T3 reviews coming in

[stevelabny]

i'm just befuddled...

ive already stated, like kai lord, that i think t2 also had many spots that were MEANT to be funny. (i actually call it an action-comedy) then kai lord actually LISTED them for you. and you still say that theyre all supposed to be SERIOUS?

when arnold starts t2 by walking into a dive bar, getting ogled by the ladies, starting a bar fight, and walking out in full leather outfit with shades while BAD TO THE BONE is playing, this is COMEDY. (riffing nicely on his entrance in t1...and his entrance in t3 just turns it up one more notch)

when young john connor tells arnold that he can't kill anybody and then seconds later arnold kneecaps the security guard... this is COMEDY GOLD.

and to make a blanket statement like "comedy in movies tends to be obvious" when there are so many hidden or subtle clever bits of humor in the most unlikeliest of movies... shows your narrow-minded concept of humor (nothing is funny unless it is obvious??)

and im still befuddled because i still remember seeing T2 in the movie theatre and the crowd ROARING with laughter at most of the jokes. so even if youre only looking for "obvious" clues to what is a joke... the audience shouldve tipped you off.

 

[Alzrius]

ive already stated, like kai lord, that i think t2 also had many spots that were MEANT to be funny.

And I've already stated that I don't think that's so.

(i actually call it an action-comedy) then kai lord actually LISTED them for you. and you still say that theyre all supposed to be SERIOUS?

Frankly, yes.

when arnold starts t2 by walking into a dive bar, getting ogled by the ladies, starting a bar fight, and walking out in full leather outfit with shades while BAD TO THE BONE is playing, this is COMEDY.

I didn't see anything amusing at all in the bar fight. The "Bad to the Bone" part drove the characterization there home, but I wouldn't say it was funny.

when young john connor tells arnold that he can't kill anybody and then seconds later arnold kneecaps the security guard... this is COMEDY GOLD.

You've got to be kidding me. I found that scene mildly horrifying. Here we have John Connor trying to teach the terminator respect for human life, and we then see the terminator completely missing the point by shooting the guy anyway, just in a non-lethal manner. There is no consideration for the fact that the person is still in extreme pain, and may be crippled for life...it completely undercuts everything John was trying to get across about why life is important, and shows quite well the cold soullessness of the terminator, even as a good guy.

and to make a blanket statement like "comedy in movies tends to be obvious" when there are so many hidden or subtle clever bits of humor in the most unlikeliest of movies... shows your narrow-minded concept of humor (nothing is funny unless it is obvious??)

lol, I'm narrow-minded? No, I know I'm not, not when guys like Kai and you are objectively stating what is and is not funny. If there is any narrow-mindedness here, its from you guys projecting it.

What I said was a truism because that's the general rule for Hollywood films. I'm not saying it doesn't have exceptions, but by and large movies have to appeal to the relatively lowest common denomonator. Directors and producers don't want to make movies with jokes that people aren't going to get.

You want to hear something open-minded? Comedy is subjective, and I don't think T2 had much of it at all. That's my opinion. Stop saying yours like its a fact; its not.

and im still befuddled because i still remember seeing T2 in the movie theatre and the crowd ROARING with laughter at most of the jokes. so even if youre only looking for "obvious" clues to what is a joke... the audience shouldve tipped you off.

Apparently whatever audience was detached enough to find the majority of human suffering throughout that movie humorous didn't make it to my hometown, since nobody I know laughed when they saw the film. I wouldn't want to meet people who think capping someone in the knees is hysterically funny.

 

[Kai Lord]

and im still befuddled because i still remember seeing T2 in the movie theatre and the crowd ROARING with laughter at most of the jokes. so even if youre only looking for "obvious" clues to what is a joke... the audience shouldve tipped you off.

If I didn't know better, I'd have to say he was trolling us. He obviously isn't familiar with humor "I need a vacation" and he certainly isn't privy to the concept of black humor "He'll live". To continue to watch him break down the jokes that not only everyone laughed at and still laugh at, the same jokes that Jim Cameron recognized on the T2 Extreme DVD commentary as being just that, and then explain why they were not meant to be funny ("No you guys he really needed a vacation!") would just be embarrassing at this point.

Its just strange that he would get none of the jokes in T2, but then recognize humor in T3. I'm surprised he isn't touting Arnold putting on the gay pink sunglasses then crushing them under his boot as a nonfunny "character building" moment.

 

[Alzrius]

If I didn't know better, I'd have to say he was trolling us.

Good thing you know better.

He obviously isn't familiar with humor "I need a vacation" and he certainly isn't privy to the concept of black humor "He'll live".

Boy, you didn't read the above post about humor being subjective at all, did you? Maybe someday you'll realize that not everyone thinks like you.

[snips various trollish comments]

I'll respond to what you say when you aren't trying to start a flame war. In the meantime, I'll say it again, just because you think people dying is funny does not mean everyone else has to think like you do.

 

[Mark Chance]

I'll say it again, just because you think people dying is funny does not mean everyone else has to think like you do.

You've missed something very important: Differences of opinion are often not tolerated around here. Differences of opinion are often instead painted as trolling, being judgmental, displaying one's ignorance, et cetera. As often as not, even when someone agrees to disagree, it is fairly obvious he or she is only doing so because he or she thinks the other party is too [insert ad hominem judgment].

 

[reapersaurus]

good point, Mark C.

I think both sides are being quite extreme here: to state that T2 didn't have many comedy portions in it is pretty extreme. There are some funny parts, classic comedy.

On the other hand, Kai Lord's list was not even close to being all comedy. Some things he (apparently) finds funny are mostly just parts of the sci-fi story (shooting the guy in the knee is a PERFECT example).

I'll share something about watching T2: in my experience, it was a different movie if you saw it after the first week, than if you saw it right away (similar to Jurassic Park in that aspect). In the opening night theater, people were chilled at the machine's lack of human feeling, etc. The violence was not part of a punchline - it was part of the story-arc.
When I saw it again, a month later, the audience had completely changed - they WERE laughing and cheering at times, and rather inapproprate times, at that. It had become a Summer Movie (TM). IMO, it was NOT intended as that - the themes are much deeper, and to dismiss it as a Summer action movie is rewriting history out of context of when it came out.
I remember clearly my disgust at the audience when they actually LAUGHED and TEASED during the Holocaust scene blowing up the kids in the playground. They had Utterly Missed the Point, and it actually saddened and disappointed me at the time.

So please don't TELL US what was intended as funny in T2.
-----------------------------------------------
But getting back to the subject of T3:

The comedy was obviously more blatant, and intended as comedy. They were darn funny, too.

However, I am continuing to be surprised at people stating that it's anywhere close to the movies that T1 or T2 are.
T3 was derivative - almost nothing was original, and certainly nothing ground-breaking about the movie. This fact alone makes it nothing but an entertaining action movie. Combine that with the quite forgettable acting by Nick Stahl and Claire Danes, and you've really got the Terminators carrying the show.

For Mistwell -
no paradoxes?a stable timeline?
Surely you can't be serious.
How's this for starters: how did the T-X get there, when they destroyed it all in T2?
I'd love to discuss these plot points, if (hopefully) we can start talking about spoilers now.

 

[Mark Chance]

no paradoxes?a stable timeline? Surely you can't be serious. How's this for starters: how did the T-X get there, when they destroyed it all in T2?

All stems from the flawed premise of the original film. The only reason to invent time-travel was to prevent something that had already happened. But if that something had been prevented there would have been no reason to invent time-travel. Thus the time-travel that prevented that which had already happened would never have happened. But, if the time-travel never happened, then the thing which happened which had been prevented would not been prevented. Et cetera, et cetera, ad nauseum.

Duh.

 

[Mythtify]

Of course, the biggest problem witht T2 and t3, is that according to the rules of time travel set forth in Terminator, neither move can take place.

Terminator states that only organic material can tim travel. Thats why Reese and The Terminator show up naked. Arnolds terminator can time travel because he is a robotic form covered with living tissue.

The t-1000 is liguid metal. T-X is a reinforced metal body covered in a liguid metal.


Even though they show up naked, they are in no way organic.Neither of theese terminators can time travel. T2 and T3 can not take place.

 

[Henry]

Let's please not turn a discussion of T2 vs. T3 into a nasty-icky-bad-poo-poo war, please.

(Sorry, just finished reading some Nodwick.)

 

[Henry]

On the other hand, I, too, found numerous humor elements in T2. (I haven't seen T3 yet, so I won't be hanging around this thread a whole lot.) Not necessarily all of what Kai Lord mentioned, but there were even more elements than that, though admittedly quite subtle (CSM-101 looking at the mini-gun and smiling in Enrique's gun cache, CSM-101 destroying a car's steering column to find the ignition wires to make it run and John showing him the keys in the visor two seconds later,etc.) However, until I get to see T3, I can't make a real comparison.

And yeah, I laughed when CSM-101 kneecapped the guard because he promised John he wouldn't kill anyone. Says a lot about me, I guess.