"Stuck" playing 4e (i.e. unwilling converts)

[Dannyalcatraz]

I'm in pretty much the same position as pawsplay. While I can respect 4Ed in and of itself, its not D&D to me- its just another FRPG. I might play it, especially if asked to by friends, but I'll never run it.

For me, the major issues that so many people have with 3.X have simply never been more than an irritant to me.

 

[Zustiur]

Does the move from Vancian magic (or other subsystem changes, like fighter powers) "grow" on you?
No.
Do you still have the same issues you had when you started out?
Mostly. I won't list them as I don't want to invite edition war talk.
Do you have different issues, especially any that surprised you?
Yes, combat is longer and slower than before, and that irks me, but I did not expect it.
How long did it take for your opinion to change/cement?
To be honest it was pretty quick, but I'm still trying to like the system. It is a good game, taken on its own merit. But it's not the game I want to play. Unfortunately I'm stuck with it for the time being. I probably count as one of those being 'forced' to play 4E. My advice is to run a few more test games (Do NOT use KOTS!) and then see how your players feel. Sticking with 4E when player's aren't happy with it is not a good move for the group.
Did anyone else in your group have a change of heart (in either direction)?
Not that I've noticed no. We're all (except 1) trying to be open minded about it, and still playing and trying to make it feel better, but we're not making headway.

Again, my advice is to run some more test games, but not to force the issue. I suggest running games that do NOT use pre-written adventures. Write up a quick and simple adventure and use that to test. Absolutely avoid using KOTS, because I suspect a major part of my gripe with 4E is that I'm stuck in KOTS with no forseeable end to the drudgery.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Does the move from Vancian magic (or other subsystem changes, like fighter powers) "grow" on you?
No.
Do you still have the same issues you had when you started out?
Mostly. I won't list them as I don't want to invite edition war talk.
<snip>
How long did it take for your opinion to change/cement?
To be honest it was pretty quick, but I'm still trying to like the system. It is a good game, taken on its own merit. But it's not the game I want to play. <snip>
Did anyone else in your group have a change of heart (in either direction)?
Not that I've noticed no...<snip> we're not making headway.

This post, too, closely resembles my feelings about 4Ed.

It IS a good game. Its just not for me, nor does it seem to work for most of my buddies. Instead of being forced to play 4Ed, the problem we have the opposite.

I bought the Core 3, went through it, didn't care for it, and then let others peruse them. A couple of guys were curious about the game, but nobody was willing to run it.

 

[Zustiur]

I bought the Core 3, went through it, didn't care for it, and then let others peruse them. A couple of guys were curious about the game, but nobody was willing to run it.

I find this interesting. For a system that so many DMs love, I find the idea of DMing in 4E utterly repulsive. I'll play it because that's what the current DM is willing to run, but there's no way I'd run it. In fact I'm looking at starting a 3.5 or 3.P game in the next month or two, in spite of the fact it would be 'easier' to run in 4E.
I've seen plenty of player talk on here suggesting they prefer 3.x, but from anecdotal evidence it appears DMs prefer 4E. I'm glad to see I'm not the only DM who feels 3.x is a better choice.

I've been planning to run a game for some time now, but I have to admit to myself that I am hoping my current DM will take the hint and begin to see the flaws in 4E. Sadly at this stage he seems to be one of the people blinded by the 'new flashy' and can't see why anyone else would prefer any other system.

 

[Greg K]

I've seen plenty of player talk on here suggesting they prefer 3.x, but from anecdotal evidence it appears DMs prefer 4E. I'm glad to see I'm not the only DM who feels 3.x is a better choice.

You can add me to the list of DMs that feel 3.x (despite its flaws) is a better choice. Also, out of a dozen of so DMs that I know, only two are willing to run 4e. Of the two, one was doing a test of 4e and not sure he was going to stay with it while the other, whom had left rpgs during 2e, just happened to get interested in rpgs again as 4e was being released.

 

[Dragonblade]

You can add me to the list of DMs that feel 3.x (despite its flaws) is a better choice. Also, out of a dozen of so DMs that I know, only two are willing to run 4e. Of the two, one was doing a test of 4e and not sure he was going to stay with it while the other, whom had left rpgs during 2e, just happened to get interested in rpgs again as 4e was being released.

Its interesting how groups have different experiences. We have 5 different DMs in my immediate circle of friends who game. Not one will ever DM 3e again.

 

[thecasualoblivion]

All things being equal, 4E is a far better game from a DMs standpoint.

1. If you don't like 4E from a personal taste standpoint, you likely aren't going to want to DM it.

2. If you are a heavy simulationist DM, or are a DM who likes crafting things down to the last detail, 4E likely isn't for you.

For most everyone else, 4E DMing is where its at.

 

[Phaezen]

Its interesting how groups have different experiences. We have 5 different DMs in my immediate circle of friends who game. Not one will ever DM 3e again.

I am the main DM for one group, and I will never willingly DM 3e again when our current campaign finishes. The other group I play with , the DM has decided to stay with 3.x/pathfinder due to the amount he has invested (both wotc and 3rd party) in the system.

Phaezen

 

[thecasualoblivion]

I am the main DM for one group, and I will never willingly DM 3e again when our current campaign finishes. The other group I play with , the DM has decided to stay with 3.x/pathfinder due to the amount he has invested (both wotc and 3rd party) in the system.

Phaezen

I forgot about that sort of DM, the one who has so much invested in a system he/she doesn't want to leave it behind. That DM type would be #3.

 

[Greg K]

Its interesting how groups have different experiences.

Yes, that is what makes the world an interesting place.