Swashbuckling Adventures: 7th Sea d20 review
- Thread starter Kaptain_Kantrip
- Start date
Arcane Runes Press
First Post
Re: Re: Disappointment
For me, I'm going to end up incorporating ALOT of the books rules into my games. So much in this books absolutely sings to me.
If, however, I were going to run a flat out swashbuckling campaign, I'd allow pretty much any of the new core classes outlined in the front of the book, but some of them would definately replace the core stuff.
I, too, like the revised core stuff. In fact, I like the new ranger much better than the original and really like the revised paladin as well.
Patrick Y.
Psion said:
For me, I'm going to end up incorporating ALOT of the books rules into my games. So much in this books absolutely sings to me.
If, however, I were going to run a flat out swashbuckling campaign, I'd allow pretty much any of the new core classes outlined in the front of the book, but some of them would definately replace the core stuff.
I, too, like the revised core stuff. In fact, I like the new ranger much better than the original and really like the revised paladin as well.
Patrick Y.
Kaptain_Kantrip
First Post
Re: defensive bonus?
Use the Unarmored Defense Proficiency feat chain in Swashbuckling Adventures to get a minimum of +3 AC (when not wearing armor, does not stack with armor bonuses) at 1st level. This bonus scales with level. Combined with a high Dex mod and good Tumbling skill, your unarmored PC will be as hard to hit as if he we wearing heavy armor!
nharwell said:
Use the Unarmored Defense Proficiency feat chain in Swashbuckling Adventures to get a minimum of +3 AC (when not wearing armor, does not stack with armor bonuses) at 1st level. This bonus scales with level. Combined with a high Dex mod and good Tumbling skill, your unarmored PC will be as hard to hit as if he we wearing heavy armor!
Last edited:
drnuncheon
Explorer
Re: defensive bonus?
It sounds to me like making it a feat chain was the best idea for those people looking to incorporate it into normal D&D though. Having a class with a 'defense bonus' - and having that bonus taken into account when the class is balanced - does me no good when I look at integrating it into a standard D&D game.
J
nharwell said:
It sounds to me like making it a feat chain was the best idea for those people looking to incorporate it into normal D&D though. Having a class with a 'defense bonus' - and having that bonus taken into account when the class is balanced - does me no good when I look at integrating it into a standard D&D game.
J
SHARK
First Post
Greetings!
I picked up Swashbuckling Adventures! and I think it is a great book! The new core classes, the skills, the feats, the various prestige classes, and everything! There is so much here that is very useful. I highly recommend the book as an excellent addition to anyone's campaign!
Oh, yeah, and people know who I am! One of my friends who plays in my campaign has a nephew, and his nephew was talking to some friends about me, and they know who SHARK is! I couldn't believe it, but I guess my reputation precedes me!
Semper Fidelis,
SHARK
I picked up Swashbuckling Adventures! and I think it is a great book! The new core classes, the skills, the feats, the various prestige classes, and everything! There is so much here that is very useful. I highly recommend the book as an excellent addition to anyone's campaign!
Oh, yeah, and people know who I am!
One of my friends who plays in my campaign has a nephew, and his nephew was talking to some friends about me, and they know who SHARK is! I couldn't believe it, but I guess my reputation precedes me!Semper Fidelis,
SHARK
Mortaneus
First Post
Should I get in on this discussion or not....
Why not. I'm the mood to be verbose. Here's a runthrough of the book from the standpoint of a rules monkey/min-maxer:
Chapter 1: Nationalities
Ohh, I can give up 2 skill points to get two skills as class skills? One of the single biggest deciding factors for getting prestige classes...for TWO skill points??? Let's see...
Castille: Knowledge (religion) and Sense Motive. One is a primary requirement for most of the swordfighting prestige classes in this book, and the other is needed by a large chunk of Defenders of the Faith. Got a winner here.
Eisen: Intimidate and WILDERNESS LORE (one of the seven uber-useful skills, the others being spot, listen, hide, move silently, search, and tumble)
Ussura: Knowledge (nature) and Wilderness Lore. Ohh, Masters of the Wild, here I come...
Vestenmannavnjar: intimidate (Gladiator?) and Sense Motive (again, sword schools...)
Chapter 2: Character Classes
Modified Bard: 6+Int Skills, good. No spellcasting. D8 Hit Die. Iron Glare and Command (Sit! Stay! Bad villain!). An interesting take on the class, though they really do lose a lot from no spellcasting, but the skills and hit die help a lot to make up for that.
Modified Paladin: Religious Fury??? Good god! Oooh, lookit me, I'm flat footed. To bad that you can't take advantage of it because you're DEAD! Also, since many paladins are low-dex, high armor fighters anyway, being flat footed isn't that bad.
Modified Ranger: More Skills for Rangers! The Provided by Nature ability could come in real handy if your ranger is also a decent merchant. Go scavanging in the woods for a bit, come out with a box full of poison to sell. The healing herbs can be handy too.
Alchemist: Frankly, this class rocks. I've always been a fan of the alchemist, and this one more than makes up for what the others have been lacking. And they get access to EVERY SPELL from EVERY LIST for making potions. Magical Artisan anyone?
Assassin: Rogue without evasion, less skills...blah. Take levels of rogue and use the Assassin out of the DMG.
Courtier: If you're in a roleplaying heavy game, this one is a monster. 10+INT Skills!!! The class features are pretty beefy too.
Highwayman: John Woo in hose and lace, with flintlocks. Need I say more?
Inquisitor: What special ability do I want today? Interesting approach to building a class....I wonder if a Monk varient could be made that uses the same idea. Pick from a list of powers. The Tattooed Monk from OA is sort of like this already, but it'd be interesting to see what someone could do with a full 20 levels.
Musketeer: At 4th level (according to the chart) they can get musketeer feats...hmm...nobody told the feats that. They only seem to need 1+ levels, not 4+. On the whole, it's a fighter with a few less feats and some quirky abilities. Flurry of Strikes is the only one of the musketeer feats really worth taking anyway.
Noble: If you like having followers, use this. Otherwise use the Courtier or bard.
Pirate: Stand aside Fighters and Rangers! Here comes the...(drum roll) PIRATE! That's right, not only does he get ambidex and 2wf in the first two levels, but he also gets Weapon Spec, Improved 2WF, Improved Critical, an extra d6 of damage on ALL melee attacks, His INT to his damage, his INT to his AC in light and MEDIUM armor (duelists are for wusses), extra skill points on top of his 4+INT, the ability to fight to -10, good fort AND reflex saves, a primary attack bonus, and d10 for hit dice! Good lord, is there anything this guy doesn't have???
Spy: Another Rogue varient. W00t.
Swashbuckler: Good class, though could use the hit die being bumped up to d8. Quite classy.
Wanderer: Captain Generic. Oh, I forgot. he's lucky. ooh.
Witch: kind of wussy, though worth taking for the manipulate spell skill. Spellcasters can take a single level of this class at around 5th or 6th, and dump all the skill points into manipulate spell. Then see if you can con your GM into allowing you to make an item of +10 Manipulate Spell or something.
Chapter 3: Prestige Classes (skipping quite a few)
Archaeologist: Very nice. Very very nice.
Captain: FEAR MY TROOPS!
Daring Fool: No die roll is ever safe again! This guy frankly rocks. Of course, GMs might be a bit hesitant to let someone take a class that blatantly supports that level of recklessness...though considering that this book is for swashbuckling games, I guess it's merited.
Entertainment Officer: I don't think anyone will ever take this class because of all the jokes that would be made about the class name...then again, they just might.
Man of Will: Umm....NO! This has got to be one of the most blatant attempts I've ever seen to overpower a low level character. You can have the requirements at first level, for crying out loud!
Reis: Obscenely overpowered. As you might expect. Though many of his abilities being fear based makes paladins his bane.
Andrews Swordsman: Ability to take one penalty to Attacks and have it apply to both power attack and expertise is pretty cool, especially considering power attack has some boosts to it.
Champion of the Lady of the Lake: Grapple him. Fast.
The Chosen One: I CANNOT DIE!!!!!
Corsair: What is this smite evil crap? I smite everyone who doesn't follow MY GOD! (time to pick something really obscure here and be able to smite everything)
Sersemlik Swordsman: Double Whirlwind attack!
Yael Swordsman: Add his ranks in perform to crit damage? Yike!
Siggursdottir Axeman: Double that attacks, double the fun! The 5th level ability is utter munchkin garbage, BTW.
Ambrogia Swordsman: Combine with acrobatic dodge and expert tactician for some real fun.
Chapter 3: Feats (skipping again)
Accurate Archer: Umm, first of all, cover doesn't add a penalty for this feat to negate. It adds to the target's AC, true, but that's a DC modification, not a true penalty.
Acrobatic Dodge: WOW!
Armor Piercer: Waste of a feat. The most AC reduction you can get from this is 4 points, and you have to use a full-round action to do it? Worthless.
Arrow Stab: IMC, I limit this to once per round. Otherwise, God help you if you get next to an archer. Especially an OBI.
Back Brother: Flanking nothing...give me this one.
Beat: Combine with parry and riposte to really embarrass an opponent who has only 1 attack.
Combat Virtuoso: You can practically make the old Bard Blade kit now.
Continuous Parry: Combine with Riposte. Shades of NWN.
Counterattack: Monks love this one. (my AC is huge! Sure, I'll take a -2 to stunning attack/improved trip you as you attack me)
Dashing and Daring: Great, other +Stat to AC ability. Hey look, I'm getting my DEX, Wis, Cha, and Int to my ac! Plus a bunch from unarmored defense proficiency! combine with bracers of armor +8 for even more laughs.
Dead Aim: I didn't realize that the armor you are wearing protects your opponent. (read the feat)
Death Blow: Mwahaha....Coup De Gras nothin....
Defensive Shot: Combine with arrow stab. Who needs OBI?
Deflect Missle I & II: Somebody forgot about the Quarterstaff, and slew of other weapons. Blades only...bah...
Dextrous Bow Use: I didn't know that the proper use for a finely crafted longbow is to unstring it and use it to beat your opponent to death. Just shows what I know.
Exotic Shield Proficiency: For some reason, every time I look at this feat, my mind sees an 'r' instead of an 'x' in the title. It's probably caused by the font they used.
Extra Finesse: *sigh* Yet again, why only fencing blades?
Flashing Steel: -2 Damage for +2 Attack AND +2 AC? GAH!!!! Combine with a 2 point power attack for real fun.
Flurry of Strikes: Cool, though class restricted.
Foul Weather Jack: Spellcasters! Need some extra xp for that item creation? here you go!
Giant: Use with spiked chain.
Greater off hand weapon fighting: Yes! Two longswords, here I come!
Improved/Greater Sneak Attack: Good god....d8's or even, dare I say it, d10's for sneak attack??? *shudder*
Hip Shot: Great in Dragonstar. Gundancers love this one.
Legendary Trait: Yike. More stat enhancement. Gets REALLY ugly for epic characters.
Lightning Reflexes: Name needs help.
Loyal Companion: This feat is awesome! 'OMG, you killed Polly! You B*****d!'
Master Swordsman: This should not be a feat.
Pinache: Obscenely cool, especially if you take it a couple of times.
Parry: I REALLY like this feat. I've always been a fan of more dynamic swordfights, rather than two people wailing on each other's armor. It suffers from the blades only flaw that plagues quite a few other feats. What, Quarterstaves can't parry???
Pirate Trick: One, or two. Make up your mind (see header text).
Pommell Strike: No saving throw? This is completely broken.
Really Tough: Superfluous with the stuff in MotW.
Riposte: heh....heh...heh.....
The Secret: Wussy compared to Legendary Trait, though they go together quite well.
Showmanship: Gladiators love this one.
Side Step: Stylish.
Six Fingers: (sarcasm) I wonder where they got the inspiration for this one? (/sarcasm)
Slip: Combine with parry, riposte, counterattack, combat reflexes, and pommell strike. Attack me! I dare you!
Supressive Fire: Very very useful.
True Alchemist: WOW!
Two Strikes as One: Nasty...very very nasty....
Unarmored Defense Prof: Monks love this one. Question: does it stack with non-armor based armor bonuses? Bracers of Defense? Mage Armor?
Weapon Expert, Master, Grand Master: They're back! Players Option, here I come!
Arcana: Take a hubris, get another feat! Woohoo! BTW, I suggest propitious multiple times in the party.
Chapter Five: Equipment
The rapiers are overpowered if you allow them in a normal D&D game. Other than that, it's a decent section. one thing though, where is this penalty mentioned for the cutlass?
Chapter Six: Wondrous Items
Reis' Scythe is a +17 weapon. No more needs be said.
Dracheneisen sucks in a more normal D&D game, unless you make it's bonus something other than an enhancement bonus.
The poisons' effects are weird.
Chapter Seven: Advanced Rules
Dramatic Criticals: I like this one. Of course, you had better roll well, or you'll be REALLY screwed.
Called Shots: Want to live? Lose an ARM!!! I like this method. It leads to those horrible battle injuries, and a good knock-down, drag-out fight can leave you buried in eyeballs and amputated limbs! What GM wouldn't want to see that? (BTW, beware the weapon master with improved crit and his keen scimitar. You could re-name him the Amputator)
Rest of the Book: No comment
Why not. I'm the mood to be verbose. Here's a runthrough of the book from the standpoint of a rules monkey/min-maxer:
Chapter 1: Nationalities
Ohh, I can give up 2 skill points to get two skills as class skills? One of the single biggest deciding factors for getting prestige classes...for TWO skill points??? Let's see...
Castille: Knowledge (religion) and Sense Motive. One is a primary requirement for most of the swordfighting prestige classes in this book, and the other is needed by a large chunk of Defenders of the Faith. Got a winner here.
Eisen: Intimidate and WILDERNESS LORE (one of the seven uber-useful skills, the others being spot, listen, hide, move silently, search, and tumble)
Ussura: Knowledge (nature) and Wilderness Lore. Ohh, Masters of the Wild, here I come...
Vestenmannavnjar: intimidate (Gladiator?) and Sense Motive (again, sword schools...)
Chapter 2: Character Classes
Modified Bard: 6+Int Skills, good. No spellcasting. D8 Hit Die. Iron Glare and Command (Sit! Stay! Bad villain!). An interesting take on the class, though they really do lose a lot from no spellcasting, but the skills and hit die help a lot to make up for that.
Modified Paladin: Religious Fury??? Good god! Oooh, lookit me, I'm flat footed. To bad that you can't take advantage of it because you're DEAD! Also, since many paladins are low-dex, high armor fighters anyway, being flat footed isn't that bad.
Modified Ranger: More Skills for Rangers! The Provided by Nature ability could come in real handy if your ranger is also a decent merchant. Go scavanging in the woods for a bit, come out with a box full of poison to sell. The healing herbs can be handy too.
Alchemist: Frankly, this class rocks. I've always been a fan of the alchemist, and this one more than makes up for what the others have been lacking. And they get access to EVERY SPELL from EVERY LIST for making potions. Magical Artisan anyone?
Assassin: Rogue without evasion, less skills...blah. Take levels of rogue and use the Assassin out of the DMG.
Courtier: If you're in a roleplaying heavy game, this one is a monster. 10+INT Skills!!! The class features are pretty beefy too.
Highwayman: John Woo in hose and lace, with flintlocks. Need I say more?
Inquisitor: What special ability do I want today? Interesting approach to building a class....I wonder if a Monk varient could be made that uses the same idea. Pick from a list of powers. The Tattooed Monk from OA is sort of like this already, but it'd be interesting to see what someone could do with a full 20 levels.
Musketeer: At 4th level (according to the chart) they can get musketeer feats...hmm...nobody told the feats that. They only seem to need 1+ levels, not 4+. On the whole, it's a fighter with a few less feats and some quirky abilities. Flurry of Strikes is the only one of the musketeer feats really worth taking anyway.
Noble: If you like having followers, use this. Otherwise use the Courtier or bard.
Pirate: Stand aside Fighters and Rangers! Here comes the...(drum roll) PIRATE! That's right, not only does he get ambidex and 2wf in the first two levels, but he also gets Weapon Spec, Improved 2WF, Improved Critical, an extra d6 of damage on ALL melee attacks, His INT to his damage, his INT to his AC in light and MEDIUM armor (duelists are for wusses), extra skill points on top of his 4+INT, the ability to fight to -10, good fort AND reflex saves, a primary attack bonus, and d10 for hit dice! Good lord, is there anything this guy doesn't have???
Spy: Another Rogue varient. W00t.
Swashbuckler: Good class, though could use the hit die being bumped up to d8. Quite classy.
Wanderer: Captain Generic. Oh, I forgot. he's lucky. ooh.
Witch: kind of wussy, though worth taking for the manipulate spell skill. Spellcasters can take a single level of this class at around 5th or 6th, and dump all the skill points into manipulate spell. Then see if you can con your GM into allowing you to make an item of +10 Manipulate Spell or something.
Chapter 3: Prestige Classes (skipping quite a few)
Archaeologist: Very nice. Very very nice.
Captain: FEAR MY TROOPS!
Daring Fool: No die roll is ever safe again! This guy frankly rocks. Of course, GMs might be a bit hesitant to let someone take a class that blatantly supports that level of recklessness...though considering that this book is for swashbuckling games, I guess it's merited.
Entertainment Officer: I don't think anyone will ever take this class because of all the jokes that would be made about the class name...then again, they just might.
Man of Will: Umm....NO! This has got to be one of the most blatant attempts I've ever seen to overpower a low level character. You can have the requirements at first level, for crying out loud!
Reis: Obscenely overpowered. As you might expect. Though many of his abilities being fear based makes paladins his bane.
Andrews Swordsman: Ability to take one penalty to Attacks and have it apply to both power attack and expertise is pretty cool, especially considering power attack has some boosts to it.
Champion of the Lady of the Lake: Grapple him. Fast.
The Chosen One: I CANNOT DIE!!!!!
Corsair: What is this smite evil crap? I smite everyone who doesn't follow MY GOD! (time to pick something really obscure here and be able to smite everything)
Sersemlik Swordsman: Double Whirlwind attack!
Yael Swordsman: Add his ranks in perform to crit damage? Yike!
Siggursdottir Axeman: Double that attacks, double the fun! The 5th level ability is utter munchkin garbage, BTW.
Ambrogia Swordsman: Combine with acrobatic dodge and expert tactician for some real fun.
Chapter 3: Feats (skipping again)
Accurate Archer: Umm, first of all, cover doesn't add a penalty for this feat to negate. It adds to the target's AC, true, but that's a DC modification, not a true penalty.
Acrobatic Dodge: WOW!
Armor Piercer: Waste of a feat. The most AC reduction you can get from this is 4 points, and you have to use a full-round action to do it? Worthless.
Arrow Stab: IMC, I limit this to once per round. Otherwise, God help you if you get next to an archer. Especially an OBI.
Back Brother: Flanking nothing...give me this one.
Beat: Combine with parry and riposte to really embarrass an opponent who has only 1 attack.
Combat Virtuoso: You can practically make the old Bard Blade kit now.
Continuous Parry: Combine with Riposte. Shades of NWN.
Counterattack: Monks love this one. (my AC is huge! Sure, I'll take a -2 to stunning attack/improved trip you as you attack me)
Dashing and Daring: Great, other +Stat to AC ability. Hey look, I'm getting my DEX, Wis, Cha, and Int to my ac! Plus a bunch from unarmored defense proficiency! combine with bracers of armor +8 for even more laughs.
Dead Aim: I didn't realize that the armor you are wearing protects your opponent. (read the feat)
Death Blow: Mwahaha....Coup De Gras nothin....
Defensive Shot: Combine with arrow stab. Who needs OBI?
Deflect Missle I & II: Somebody forgot about the Quarterstaff, and slew of other weapons. Blades only...bah...
Dextrous Bow Use: I didn't know that the proper use for a finely crafted longbow is to unstring it and use it to beat your opponent to death. Just shows what I know.
Exotic Shield Proficiency: For some reason, every time I look at this feat, my mind sees an 'r' instead of an 'x' in the title. It's probably caused by the font they used.
Extra Finesse: *sigh* Yet again, why only fencing blades?
Flashing Steel: -2 Damage for +2 Attack AND +2 AC? GAH!!!! Combine with a 2 point power attack for real fun.
Flurry of Strikes: Cool, though class restricted.
Foul Weather Jack: Spellcasters! Need some extra xp for that item creation? here you go!
Giant: Use with spiked chain.
Greater off hand weapon fighting: Yes! Two longswords, here I come!
Improved/Greater Sneak Attack: Good god....d8's or even, dare I say it, d10's for sneak attack??? *shudder*
Hip Shot: Great in Dragonstar. Gundancers love this one.
Legendary Trait: Yike. More stat enhancement. Gets REALLY ugly for epic characters.
Lightning Reflexes: Name needs help.
Loyal Companion: This feat is awesome! 'OMG, you killed Polly! You B*****d!'
Master Swordsman: This should not be a feat.
Pinache: Obscenely cool, especially if you take it a couple of times.
Parry: I REALLY like this feat. I've always been a fan of more dynamic swordfights, rather than two people wailing on each other's armor. It suffers from the blades only flaw that plagues quite a few other feats. What, Quarterstaves can't parry???
Pirate Trick: One, or two. Make up your mind (see header text).
Pommell Strike: No saving throw? This is completely broken.
Really Tough: Superfluous with the stuff in MotW.
Riposte: heh....heh...heh.....
The Secret: Wussy compared to Legendary Trait, though they go together quite well.
Showmanship: Gladiators love this one.
Side Step: Stylish.
Six Fingers: (sarcasm) I wonder where they got the inspiration for this one? (/sarcasm)
Slip: Combine with parry, riposte, counterattack, combat reflexes, and pommell strike. Attack me! I dare you!
Supressive Fire: Very very useful.
True Alchemist: WOW!
Two Strikes as One: Nasty...very very nasty....
Unarmored Defense Prof: Monks love this one. Question: does it stack with non-armor based armor bonuses? Bracers of Defense? Mage Armor?
Weapon Expert, Master, Grand Master: They're back! Players Option, here I come!
Arcana: Take a hubris, get another feat! Woohoo! BTW, I suggest propitious multiple times in the party.
Chapter Five: Equipment
The rapiers are overpowered if you allow them in a normal D&D game. Other than that, it's a decent section. one thing though, where is this penalty mentioned for the cutlass?
Chapter Six: Wondrous Items
Reis' Scythe is a +17 weapon. No more needs be said.
Dracheneisen sucks in a more normal D&D game, unless you make it's bonus something other than an enhancement bonus.
The poisons' effects are weird.
Chapter Seven: Advanced Rules
Dramatic Criticals: I like this one. Of course, you had better roll well, or you'll be REALLY screwed.
Called Shots: Want to live? Lose an ARM!!! I like this method. It leads to those horrible battle injuries, and a good knock-down, drag-out fight can leave you buried in eyeballs and amputated limbs! What GM wouldn't want to see that? (BTW, beware the weapon master with improved crit and his keen scimitar. You could re-name him the Amputator)
Rest of the Book: No comment
Re: Re: Re: Disappointment
I agree wholeheartedly. SWashbuckling adventures (minus its editing issues) is one of the best D20 books yet.
Its so crunchy it makes my teeth hurt
Arcane Runes Press said:
For me, I'm going to end up incorporating ALOT of the books rules into my games. So much in this books absolutely sings to me.
If, however, I were going to run a flat out swashbuckling campaign, I'd allow pretty much any of the new core classes outlined in the front of the book, but some of them would definately replace the core stuff.
I, too, like the revised core stuff. In fact, I like the new ranger much better than the original and really like the revised paladin as well.
Patrick Y.
I agree wholeheartedly. SWashbuckling adventures (minus its editing issues) is one of the best D20 books yet.
Its so crunchy it makes my teeth hurt
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