D&D 5E Stats, and how do you generate them

[GMforPowergamers]

Point out to him that, since the point-buy method AND the stat array method both have a max possible score of 15 (before racial adjustments), that is how the game is designed. If he balks, tell him it is too much trouble for you to similarly boost the stats and powers of every monster and NPC to similar levels, so to save time you'll just give the monsters an additional +5 to every roll you make for them, including hp/HD.

I did try to point out the 15 being the high thing (although not with the +5 threat) but he truly believes that 5e is 100x deadlier then 4e and that it is a rocket tag game... he who hits first wins. So he wants really high Con and a high to hit...

one of his other points was that it is not uncommon to see saves at DC 15, witch to have a 50/50 shot of you need a 20 stat. So he thinks any stat below 14 is a major flaw...

 

[thalmin]

Aahhhh. He wants to play "Open the door (doesn't matter if it's locked); Kill the monster (don't bother with fighting it); take the treasure (no need to find it)!
I don't run that game! Hand him a game controller!

 

[txshusker]

well of the 2 that really want to roll they both claim that it is randomness they want... but both also complain it is unfair if they roll low.
.....
.....
1) 18,18,17,15,15,11
2) 18, 17, 16, 16,16,16
3) 18, 18, 18, 17, 17, 12

Wow... just... wow. Are they 12? Has puberty hit? When they play Monopoly do they have to start with Boardwalk and Park Place before the dice are rolled for the first time? They use cheat codes on home MMOs, don't they? Do they first read the last chapter of new books before reading the beginning and middle?

Since they haven't played 5e yet, can you tempt them with the array, discount racial bonuses and give them a +2 and +1 to 2 abilities they want? Then have them actually PLAY THE GAME, before they decide what they actually need to survive. Perhaps after a few encounters, they'll realize that it's not so bad. I mean, really, a 17 IS an 18. A 15 IS a 16, etc, when starting out. AND they get to raise their abilities later as they gain levels... That's never been an option before.

More than any other version I've played, 5e is less stat based to have a good time and survive combat than any other version. Sure, they help, but.... wow.

Good luck.

 

[delericho]

and one of the players pitched a fit that there where no 18's, and that the number's were way too low. I just now (before coming here) got a post on our private board asking If I could change the array choices to

1) 17, 16, 15, 13, 10, 10
2) 16, 16, 14, 13, 11, 11
3) 18, 16, 13, 12, 11, 11

I would consider very carefully whether I actually wanted to run the game for such a group. Because if this is the sort of grief you're getting before you start then I hate think what will happen the first time a PC dies.

And if the answer is "yes", and you still want to run the game, I would absolutely insist on some variant of point buy (or a fixed array). If they're going to cheat on random rolls (and it's pretty clear they are), then they shouldn't be rolling.

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

Huh. Well, different strokes and all that, but so far the pcs in my 5e game have been doing fine, and most of them have at least one stat with a negative modifier. Several have had a score of 6 somewhere, but I don't recall anything lower... yet.

Although there has been quite a field of slaughter from time to time, it's more about bad choices than about low saves. The worst effect I have seen from low stats has been incredibly an easy-to-surprise party with lots of passive Perceptions in the 8 to 9 range, because they keep putting those guys in the front.

Yep, that has been my experience in any edition. Give some players a stat array of straight 18's and they will just die one round later than they would have if they had a more realistic set from rolling 4d6. Players making smart choices tends to override the stuff on the sheet.

 

[billd91]

I did try to point out the 15 being the high thing (although not with the +5 threat) but he truly believes that 5e is 100x deadlier then 4e and that it is a rocket tag game... he who hits first wins. So he wants really high Con and a high to hit...

one of his other points was that it is not uncommon to see saves at DC 15, witch to have a 50/50 shot of you need a 20 stat. So he thinks any stat below 14 is a major flaw...

At this point, I'd be telling that player to just shut up and play. I know it's politically correct to make sure everyone's having fun (and usually a good idea) but some players just need to be told to shut up or ship out.

 

[doctorhook]

3 rolls of {best 2 of (1…4)(1…4)(1…4)}+7 which will result in (1…4)+(1…4)+7, for a range of ((1+1)…(4+4))+7 or (2…8)+7, for a final range of 9…15.
the other 3 rolls are one point lower, for 8-14.

giving a total range of 8-15, with a maximum {15,15,15,14,14,14} and a minimum of {9,9,9,8,8,8}.

Which is one pretty slick range handling.

Thanks, friend! I worked hard on it.

 

[goldwyrm]

Last few years I've been using 4d6 throw out lowest and in order (sometimes rearranged), and then an extra d6 is rolled and the player can distribute that bonus to one or more stats but not go over 18 (before racial modifiers). Gives them a chance to pull really dire stat rolls into -1 territory or make a mediocre character statline more heroic.

 

[Li Shenron]

It's quite funny how much stat generation methods is still possibly the most debated and HR topics of the game... I don't actually think it matters that much!

I think it's pointless to fine-tune the default methods. What is not pointless, is to decide the level of randomness.

When I am a player, I like randomness so usually I choose the default random generation method.

As a DM I normally just allow all the default PHB methods, let the players choose which one (at least if the alternatives are balanced with each other). If I want to speed up starting the game, I might just use the default array.

 

[Paraxis]

I prefer point buy above all else but I made a concession to some of my more old school players and let them roll. It is all done in roll20 so the roll is seen by all and recorded, if they don't like the roll I let them use the default array but not the point buy. You either get to customise (min/max) with the points or take your chances.

I do the same thing for hit points, you can either take half+1 as you level or roll. Weirdly the only one that rolls for the most part is the barbarian and he always rolls bad.

I dislike the fact that the default point buy is less than the average rolled stats so my next campaign I will give them 30 points instead of 27 and expand the chart so they can purchase up to 18's.