Sudden Stalagmite

[Bad Paper]

Partial text for Sudden Stalagmite:

SUDDEN STALAGMITE
Conjuration (Creation) [Earth]

You point your finger upward and utter a curt shout. Immediately, a razor-sharp stalagmite bursts from the ground to impale your foe.

This spell creates a stalagmite about 1 foot wide at its base and up to 10 feet tall. If it encounters a ceiling before it reaches full size, it stops growing. The stalagmite grows from the ground under the target creature and shoots upward. An airborne creature within 10 feet of the ground gains a +4 bonus on its saving throw, and airborne creatures more than 10 feet above the ground cannot be harmed by this spell.

The stalagmite deals 1d6 points of piercing damage per caster level (maximum 10d6). In addition, a target that fails to make a saving throw against this spell and takes damage from it is impaled on the stalagmite and cannot move from its current location until it makes a DC 15 Escape Artist check. The stalagmite can be removed in other ways as well, such as with a stone shape spell. The victim can break free with a DC 25 Strength check, although doing this deals it 3d6 points of slashing damage.

Every time the druid cast it her target was standing on the ground (usually worked stone). Until last night.

Last night her target was standing on an iron floor of the second story of a building. I said nono, choose another spell, it won't work here. I was accused of being arbitrary. (hey, I was nice enough to not force her to burn the spell to learn her lesson)

The text does not explicitly say "this doesn't work in buildings," but hey, come ON! The player also thinks that the [Earth] tag is meaningless in this situation. I feel that on top of everything else, druids just aren't intended to have dominion over iron. Their spells damage or destroy it (rusting grasp, transmute metal to wood, etc.).

Despite the references in the description {[Earth], "ground," "stone shape"}, druidess insists that I am Just Being Mean.

Was I correct? (ignore rule 0 for this question)

What if target were standing on a wooden floor? Druids have mad wood skillz. The way the spell is written, I would still not allow it, but I am curious to know if anyone else would.

 

[dhaga]

I would say this is a case of "DM's call". I probably would not allow this to work through an iron floor, either (especially on the 2nd floor or higher). A wooden floor? Maybe.

Also:

Immediately, a razor-sharp stalagmite bursts from the ground to impale your foe.

Bursts from the ground. Ok, so it bursts from the ground. You're on the 2nd floor. The ground is ~10 feet below you. The stalagmite grows up into the room below.

Either call would work: "it doesn't work because it's iron", or "you hear a groaning sound below you, of stone pushing its way up through a floor. You see nothing."

 

[darthkilmor]

The 2nd floor of a building is not "the ground", you were right on this one I think, but kudos to the player for trying. Alternatively you could have simply said "ok, you hear a *bang!* at the base of the targets feet, like the sound of stone hitting an iron floor."

 

[frankthedm]

This is why it is imperative to read any given spell before allowing it into your game and to tell anyone who thinks splatbook spells should be allowed in carte blanch to sod off.

I'd agree with you on this Earthen Enema spell, limiting by being over earth/stone sounds about right. The 1d6 peircing a level is more than enough for a 4th level non energy spell, kept reasonable by allowing DR instead of SR The rooting the foe to the spot is a deal breaker.

Oh yeah, count me in with the folks who think druids and conjuration get way too much love in spell compedium

 

[ThirdWizard]

Is the "ground" text in the new ubiquitious flavor text that spells have now? If so, I would ignore it for rules purposes. Secondly, it mentions stone shape because the stalagmite is made of stone, not because it has the same restrictions as stone shape. So, as far as I can tell, the spell should have worked.

 

[Rhun]

I agree with the ruling. I would not have allowed it to work in that situation.

 

[cmanos]

I was accused of being arbitrary.

Your job as DM is to be arbitrary.

I would have ruled the same way.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Ohhhhh-you guys are talking about the spell...

Errr...I would have ruled the same way.

Personally, I think some of the RPG writers are getting a little cutesy, implying in flavor text what should be explicit in rules text, cutting a grammatical corner here and there, etc., so I take a "wholeistic" approach to reading spells & feats & so forth.

 

[Mycanid]

Excellent call Paper

A stalagmaite out of nowhere out of the second floor??? Where does the precedent stop? Why not out of the roof of a parapet 300 feet off the ground while we are at it? The fourth floor of the local inn?

No stalagmites grow out of the ground. Period. NOT out of iron. NOT out of wood.

 

[ThirdWizard]

A stalagmaite out of nowhere out of the second floor??? Where does the precedent stop?

What's next? Creatures popping up out of nowhere with Conjuration [Calling] spells? Insanity!

In all seriousness, though, that is what Conjuration does. This spell creates a stalagmite. It doesn't shape the ground up into producing one using materials present. It works more akin to acid arrow than fabricate or stone shape. Using the flavor text to rule that "ground" is equivalent to "natural earth or stone" instead of "whatever the PCs are standing on" is, IMO, against the spirit of the spell and against the RAW.

Was I correct? (ignore rule 0 for this question)

I think that your ruling was incorrect according to the RAW.