Stat requirements

[Artoomis]

My call: because his STR was reduced below 13, he temporarily loses access to Power Attack (and any feat on the PA chain). Why? Because he no longer has a 13 STR....

Actually, he should NOT lose the benefits of feats that require Power Attack. While he may not be entitled to the benefits of Power Attack as his STR is too low, he does not lose the feat, so other feats that rely on him only having Power Attack should still work just fine.

 

[IanB]

Actually, he should NOT lose the benefits of feats that require Power Attack. While he may not be entitled to the benefits of Power Attack as his STR is too low, he does not lose the feat, so other feats that rely on him only having Power Attack should still work just fine.

Well, as far as I know all the feats in the P.A. chain list cumulative prerequisites, which is to say, they all say strength 13 anyway. I understand your point, though.

 

[Dimwhit]

Actually, he should NOT lose the benefits of feats that require Power Attack. While he may not be entitled to the benefits of Power Attack as his STR is too low, he does not lose the feat, so other feats that rely on him only having Power Attack should still work just fine.

That's where I'd disagree with you. If you lose the benefit of Power Attack, I think you should likewise lose the benefit of any feat with Power Attack as a prerequisite.

Do the rules, or even FAQ, speak directly to this point? I'd be interested to know. But that's how I'd rule it.

 

[Artoomis]

That's where I'd disagree with you. If you lose the benefit of Power Attack, I think you should likewise lose the benefit of any feat with Power Attack as a prerequisite.

Do the rules, or even FAQ, speak directly to this point? I'd be interested to know. But that's how I'd rule it.

I think the FAQ has an entry about this, but I do not recall for sure. The idea is that you still have the Feat, even if you cannot use it for some reason.

 

[KarinsDad]

I'm not actually sure what you mean here. Can you clarify?

A +4 Int bonus from a Headband of Intellect is not the same as a +4 bonus from Fox's Cunning if you rule that the Headband gives bonus spell slots.

All "equivalent sounding" aspects of the game are not always equivalent.

 

[Infiniti2000]

That's where I'd disagree with you. If you lose the benefit of Power Attack, I think you should likewise lose the benefit of any feat with Power Attack as a prerequisite.

But then, if you use CW16, you also lose all PrC abilities if that PrC depended on having that feat. Fortunately, the text on feats only says you cannot use it.

KD, that is an excellent example to illustrate that bonuses are not the same.

 

[Dimwhit]

Excuse me being dense, but what is CW16?

 

[KarinsDad]

Excuse me being dense, but what is CW16?

Complete Warrior page 16

 

[Twowolves]

Which, if you don't use the rules in CW, I can totally understand.

And to Twowolves, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on the potential for unpleasantness and lack of fun aspect. You see that as a problem, and I see the player who whines about it (particularly when he knew about it in advance) as the problem. Maybe that means you are nicer than I am. I've just recently started taking the whole "life is too short to game with people you don't like gaming with" philosophy to heart, so I might be overdoing it a bit.

I totally agree with you here. I only game with friends I've had for over 10 years (well, except for my new bride ). It's not a matter of these things becoming a problem at all for us. I'm very fortunate that my players don't try to look at the rules too closely, but I want to provide internal consistency and across the board fairness. Back in previous editions, we'd have lots of conversations over lunch or dinner that are the same sorts of things discussed on this forum. Only then, they all started with the posit "So, if you take a goblin....." (then apply whatever rules question you had to the poor beast).

 

[Dimwhit]

Thanks.

I hadn't read CW16 before. That seems to clear up things for me. Thanks!