Strategies vs. High AC (My Players Stay Out!)

[Calico_Jack73]

Magic Missile always works. A Wizard flying around with a Shield spell up casting Magic Missiles and Fireballs is always something to fear. Improved Invisibility and Blink can be added to that equation if you want to be really mean.

 

[billd91]

I've got a few AC monkeys IMC, and I'm looking for ways to bring them down off of their high horses. The worst offenders are:

1) Githzerai Monk + Feral Template (from Savage Species)......+6 natural armor, +4 'mage armor', obscene dex, and a great Wisdom....his AC is regularly in the '30's. Also has Combat Expertise, so.....

2) Feral (from Savage Species) Vanara (from OA) Druid.......not nearly as bad as the above, but still bad enough....and Combat Expertise....

One solution to avoiding the problem in the future: don't allow the feral template for PCs and especially don't allow it for any character wanting to be a monk. Feral creatures are uncivilized and at only a +1 level adjustment, pretty unbalanced even with the -4 to intelligence. How something that uncivilized is going to be integrated enough into githzerai society to become a monk is beyond me.
If you can wield enough authority over your game, tell the players you made a mistake allowing the feral template in the first place and tell them to revise their characters to get rid of it but hold to the same XPs. They should get a character level out of it, a bunch of skill points, and be back into balance.
It may be hard, but touch attacks are still pretty much the way to go if you can do it. They'll ignore that +6 for natural armor as well as any other armor or shield bonus.

 

[MarauderX]

Add in some things that only need to make touch attacks to have an effect, such as Ropers.

Have them be surprised so the high AC monk won't have a chance to get his mage armor up.

Black Tentacles is a great spell; have your BBEG use it often in order to escape.

Swarms are nice too, as mentioned.

You could go the tons of peons route, and then add in a BBEG that has a super high attack bonus (fighter-build archer, high Dex, Manyshot, magic bow, etc.) that might tag the PCs once per round.

 

[Ovinomancer]

What is the party composition? If you have a six person party, then these two are not adding anything to the group. They can't be hit, but don't seem to be able to inflict damage either. The group should provide a check on this by not supporting the lone wolves. And anything that targets the high AC guys will walk on the more traditional AC members of the party, so be careful.

That said, I play a character that walks around with an AC of 22. But I can jack that into the 40's in a single round. however, because I am in a group, and need to provide support to them, I can count the times I have done this on the fingers of one hand. My AC is in the 40's, but my attack bonus is below 10.

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

Well, a lot of things have already been mentioned. One thing that hasn't: nets. Plain ordinary nets work on a touch attack and entangle foes making them easier to hit.

Of all the other suggestions, I think the best one is "Get rid of the feral template." (Especially on a Githzerai--they're supposed to be disciplined and spiritual not feral). Even if the AC adjustments weren't significant, fast healing is worth the LA all by itself--in fact, it's probably worth more than the LA.

Examining your stat generation system is also a good idea. I notice that both the githzerai monk AND the druid have combat expertise. Int is hardly a primary stat for either class (in fact, it's usually a dump stat for both) so the presence of Expertise on two obviously "powergamed" characters is an indication to me that overly generous stats amy be part of the problem. IME, allowing 36 point buy characters is at least worth +1 ECL vis a vis 25-28 point characters. If your points are higher than that, you're probably on the order of +2 ECL effectiveness just from stats.

The second best one is magic missile. It always hits. And it doesn't do any more damage to the rest of the party.

Glitterdust and Blindness/Deafness are also good ideas. So much for that dex bonus. Hello hitability. Sound Burst would work too. (I'm guessing that the monk and the druid both have very good will saves but with level adjustments, their fort saves are probably just mediocre--and don't be afraid to make NPCs good at what they do. A 4th level cleric with 18 wis and Greater Spell Focus Evocation has DC 18 sound bursts. If you allow the feat, give him spellcasting prodigy too for DC 19. That's quite possible under 28 point buy (start with a 17 use the 4th level statbump to 18) and it's perfectly feasible that gifted and focussed characters (the in game description of somewhat power-gamed characters) exist among the villains as well as among the heroes).

Evard's Black Tentacles is an excellent suggestion.

Other good foes include brown bears, polar bears, and dire bears. "Unhittable" PCs are often smoked by such foes.

A few good rogues with Improved Feint could do a number on them too (especially if they chugged potions of glibness before the battle .

Also consider mixed groups. If the NPC cleric casts Bear's Heart and Recitation and the NPC bard uses a natural horn (Song and Silence--in 3.5, I'd limit the doubling of Inspire courage to +2/+2 just like it was in 3.0 otherwise it has real potential for abuse) to inspire courage, all of the NPC mooks just got +7 to hit and +4 (or +5 (with a 2-handed weapon) to damage. If we're looking at an EL 9 encounter, that could be 1 7th level cleric (Bear's Heart is on a scroll), 3 5th level warriors, and a 2nd level bard. Assuming elite stat array half-orc warriors (15+2 (race)+1 level=18 str; for true DM cheese, use real orcs for a 20 str) with masterwork weapons and weapon focus, that's +18 to hit and they hit for enough damage that even those characters won't be able to ignore them.

Alternatively, you could try a cloudkill spell out on them (I think CR 6 Mezzoloths get it as a SLA). That should teach them to respect monsters (and the penalties of belonging to templated +ECL races--you're much more vulnerable to such things than people with actual levels).

Party pressure is another thing you could try though it really punishes the other players for the "unhittable" characters' annoying uselessness. If the monsters find that two characters are good enough to avoid everything that gets thrown at them, have them ignore the "unhittable" ones and maul the rest of the party. Then when everyone else is dead, they can afford to take forever to kill the annoying pests. (This works best if you somehow arrange for the rest of the party to stabilize and then have the annoying beasts drag their last kill (the monk and/or druid) back to their lair and devour them). When it's all over, explain that "unhittability" means nothing unless you actually present a credible threat to the monsters and prevent the monsters from ignoring you. (Which is the real reason that super high AC, good for nothing else, characters annoy me intensely--their presence does nothing to stop the enemies from killing their companions meaning that the other characters are no better off for those characters presence in the party). Otherwise, players are reasonably likely to draw the conclusion that everyone needs "unhittable" ACs in order to survive and you'll have an entire party of useless twits.