Swashbuckling Adventures: 7th Sea d20 review

[Kaptain_Kantrip]

Glad to be of service, Eric. There might be differences between the Rokugan and 7th Sea courtier classes, but they look the same to me, not having Rokugan in front of me.

As to my complaints with the book, let me clarify:

Arcana feats: How these are activated is never explained, just that they can be. That is a glaring point of confusion for the reader. Also, dividing them up into hubris, wile, flaw, virtue is overly complicated and presents too many terms to remember right away. I don't see the need for so many distinctions between arcana... some seem totally arbitrary. The benefits of some are useless or make no sense at all, such as "indecisive."

Numerous background feats require you to possess 4 ranks in what is undoubtedly a cross-class skill in order to receive that skill and several others as class skills. If these are supposed to be part of your character's background, you won't be able to qualify for them until 2nd or 3rd level! Nonsense again, and it shows a total lack of comprehension of how the d20 skill system is supposed to work.

Because the weaknesses of the fighting school PrCs is mentioned in their flavor text, it should be backed up in the rules (WoTC did the same thing with the sorcerer, though, so AEG isn't the first to do this). This is only done once out of dozens of PrCs, which leads me to believe they just got lazy and didn't bother to do this for the other ones. A simple system such as a new skill like "Knowledge: Fighting Styles" could have probably covered all of these PrC weaknesses under one umbrella, methinks, allowing someone with that skill to make a skill check to negate the school's bonus or at least reduce it, or perhaps gives the character a bonus to fight the student of that school.

 

[Arcane Runes Press]

Because the weaknesses of the fighting school PrCs is mentioned in their flavor text, it should be backed up in the rules (WoTC did the same thing with the sorcerer, though, so AEG isn't the first to do this). This is only done once out of dozens of PrCs, which leads me to believe they just got lazy and didn't bother to do this for the other ones. A simple system such as a new skill like "Knowledge: Fighting Styles" could have probably covered all of these PrC weaknesses under one umbrella, methinks, allowing someone with that skill to make a skill check to negate the school's bonus or at least reduce it, or perhaps gives the character a bonus to fight the student of that school.

I suspect that the "weaknesses" only appear in the flavor text because they are, for the most part, simply meant to be stylish and flavorful. In other words, they are there to give DMs and players a means of describing how characters pierce one another's defenses.

Patrick Y.

 

[Seth Mason]

Re: Courtier class

Your original post served well enough for me to put together a rather amusing send up of it and you.

No need to apologize. There was more than enough there to work with.

Now I'm doubly confused. I came in here to clear up a personal bit of confusion and now suddenly I've had "my butt handed to me" by someone who has been reading insults that I didn't make. I'd like to sincerely apologize if this came across in this manner, but you appear simply too eager to try and play "pick on the interloper" since you've decided to only respond in self-congratulatory remarks instead of attempting to discuss the actual question I had. I'm not sure where the breakdown in communication happened, but congratulations! Apparently you've scored a point off me somehow here for my poor behavior in some sort of verbal duel I wasn't participating in. I do appreciate you clarifying for me why I don't frequent forums that much - people tend to read hostility into any sort of contradiction, and are very pleased to flaunt some sort of 'put down' they can muster.

However, I am thrilled to have served as some sort of amusement for you all today. Before I take my leave (which Mike will happily interpret as me running with my tail between my legs so he can put a notch on some marker thing somewhere...) I'd like to address a few things that I did notice that actually have some merit in being addressed -

Why don't I know of a Mike Mearles? Because I don't work with him. The D20 lines AEG puts out are legion and there are writing teams that largely never interact with one another. Rip any name off of an Adventure Keep or a D20 "Word" title and I probably don't know them and they won't know me.

I'd also like to reiterate there was absolutely no need to take offense at what I had said - I was simply attempting to puzzle out something that looked really odd to me. I apologize if anyone got the impression I was attacking a member of the forum - I assume this is the impression I gave, because the alternative is that people are just itching to claim some sort of victory in an internet posting board. I'd rather not believe this about a forum that I've found interesting and mature consistently.

Anyway, I'll let this die and allow myself to be some sort of trophy for a fight. I'll still be about if anyone wants to actually discuss this matter or anything relative to ye olde AEG.


Seth Mason

 

[rwulf]

Hi Mike!

Hi there Mike!

Just thought I'd jump into this thread and try to cool a few heads.

Seth merely asked a question; how the misunderstanding arose regarding the courtier class. I can understand that you probably feel very close to your work, but there was no reason to get so sarcastic about it. His original post was not intended as a personal attack at all, insofar as I can tell. (Believe me, after working with Seth on several occasions you'll know a personal attack when you see one.) Seth might have gotten a bit defensive after that, but I think he had good reason.

The thing is, I was asked to write a courtier for this book as well. I heard that the one I wrote was the one that ended up in the book. That's where, I think, the confusion arose. I had no idea someone else had been hired to write the same thing, or that someone else's work might not have been used.

I doubt AEG's choice to use the Rokugan courtier for 7th Sea was intended as any sort of slight toward your work, Mr. Mears. Rather, since I was working on 7th Sea d20 already (albeit in a rather limited fashion, having provided only the Witch, Highwayman, Courtier, and a handful of prestige classes) they decided that there was no reason to invent an entirely new courtier class when they already had created one for Rokugan. d20 books are, after all, ostensibly designed to be compatible. Why would AEG want to throw to different versions of the courtier out there?

Anyway, I hope this clears up the matter. No insults were intended, just pure and natural confusion. However, that's the danger of the internet. Sometimes the tone gets lost in the message. Also, I think people tend to vent a bit when they don't have a face sitting there in front of them to answer to. I think this is what might have happened in this case, and I hope no feelings were hurt.

By the way is was great working with you (even though I had no idea I was working with you at the time.) 8)

Talk to you later,

Rich Wulf
Head Writer, Legend of the Five Rings
Alderac Entertainment Group

 

[Arcane Runes Press]

Re: Re: Courtier class

I'll still be about if anyone wants to actually discuss this matter or anything relative to ye olde AEG.

Seth Mason

Yeah, I've got 3 questions (for you, Rich Wulf, or any other AEGer)

1) Do you know who wrote/designed the Drexel Swordsman PrC? It's definately a good one.

2) Any idea what the ability Exploit Weakness is meant to be? It's listed under at least 2 PrCs (the Gelingen Monster Hunter being one), but there is no description of what the ability does. Is it just a case of mistakenly leaving the listing there for an ability that was pulled from the manuscript?

3) How is the dual stat d20/d10 thing going over in regards to the Rokugan books. I've got the whole collection and they're doing all right by me, but how are the "classic" L5R players receiving it. I used to be on the mailing list, but when I switched ISPs I never bothered to re-up, as the sniping between the d10 and d20 camps was just too annoying to put up with.



Also, I spoke to quite a few AEG staffers at Origins, and came away with quite a favorable impression (and LOTS of swag, including 18 L5r ccg boosters and the Swashbuckling Adventures hardcover). My wife and I even played "Swashbuckler Survivor" with John Zinser (I think it was him) as the DM. Cool folks all around, particularly Jim Pinto.

Patrick Y.

 

[rwulf]

Re: Re: Re: Courtier class

Hi there!

I can't answer all your questions but I'll answer the ones I can.

3) How is the dual stat d20/d10 thing going over in regards to the Rokugan books. I've got the whole collection and they're doing all right by me, but how are the "classic" L5R players receiving it. I used to be on the mailing list, but when I switched ISPs I never bothered to re-up, as the sniping between the d10 and d20 camps was just too annoying to put up with.

Patrick Y.

From the discussions I've had with players both groups of fans seem to approve of the dual system books. I think we've managed to do it in such a way that the rules for either system don't take up too much page real estate and distract from the experience for players of the other system. For those folks who like both systems (myself included) it means you don't have to buy all the books twice, which is great.

For those of you on the official RPG lists you may have noted quite a bit of sniping between the two groups of players, but this is just the nature of the RPG industry beast. One of the great advantages of working in Role Playing Games is that the customers and designers form a community - a community that by the nature of the games we play is very social. However, sometimes there tend to be rigidly defined and exclusive sub-groups within that society. Throw the anonymity of the internet into the mix and flame wars are just an occupational hazard.

To put it simply, "nobody disses gamers like other gamers." Normally this is all in good fun and nobody really takes it *too* seriously.

Also, I spoke to quite a few AEG staffers at Origins, and came away with quite a favorable impression (and LOTS of swag, including 18 L5r ccg boosters and the Swashbuckling Adventures hardcover). My wife and I even played "Swashbuckler Survivor" with John Zinser (I think it was him) as the DM. Cool folks all around, particularly Jim Pinto.

Patrick Y.

Glad you had fun at Origins! pinto (lower case by his insistence, not mine) is a hell of a funny guy and he's awesome to hang out with.

And free stuff is always good.

Rich Wulf
Head Writer, Legend of the Five Rings
Alderac Entertainment Group

 

[EricNoah]

Well glad that's all sorted out, though I have to say I did find the initial post from Seth to imply that this anonymous poster named Mike Mearls was either a looney or a liar. And I felt that Mike's response was right on the money -- a funny way to say "dude, a) I wouldn't lie and b) you should know who I am, I worked for you." Anyway, it's all done now.

Hey, and speaking of Rokugan, congratulations to AEG for their nomination -- Rokugan's one of the five nominees for Best Setting in the ENnies this year, and Creatures of Rokugan is up for Best Monster Supplement. And of course Spycraft's up for Best Game. Good showing all around.

 

[rwulf]

Thanks!

Hey, and speaking of Rokugan, congratulations to AEG for their nomination -- Rokugan's one of the five nominees for Best Setting in the ENnies this year, and Creatures of Rokugan is up for Best Monster Supplement. And of course Spycraft's up for Best Game. Good showing all around.

Thanks to the judges for nominating us!

We've got some really fierce competition out there. A lot of the nominees are books that I've incorporated into my own campaigns at home; it's a real thrill to be competing with a group of such talented creators.

And that's not just me trying to sound diplomatic toward the other nominees (mostly). There really is quite a bit of kick-ass stuff out there.

Wish us luck!

Rich Wulf
Head Writer, Legend of the Five Rings
Alderac Entertainment Group

 

[Seth Mason]

Well glad that's all sorted out, though I have to say I did find the initial post from Seth to imply that this anonymous poster named Mike Mearls was either a looney or a liar. And I felt that Mike's response was right on the money -- a funny way to say "dude, a) I wouldn't lie and b) you should know who I am, I worked for you." Anyway, it's all done now.

Curse the internet and its imperfect medium. Again I apologize if I gave any wrong impressions.

Hey, and speaking of Rokugan, congratulations to AEG for their nomination -- Rokugan's one of the five nominees for Best Setting in the ENnies this year, and Creatures of Rokugan is up for Best Monster Supplement. And of course Spycraft's up for Best Game. Good showing all around.

As Rich said, thanks! We get to hear so much explosions from people about L5R selling out that I try and make an effort to personally thank anyone who takes the time to say something nice about it.


Seth Mason

 

[Piratecat]

Seth, I'm glad you weren't trying to be insulting. As in Eric's case, I badly misinterpreted your tone and message.

In any event, it's great to see you guys active on the boards.