D&D 5E Suggestions on modifying 5e to give characters more bonuses

[yipwyg42]

I am running my groups 2nd 5e campaign. The main issue that my players have is that they do not feel that their characters gain power from one level to the next. They like the system overall, though. They do not see much difference between say a 5th level character and an 8th or 10th character. They would like some more some sort of bonuses or maybe adjust the proficiency bonus a bit higher maybe +8.

Any suggestions?

 

[ad_hoc]

I am running my groups 2nd 5e campaign. The main issue that my players have is that they do not feel that their characters gain power from one level to the next. They like the system overall, though. They do not see much difference between say a 5th level character and an 8th or 10th character. They would like some more some sort of bonuses or maybe adjust the proficiency bonus a bit higher maybe +8.

Any suggestions?

The game is divided into tiers. The experience table reflects this.

Characters acquire basic class features from levels 1-3. 4th level is an ASI.

At 5th and 6th level the character gains their key abilities.

7-10 is then the 'sweet spot' where they get to explore those abilities.

Level 11 is a whole new tier and opens up a lot of power.

It takes 21k xp to go from 10 to 11. And 15k to go from 11 to 12.

They will have gained a lot of power at 11 so that level will be at least twice as fast.

What I'm getting at is, what is your level pacing like? And do they know that this is intentional?

Maybe instead of giving more abilities you should have a discussion about how fast levelling should be.

 

[yipwyg42]

1st to 3rd is one session, every other session is a level afterwords.

Yep they see that it is intentional, the previous campaign ended about level 12. I think it is pathfinder mentality, they are used to getting something every level or so and that something increases power.

Right now at 4th level at least 2 players are feeling that their characters are not much powerful then at level 1 or 2.

Maybe when they hit the teen levels again and go around 15 or so they will feel differently.

 

[bedir than]

I haven't found a single class that doesn't have a power increase at every level.

 

[yipwyg42]

I agree with you. It maybe just 15 years of 3.0 / pathfinder mentality getting in the way with my group.

 

[clearstream]

Right now at 4th level at least 2 players are feeling that their characters are not much powerful then at level 1 or 2.

What were their race and class choices?

 

[Riley37]

How many of those PCs are spellcasters? Primary caster classes (the ones which use the multiclass level/slot table) get a new set of spells (shiny new toys) every other level.

Yeah, the Champion at level 5 and level 7 are adding the same bonus to attack rolls. The Champion Fighter also isn't getting new spells. Would you give even odds in an arena match between a level 5 Champion and a level 7 champion?

I would NOT give even odds in an arena match between a level 5 Eldritch Knight and a level 7 Eldritch Knight, because spell slots, as well as HP.

 

[ad_hoc]

1st to 3rd is one session, every other session is a level afterwords.

Yep they see that it is intentional, the previous campaign ended about level 12. I think it is pathfinder mentality, they are used to getting something every level or so and that something increases power.

Right now at 4th level at least 2 players are feeling that their characters are not much powerful then at level 1 or 2.

Maybe when they hit the teen levels again and go around 15 or so they will feel differently.

I was going to suggest you speed up levelling, but wow, that is already incredibly fast. I am used to 3 to 4 sessions per level (which is a tad on the slow side for 5e but we like to take things slow).

I am not sure what to say. I am finally playing in a game and my character just got to level 3. I got +2 to 2 skills, +4 AC, 7 more HP, 2 2nd level spells, 1 more 1st level spell, and more options on my inspiration dice.

All from 1 level. My power more than doubled. I am looking forward to level 4 where I get a feat and evening out a stat. That is still nothing compared to level 5 and 6 when my real abilities will come online.

I don't remember being this excited about a single level in 3.x Maybe it has just been too long since I have played it.

Maybe you should just ask them what they want out of the game. Maybe it's not character growth they are after, it is that they want to play a high powered campaign. Is that what you want?

You are also free to throw a bunch of powerful magic items their way. No house ruling required then.

 

[Xantherion]

The party consists of the following

Elf Fey warlock with chain pact.
Elf Rogue arcane trickster
Half-Elf Paladin of the Ancients.

The player who plays the paladin has no issues with the system.

The player who plays the warlock has an issue with the proficiency bonus only goes from +2 to +6. Given 20 stat, he does not see a significant difference from 1st level having a +6 proficiency bonus, to a 20th level character having +11. He wants a bigger difference between apprentice and master as far as bonus rolled.

The one playing an arcane trickster feels that characters that the feel of the character gaining power is to slow. In pathfinder just about anything you take, even if it is marginal makes you more powerful, and he can see it. He does not at this point see it in 5e, yes you get more hp and such but.

Then you have me, I love the system. I love that creatures have more of a shelf life, love that they separated magic item from being needed by characters, it is now a straight power bonus. The only issue I have with it, is I want more support now. This is the system that I wanted for years now. I just wish now that the system I want is out, that it had/has the same level of support from earlier editions.

My players are not ready to abandon 5e yet, it is now up to me to prove that this system is good, and be able to run future games using
it.

 

[ad_hoc]

Do you use Point Buy or 4d6?

I have come to believe that it is necessary to have a maximum of 17 in a stat at 1st level after racial modifiers.

Having an 18 or a 20 at the start breaks the game a bit. It makes levelling up less satisfying and feats too good.

On top of that +4 proficiency should be another +2 from stat increases. And another +6 if you picked a class that is an expert in skills. Apprentice fighters get 1 attack. Grandmaster fighters get 4. Apprentice mages get 1st level spells, grandmasters get 9th level. There is a big difference here.

What did the Arcane Trickster take for spells?

We have an Arcane Trickster in a game I am in and he is doing lots of new stuff now that he just hit 3rd level. He has Minor Illusion, Sleep, Tasha's Hideous Laughter, and Find Familiar. Not to mention an extra d6 damage on attacks.

Last session his familiar scouted ahead and he was able to pick the lock to a door at a distance to keep everyone safe. His power in the exploration pillar is unmatched.