D&D General Survivor 5E Undead - Litch outsmarts the competition!
- Thread starter OB1
- Start date
CleverNickName
Limit Break Dancing (He/They)
Never understood the hype for the Death Knight. At the end of the day, it was just another variety of lich...and we've had to deal with a ton of lich variants in this thread.
Now the question is, who do I downvote now? Ghosts have the best role-playing opportunities for the DM, and are a lot more versatile than most other creatures on the list: they can join the party as NPCs, they can harrow the party as monsters, and they can turn the party against itself with their possession ability.
Liches are my go-to monster for "powerful undead villain." The have some of the best spells, abilities, and lair actions in the game, and can be customized to fit any setting or challenge through their spell selections alone. They're so good, everyone tries to imitate them...deathlock is a lich with warlock spells, death knight is a lich with paladin spells, demilich is a lich without a body, etc. I don't see myself downvoting the perfect undead monster.
The Mummy is probably the weakest monster on the list, but it's not terrible. Sure, the classic is the bandaged, embalmed variety...but there are also bog mummies, ice mummies, salt mummies...if you're getting tripped up on bandages, just expand your mind a bit. (At least the Mummy Lord was voted out early; it's basically a lich with cleric spells and a terrible costume.)
Vampires are a classic, but they're getting stale. Yes yes, you're a tortured soul cursed with immortality and have to live forever in the prison of your own mistakes, yawn. I mostly love them for the sake of nostalgia: back in 3rd Edition/Pathfinder, when "vampire" was a template that could be applied to humanoids, they were so much better. I guess I can upvote them for old-time's sake if/when the lich doesn't make it.
Wraiths are amazing monsters, but there isn't a classic D&D setting or adventure module that features them so it'll probably be the next to go. I'm okay with it. It's a low-power undead monster with an interesting vibe, I have nothing against it. But I have to downvote something.
Now the question is, who do I downvote now? Ghosts have the best role-playing opportunities for the DM, and are a lot more versatile than most other creatures on the list: they can join the party as NPCs, they can harrow the party as monsters, and they can turn the party against itself with their possession ability.
Liches are my go-to monster for "powerful undead villain." The have some of the best spells, abilities, and lair actions in the game, and can be customized to fit any setting or challenge through their spell selections alone. They're so good, everyone tries to imitate them...deathlock is a lich with warlock spells, death knight is a lich with paladin spells, demilich is a lich without a body, etc. I don't see myself downvoting the perfect undead monster.
The Mummy is probably the weakest monster on the list, but it's not terrible. Sure, the classic is the bandaged, embalmed variety...but there are also bog mummies, ice mummies, salt mummies...if you're getting tripped up on bandages, just expand your mind a bit. (At least the Mummy Lord was voted out early; it's basically a lich with cleric spells and a terrible costume.)
Vampires are a classic, but they're getting stale. Yes yes, you're a tortured soul cursed with immortality and have to live forever in the prison of your own mistakes, yawn. I mostly love them for the sake of nostalgia: back in 3rd Edition/Pathfinder, when "vampire" was a template that could be applied to humanoids, they were so much better. I guess I can upvote them for old-time's sake if/when the lich doesn't make it.
Wraiths are amazing monsters, but there isn't a classic D&D setting or adventure module that features them so it'll probably be the next to go. I'm okay with it. It's a low-power undead monster with an interesting vibe, I have nothing against it. But I have to downvote something.
Charlaquin
Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
Agreed!
You may have sold me on ghost here.
Yeah, I don’t see myself downvoting it, but I don’t think it really needs my upvotes either. It’ll do fine on its own.
Arguably mummy is yet another lich variant. Just an embalmed lich.
I have similar feelings. I’m a big vampire fan, but usually I don’t care for them in a D&D context. On the other hand, when done right, I love them in D&D. It’s easy to get them wrong, but when you get them right it’s soooo good.
Eh. In my opinion it’s just a ghost variant, same as death knight is a lich variant.
CleverNickName
Limit Break Dancing (He/They)
@Charlaquin I concede your point that the mummy is unoriginal. But it's not a lich variant, I think it's a zombie variant. Either way, I think you've talked me into downvoting Ol' Dusty.
Dax Doomslayer
Adventurer
I've liked the Death Knight since Dekkion from the D&D cartoon (who I always felt was a Death Knight)...
Levistus's_Leviathan
5e Freelancer
IMO, it's way better than a lich (which is ironic, as my profile pic and name is based off of a popular one). I would take Lord Soth over Acererak any day.
Ghosts are cool, but I don't think they deserve my upvotes and don't think they deserve to win. They're a bit overdone, IMO. There are tons of ghost movies and shows, and in D&D, I don't find them appealing.
Liches are good, but I personally would prefer vampires to win this contest. Strahd is a cool villain, and is one of the most well known D&D-specific undead. Vampires are inspired by folklore and legend, making their way into pop culture, while liches are less well known.
My excuse for downvoting the Wraith is that they're basically just shadowfell ghosts. I personally prefer using them over ghosts in a D&D campaign, but would prefer ghosts to win this than the wraith.
Argyle King
Legend
Death Knights aren't required to be evil -even in D&D.
It's also a powerful cinematic and narrative trope (which goes largely unexplored in D&D) to have a villain who is formidable and has a code of honor.
While not a death knight, Thanos (from the MCU) is a good example. He wasn't a villain who sat back and hid behind his followers. He was willing to enter the fight. There were things he believed in, just as passionately as the heroes had things they believed in.
Likewise, Darth Vader (who arguably is a death knight) has similar characteristics. I would go so far as to argue that Vader isn't a Sith at all; instead being a dark reflection of who he was as a Jedi. He's a good villain because he's a reflection of the hero (Luke.)
And -at least to me- the visual image of a death knight riding onto the battlefield atop his dreadful steed is a lot cooler than the other options.
Last edited:
Argyle King
Legend
Ghost 28
Lich 32
Mummy 28
Vampire 30
Wraith 16
Lich 32
Mummy 28
Vampire 30
Wraith 16
DND_Reborn
The High Aldwin
You know what I wish they had in 5E, the Skeleton Warrior:
or even better...
or even better...
