap-up for Saruman.
- Not enough new characters. There's Prince What's-his-name (Imrahil?), and those Pukel-men or whatever. Hmm. As you can tell, these are obviously not that important to me as I can't remember much about them. But in any case, I waited for them and they weren't there .
- Wrapup story for Legolas and Gimli missing.
- No "Mouth of Sauron" character at the Black Gate.

I agree on the palantir, the Druedain, and the Mouth.

Basically in the books, Aragorn uses the palantir, takes control of it from Sauron, and shows him the sword. Basically, he does as a way of saying to Sauron, "I got the Ring, now I'm coming to kick your ass." It scares Sauron, which is why he launches his attack ahead of time. Naturally, PJ wopuldn't be able to squeeze all that in, but putting in some of it would have been cool.

I did miss the Mouth. That would have made the scene before the Black Gate more powerful.

Didn't need the guard or his son. It would have taken up even more time in a film that was already pretty rushed.

Same with Faramir and Eowyn. It's not really important to the overall plot.

Imrahil would also have been unneeded. It's harder to introduce a lot of extra named characters in a movie than book, because it's harder for the audience to keep track of the characters.

 

[barsoomcore]

- Not enough new characters. There's Prince What's-his-name (Imrahil?), and those Pukel-men or whatever. Hmm. As you can tell, these are obviously not that important to me as I can't remember much about them. But in any case, I waited for them and they weren't there .

Yes they were -- you just weren't paying attention.

The Pukel-men were clearly visible at the turns on the switchback up to Dunharrow -- the shot of the mysterious rider coming up the road shows a Pukel-man crouching behind him/her. They're statues.

You're probably talking about Ghan-Buri-Ghan, though, aren't you? Yeah, no Ghan which was disappointing.

And Prince Imrahil is most definitely there -- watch the crowd scenes during Aragorn's coronation and you'll see the swan banner of Imrahil quite prominently. I mean, okay, we don't actually see the Prince, but come on! What more do you want?

 

[ZosKia]

And the charge of the Rohirim... DEATH! Heh. Wouldn't everybody who sat in the cinema that moment just liked to exchange their seats with a Rohan steed and just charge down into the screen at the army of orcs...?

Hi Dispater,
That is exactly how I felt!

 

[Napftor]

Just saw the movie and have only skimmed through the thread, so forgive me if I repeat any earlier arguments. Please bear in mind that I have not read the book and am unlikely to in the near future. Oh, and it's like 130 am.

Great effects and combat sequences. They do not, however, make up for the lack of emotion I felt for the characters. No weeping took place in these eyes. And the ending....egads!!! What was Peter Jackson smoking when he dragged that thing out for an extra 30 minutes?!

PJ: "We've finished the movie so let's go get plastered!"
Crewman: "But Mr. Jackson we can't. There's still 3 million left in our budget."
PJ: "Oh. Well in that case, let's just tack some scenes onto the end. Oh I know. Bilbo and Frodo can go along with the elves on their magical journey! Hmm...a gratuitous return to the Shire's tavern and Sam's wedding will spend the money nicely as well."
Crewman: "That's....urm...appropriate I guess. But why does Frodo need to go with the elves?"
PJ: "Are you kidding? By the end of this mega-movie, everyone in the theater will have to go! Get it?! Mwahahaha!"

Anywho, the characters are given their chances to shine, but it is for such a short time in each instance, that I just lost any feeling for them by the end. Certainly glad the good guys won and all, but could we lose the new subplot with Faramir and his father please? The demented steward of Minas-Tirith's story wasn't worth the film time it was given. Blech. Didn't mind the repeat bashings he received from Gandalf though. Speaking of which, where the hell was the magic? So he casts a light spell on the nasguls? Don't strain yourself.

There were good things, of course. McKellen's portrayal of Gandalf is great as always. The pacing is waaaaaaay better than in TTT. Always good to see some undead action, even if their involvement in the battle was a bit too quick. Jackson should have added more to that battle and less to the ending. Um, can't think of much else at the moment.

So my rating is 6.5/10. TTT was 4/10 with FotR still being my favorite at 8.5/10.

OK, you can tear into me now.

EDIT: Forgot about the witch-king. Very cool with a Soth-like air and appearance. Great promise with his line about Gandalf, "I will break him." And then his coolness is truck down in an instant. I'm not upset at the circumstances of his demise, only in the fact that his nasgul killed more people than he did.

 

[Buttercup]

Napftor, it's really interesting to see the reactions of people who have not read the books.

Since you haven't read this whole thread, you probably won't know that all the scenes you're objecting to appear in the books. Well, more or less. The book goes on for quite a while after Aragorn is crowned, and those chapters are so beloved by fans that if PJ had left them out he would have had rotten fruit thrown at him every time he appeared in public.

As for Denethor, in the book it makes much more sense and is an important part of the plot. PJ left out the reason Denethor went mad, though, so I can see why people who hadn't read the books would be confused.

You didn't have an emotional reaction to the Sam/Frodo storyline? Wow.

 

[barsoomcore]

What's a Soth?

 

[shilsen]

What's a Soth?

A male Sith, silly!

 

[Napftor]

...You didn't have an emotional reaction to the Sam/Frodo storyline? Wow.

Hi Buttercup. How have you been since I saw you at GenCon?

No, I did not have an emotional reaction. I wept during the first movie but there was so much more time with the characters together as a fellowship then. RotK was...just so back and forth. And I also remember wondering why Sam could not just throw in the Ring on his own. So what if it was "Frodo's task?" The fate of the world was riding on them. Sam would not have minded if Frodo took the credit should that circumstance have occured.

And something else I remember: Where the hell did those eagles come from at the end? I do recall one saving Gandalf from the top of that tower. But they have not been seen since! Did 'ol white robes have them on speed dial?! I;m sure this is explained in the books as well, but there was zilch in the movie (could have taken time from the end sequences to explain this in the middle ).

 

[Zamdrist]

Ebert's review

The story is a little too silly????

Could Ebert be more out of touch with reality? What's more relevent today than the understanding that evil cannot be placated and must be fought head on?

Wow...