D&D General Stripping the Wizard to Bare Bones (+)

[Stormonu]

I'm contemplating gutting the wizard of their spells. At least, sharply restricting what spells are available to ALL wizards. I want to move most of the spells off to the various schools for the subclasses and leave a very small core of spells that all know - the most iconic of spells that make up a "wizard". Something in the neighborhood of 3-5 spells per level. It's a huge task, and I'd like to get opinions on what should stay as essential to a wizard's identity. This is my initial thoughts:

CANTRIPS

• Blade Ward (every wizard benefits from preventing taking damage)
• Firebolt (the most basic magic attack spell)
• Light (an essential "human" spell to see by)
• Mage Hand (basic "move [dangerous] things at a distance)
• Prestidigitation (universal near magic)
• Message (basic magical communication)

1ST LEVEL

• Detect Magic (essential magical detection)
• Magic Missile (I think there'd be a riot if this wasn't core to the wizard)
• Mage Armor (pretty basic magical protection)
• Shield (again, magical protection - might be better reserved for the Abjurer)
• Find Familiar (basic magical companion)
• Identify (basic magic item identification)

2ND LEVEL

• Blindness/Deafness (simple defense)
• Invisibility (core magical protection)
• Levitate (basic magical movement)
• Rope Trick (basic extradimensional space)

3RD LEVEL

• Counterspell (basic magic defense)
• Dispel Magic (basic magic denial)
• Fireball (core blast spell)
• Fly (advanced magical movement)
• Magic Circle (essential magical summons protection)

4TH LEVEL

• Arcane Eye (basic magical scrying)
• Dimension Door (moderate magical movement)
• Private Sanctum (basic magical space)

5TH LEVEL

• Animate Objects (advanced magical companion)
• Contact Other Plane (advanced knowledge acquisition)
• Geas (advanced magical compulsion)
• Legend Lore (advanced knowledge acquisition)
• Scrying (advanced scrying)
• Teleportation Circle (advanced magical movement)

No base spells of 6th+level

I am considering any long casting time spell (1 minute or more) being dropped into the "Core".

I'm open to discussion about what spells should be left in the core, but not whether it should be done (hence the "+"). Let the debate begin!

 

[Atomoctba]

I would say that lightning bolt is the "core line spell" even if for no other reason that the story of the game.

 

[DEFCON 1]

If this list is meant to be baseline "universal magic" for all Wizards... and then the individual Schools would fill out the rest of the list for each wizarding character based upon their subclass School selection... then my one comment would be to not have almost any Attack spells in the universal list. Not all wizards would be attacking people. The PCs? Well, sure. But most wizards in-world are probably teachers and scholars and sages and such, and as a result would not have any combat ability as baseline.

So for the most part I think your list is good for the various levels... I personally would just remove Fire Bolt and Fireball out of them at a minimum. Those would be the Evoker's bread-and-butter, not for all wizards. Magic Missile might be the only Attack spell I might keep on your list, as you make a good point that it's kind of grandfathered in as the one Wizard spell above all others. And since you can upcast it, wizards in theory don't need any others-- if they need to attack, they can just cast Magic Missiles.

 

[TwoSix]

I'm contemplating gutting the wizard of their spells. At least, sharply restricting what spells are available to ALL wizards. I want to move most of the spells off to the various schools for the subclasses and leave a very small core of spells that all know - the most iconic of spells that make up a "wizard". Something in the neighborhood of 3-5 spells per level. It's a huge task, and I'd like to get opinions on what should stay as essential to a wizard's identity. This is my initial thoughts:

CANTRIPS

• Blade Ward (every wizard benefits from preventing taking damage)
• Firebolt (the most basic magic attack spell)
• Light (an essential "human" spell to see by)
• Mage Hand (basic "move [dangerous] things at a distance)
• Prestidigitation (universal near magic)
• Message (basic magical communication)

1ST LEVEL

• Detect Magic (essential magical detection)
• Magic Missile (I think there'd be a riot if this wasn't core to the wizard)
• Mage Armor (pretty basic magical protection)
• Shield (again, magical protection - might be better reserved for the Abjurer)
• Find Familiar (basic magical companion)
• Identify (basic magic item identification)

2ND LEVEL

• Blindness/Deafness (simple defense)
• Invisibility (core magical protection)
• Levitate (basic magical movement)
• Rope Trick (basic extradimensional space)

3RD LEVEL

• Counterspell (basic magic defense)
• Dispel Magic (basic magic denial)
• Fireball (core blast spell)
• Fly (advanced magical movement)
• Magic Circle (essential magical summons protection)

4TH LEVEL

• Arcane Eye (basic magical scrying)
• Dimension Door (moderate magical movement)
• Private Sanctum (basic magical space)

5TH LEVEL

• Animate Objects (advanced magical companion)
• Contact Other Plane (advanced knowledge acquisition)
• Geas (advanced magical compulsion)
• Legend Lore (advanced knowledge acquisition)
• Scrying (advanced scrying)
• Teleportation Circle (advanced magical movement)

No base spells of 6th+level

I am considering any long casting time spell (1 minute or more) being dropped into the "Core".

I'm open to discussion about what spells should be left in the core, but not whether it should be done (hence the "+"). Let the debate begin!

Nice idea. If I were doing it, I would focus the wizard around force magic, space and time manipulation, and metamagic knowledge. But if you want to keep the absolute core of the classic AD&D wizard (modern versions of wizards are pretty much defined by their broad spell list, so I don't think they're a great reference), I think you're pretty close.

1st level, I'd drop Shield, Find Familiar, and Identify, and add in Feather Fall and Sleep.

2nd level, I'd drop Blindness/Deafness and add Web.

3rd level, I'd drop Magic Circle and add Haste.

4th level, I'd add Resilient Sphere and Phantasmal Killer.

5th level, I'd drop Geas and Legend Lore, and add Wall of Force.

That makes exactly 5 for each level.

 

[CreamCloud0]

Interesting concept, I’ll give this more thought tomorrow but for the moment: comprehend languages and chromatic orb? CL makes sense for all those old books and writings they’ll need to read for research and CO is like, six attacks in one, magic missile is good for sure hits but CO gives you versatility if you really need to hit something with a specific flavour,

 

[DEFCON 1]

As far as other universal spells? There are a couple I think you could probably add:

Cantrips: Mending
1st level: Floating Disk
2nd level: Arcane Lock
3rd level: Nondetection
4th level: Stoneskin (the most standard Wizard defensive spell)
5th level: Telekinesis (if they have Mage Hand, they'd have the advanced version, which is this)

 

[FrogReaver]

I would work backwards through the process to determine the core spells.

What spells should define subclasseses. Level 3 are the easiest.

Counterspell - abjuration
Fireball - evocation
Animate Dead - necromancy
Hypnotic Pattern - enchantment

I’d actually keep cantrips for all but give each subclass 1 bonus cantrip based on theme.

 

[Warpiglet-7]

I really hate that wizards can do everything…

I like the idea of true specialization…different wizards with different spells would feel different. And no more assuming the best broken spell combos for every wizard…

 

[CleverNickName]

Ooof... this is a big task.

I'm not sure if it's the best way to do it, but one way you could start is to use the spell lists from an older, less-bloated edition of the game. This is only a starting point, though... there is still a lot of work to be done. (Not all of the older-edition spells made it into 5E, some were renamed, others were moved to different levels or classes...) You'd probably end up writing/converting a quarter of the list yourself.

Another way would be to make subclass-specific spell lists. Evokers, Conjurers, Enchanters, and Necromancers all have their own unique spell lists, and there would be only a very small amount of overlap between them--spells like detect magic, mage armor, and maybe magic missile would be universal. This would allow for some niche protection between different wizard subclasses, since only certain subclasses would gain access to iconic wizard spells (fireball and lightning bolt are iconic Evocation spells, so they would only be on the Evoker's list. Animate dead and vampiric touch are found only on the Necromancer list. Shield and Counterspell are only on the Abjurer's list. And so on.)

That's a huge amount of work too, and a hefty dose of bookkeeping on top of it. And you'd expect even more push-back from your players than you're going to get as it is.

That's about all I've got. It's a good idea, but it is a big undertaking. Good luck!

 

[steeldragons]

Hmmm. Alright....let's see...

The Basics (Cantrips) all mages must learn at least three before being able to move on to full "spells."
Utility

• Affect Element : transmutation (move/shape/change existing air/earth/fire/water you have to work with)
• Detect Magic is moved/added here. : divination
• Light: evocation/illusion
• Mage Hand: conjuration/evocation
• Prestidigitation: transmutation/conjuration/illusion (depending on the use)
• Message: divination

Defenses

• Blade Ward: abjuration
• Featherfall: transmutation
• Resist Element (protection from various energy damage, and just normal debilitating temperatures): abjuration/transmutation

Offenses

• Mage Bolt: (choose fire, cold/ice, lightning, or force/raw magic energy) evocation
• Daze: (individual target flashbang, basically) illusion/conjuration
• Hexing Glare: (apply penalties to enemies or bonuses to allies) transmutation

1ST LEVEL Universals

• Abjuration: Hold Portal, Shield
• Conjuration: Unseen Servant, Wall of Fog
• Divination: Comprehend Languages, Detect Poison
• Enchantment: Charm Person, Sleep
• Evocation: Magic Missile, Arcane Arc (formerly Burning -or freezing or shocking- Hands)
• Illusion: Disguise Self, Color Spray
• Transmutation: Enlarge, Floating Disc
• (Necromancy: Chill Touch, False Life)

Detect Magic: move to cantrip
Mage Armor: move to abjuration specialist
Find Familiar - move to ritual - replacement Conjuration above
Identify - move to ritual - replacement Divination above

2ND LEVEL Universals

• Abjuration: Misty Step, Wizard Lock
• Conjuration: Rope Trick, Web
• Divination: Detect Invisibility, Detect Thoughts
• Enchantment: Blindness/Deafness, Hold Person
• Evocation: Shatter, Arcane Ray (formerly Scorching - or frosting or electrified - Ray)
• Illusion: Invisibility, Mirror Image
• Transmutation: Knock, Levitation
• (Necromancy: Command Undead, Ray of Enfeeblement )

3RD LEVEL Universals

• Abjuration: Dispel Magic, Remove Curse
• Conjuration: Magic Circle, Tiny Hut
• Divination: Clairvoyance, Sending
• Enchantment: Suggestion, Tongues
• Evocation: Arcane Burst (formerly Fire - or ice or force - Ball), Lightning Bolt
• Illusion: Major Image, Phantom Steed
• Transmutation: Fly, Water Breathing
• (Necromancy: Animate Dead, Vampiric Touch)

Counterspell (basic magic defense) - move to abjuration specialist or generalist class feature.

4TH LEVEL Universals

• Abjuration: Resilient Sphere
• Conjuration: Conjure Minor Elementals
• Divination: Arcane Eye
• Enchantment: Confusion
• Evocation: Arcane Storm (formerly Ice -or fire or lightning - Storm)
• Illusion: Greater Invisibility
• Transmutation: Dimension Door
• (Necromancy: Blight)

5TH LEVEL Univserals

• Abjuration: Wall of Force
• Conjuration: Conjure Elemental
• Divination: Scrying
• Enchantment: Dominate Person
• Evocation: Arcane Hand
• Illusion: Seeming
• Transmutation: Teleportation Circle
• (Necromancy: Cloudkill)

Animate Objects: move to transmutation specialist
Contact Other Plane: move to divination and/or conjuration specialists
Geas: move to enchantment specialist
Legend Lore: move to divination specialist