Still No classes, but now it is by creature type

Sravoff

First Post
See post 12 for new rules!

This is a new Idea I have come up with. There are no regular classes only feats which emulate class abilites. Since some abilities are stonger than other some abilities cost more feats than others. Each character gets x (I am thinking four but maybe more) feats per level. Theses feats can used to get any feat out of any book and/or to get class abilities. They are also used to increase bab,saves,and hit dice.

I have started with spellcasting and have come up with these trees.
Code:
Arcane Training
               |
               |
             / | \
           /   |   \
         /     |     \
Bard2   |     Sorcerer4
           Wizard3


Divine Awarness
                  |
                  |
                / | 
              /   |   
            /     |
Paladin2 |
                Cleric3    


Call Of The Wild
                  |
                  |
                / | 
              /   |   
            /     |
Ranger2 |
                Druid3


Spell Casting Feat
                         |
                         |
                       / | \ 
                     /   |   \  
                   /     |     \________________
Increase CL |                                          \
         Open Metamagic One                All Other Non-Metamgaic Magic Feats
                         |                  \______
          Open Metamagic Two      \
                         |                 \______   Any Metamagic One Feats
         Open Metamagic Three    \
                         |                \______   Any Metamagic Two Feats
         Open Metamagic Four      \
                         |                                  Any Metamagic Three Feats
             Any Metamagic Four Feat
[edit] Sorry about the metamagic tree. Once you get metamagic one you can get metamagic one feats. And so on down the line.[/edit]

First you must get the apropriate starting feat. Arcane Training, Call Of The Wild,or Divine Awarness. After you have selected that feat, you may spend feats on caster levels. Each caster level has a cost in feats. To increase your wizard caster level you must spend three feats. That is three feats every time your caster level increases. So to be a twentieth level wizard you would have invvested 60 feats into you wizards spell casting ability. Caster level determines what level spell you can cast/how many you can cast and everything else. Familiars ect.

You must also "unlock" the ability to use metamagic feats. This is covered under the Open Metamgaic (1/2/3/or4). A metamagic one feat increases the spell level by one. A metamagic two feat increases the spell level by two, and o on for three and four.

Base attack bonus is increased by one for every feat you put into it. So to have a base attack bonus of four, you have put four feats into it.

With all areas, you may only increase something once per level. ie, if your base attack bonus is three you could increase it to four, but not fie until you get another level. This also goes for caster level.

What do you think so far. I only have the spell system you see here completed. I am working on class abilities. Also balancing it so you cannot create classes more powerful than normal. Such as a wizard with good bab and can use all weapons. So tell me what you like dislike/hate and if this has already been done.

Thanks in advance

-Sravoff
 
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Hmmm....somebody here did a really cool system like this, but for the life of me I can't recall who it was...

*looks through files*

Ah! It was DrSpunj! I don't have the address of the thread, though :(
 

John Q. Mayhem said:
Hmmm....somebody here did a really cool system like this, but for the life of me I can't recall who it was...

*looks through files*

Ah! It was DrSpunj! I don't have the address of the thread, though :(

Unfortunate... If any one knows of the thread, please post!

Thanks

In the mean time, more to this system.

-Sravoff
 

HD: Every level characters get 1d4 hp. However, at every level, they may spend feats to increase this die. Every one feat they spend increases the hd die type by one to a maximum of 1d12. This increase is for that level only. d4>d6>d8>d10>d12.

Saves: Every one gets all poor saves. For each feat invested into saves the character gets one good save at level one. Additional levels and invested feats increase this level. Joe warrior Magi has so far spent nothing on saves, he is level 5. All his saves are +1. He then spends two feats on saves. He now has two good saves. Fortitude and Will. Both these saves are at abse of +3. +1 for fifth level poor save and +1 for first level good save. If next level he increased his fortitude and will again, by spending a feat, both his will and fort would be base of +4. His reflex would be +2 because he is sixth level.

Class Abilities: All class abilities cost one feat to either get, or to increase. Remove disease 1/week cost one feat. To increase this to remove disease 2/week cost another feat. Some abilities may cost more or less in future editions of this system.

I am still working on balancing the costs of abilities.

-Sravoff
 

Sravoff said:
HD: Every level characters get 1d4 hp. However, at every level, they may spend feats to increase this die. Every one feat they spend increases the hd die type by one to a maximum of 1d12. This increase is for that level only. d4>d6>d8>d10>d12.

So to keep up with a standard Barbarian, you are spending 4 feats every level. You'll also need extras to get Rage, Uncanny Dodge, and other standard Barbarian abilities. Plus extras for the normal feats that standard characters get every 3rd level.

That's a bare minimum of five or six feats every level, before going into using feats to increase saves and other standard abilities. Up it to 7 or 8 every level, and you can probably get close to the standard classes and their ability trees.


Sravoff said:
I am still working on balancing the costs of abilities.

-Sravoff

Yeah, things like the saves and HP are going to be the real problem, here. You would also struggle to balance the BAB of characters, otherwise you can end up with a spellcaster with D8 for HP, and the saves and BAB of a Fighter.

Don't get me wrong, it's a cool idea. It should make any character completely customizable (a fighting class with Cleric buffing spells, Rage, and Favoured Enemies) but it will also make for a very difficult and complex tree of Feats once it's finished. Very complicated, and very hard to balance.

Be interested to see how it looks in a few months ;)
 

Yes balancing is needed badly.
Current Feats level one/level 20
Barbarian...7/133
Bard.........8/142
Cleric........7/115
Druid.........9/146
Fighter......5/91
Monk.........8/142
Paladin......7/130
Ranger.......8/148
Rogue........6/133
Sorcerer.....5/131
Wizard........6/96

I am still working on it, so if I get any breakthroughs I'll post em here. Suggestions always welcome!

-Sravoff
 

Sravoff said:
Saves: Every one gets all poor saves.
Perhaps if you start at the baseline, the minimum for any PC class in existence, it might work better. So, one good save (of the player's choice), then 'buy' the rest?

edit --- and likewise with BAB, how about the 1/2 HD minimum progression, and purchase better? (edit that edit - that might not work with the methods you're proposing, I can see that. Feel free to ignore that bit.)

also though, there's Buy The Numbers, a pdf that might shed some more light on this kind of mechanics breakdown, though that's gone a more complex route than the feat-based progression.
 
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If you don't have something put into everything at every level<-making sense here too late at night.

The idea is to ahve each level be custom tailored into what you want it to be, one level would be complete rogue, highg sjkills sneak attack, the next could be pure spellcasting, the next be melle while after that its archery. Not that great of an idea but it could happen. Perhaps that would help though, I will think about it. Minimums wuld be nice.

Thanks!

-Sravoff
 

Actually, yeh. The buying of individual points in saves etc. would be the way to do it. My mistake. I was thinking about two things at once, and that's a bit like chewing gum and walking. :heh:
 

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