Temporary Damage

[Particle_Man]

I came up with this idea while discussing illusions, but realized that it could apply in other contexts. Just as an aid spell can add temporary hit points, so could other spells or effects cause temporary damage. To simplify bookkeeping, I would suggest that temporary hit points and temporary damage each permanently cancel each other out, on a 1 hp for 1hp basis. Thus if Spell X causes 10 points of temporary damage, and spell A adds 7 temporary hit points, casting both on a character would result in here having no temporary hit points, and 3 points of temporary damage. Temporary damage effects would have durations, just as temporary hit point effects would.

Thus whatever box you use for temporary hit points, you would either have a positive or a negative number (or 0) in it, so temporary damage would not add to what you put on the character sheet (except for the negative sign).
In fact, one way to think of temporary damage is as negative temporary hit points. No character would ever have temporary hit points and temporary damage at the same time. Hopefully, this would mean that temporary damage would cause no more bookkeeping than temporary hit points would, since you would only have to remember one temporary effect (either temporary hp or temporary damage), not both, on a character at a given time.

Temporary damage would only kill someone if it, plus the real damage, brought a character to -10 hit points. Otherwise, the victim would get better when the temporary damage went away.

While damage to a character is taken from her temporary hit points first, healing done to a character would affect temporary damage last (thus temporary damage would not prevent "real" healing). The exception would be temporary hit points, as detailed above, which would cancel out temporary damage.

The advantages of adding temporary damage: If you want characters to suffer and risk death, but they don't have access to healing in the party, temporary damage can give them a quick "healing" method between battles (assuming that they live). Also, one might allow effects that do "more" temporary damage than they would real damage, although that hasn't been playtested. And, as stated above, it provides an interesting option for damage by "partially real" illusion spells, mind-affecting spells, etc.

It also allows for new spells: "Hinder" could function as the opposite of the Aid spell, for instance, giving the victim a penalty and temporary damage (but require a touch attack to succeed).

I would welcome any comments.

Let me know what you think.

 

[Aaron2]

I would welcome any comments.

How is Temporary Damage different from subdual damage?


Aaron

 

[ARandomGod]

How is Temporary Damage different from subdual damage?


Aaron

I have actually HAD spells do temporary damage before. With exactly the same effect. The damage was "real" while it lasted, and instantly healed when the duration expired... unless the victim dies of the temporary damage... then they stay dead (But the illusion of the wound which killed them still ends, thus having a dead person whith no mortal wound. A confusion....)
It had an interesting effect. The spell was an illusionary arrow spell. It created magic arrows with a temp. duration. If you shot a low level person with them and killed them, you'd see a dead person with no evidence of why that person died. If they didn't die they'd be shreiking and going to a healer, etc, then have no reason to (it had a relatively short duration).

Also, it would mysteriously be unhealable through traditional heal spells. Although dispell magic, illusion dispells, or temporaty HP would "help".

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

Temp vs Subdual

How is Temporary Damage different from subdual damage?

Temp Damage is 'real damage' created by spell effects, and as such dissapears once the spell duration runs out or is dispelled.

Subdual {or Non-lethal as 3.5 calls it} is damage that heals faster than normal damage and can only knock you out.

The two most obvious uses are the partially real illusions that can actually kill, and the opposite of the Aid type spells.

A good example would be a Hinder spell, that deals 1D6 temp damage and grants a -2 penalty to attacks and damage. With a duration of 1 minute, the spell has the potential of knocking commoners to below 0 hps, but 10 rounds later the spell ends and they are not wounded at all.
If the same spell dealt non-lethal damage, the commoners would be knocked out for hours.

I like the concept.. and look forward to implementing it

 

[Aaron2]

A good example would be a Hinder spell, that deals 1D6 temp damage and grants a -2 penalty to attacks and damage. With a duration of 1 minute, the spell has the potential of knocking commoners to below 0 hps, but 10 rounds later the spell ends and they are not wounded at all.
If the same spell dealt non-lethal damage, the commoners would be knocked out for hours.

If a character is knocked below 0 by temporary damage, does he still lose 1 hp per round? If so do those lost hit points disappear when the temperary damage goes away?


Aaron

 

[Fieari]

I definitely appreciate the idea, it just plain makes sense. The illusiary arrow thing sounds REALLY cool by the way, and I'd love to see it extended to all other weapon types. A bow that creates these illusion arrows, a hilt with an illusion blade, etc... real murder weapons. The only real point would be to mystify the local authorities, or frighten a town into thinking they are under a curse or something like that, but it makes for GREAT plot hooks.

 

[ARandomGod]

If a character is knocked below 0 by temporary damage, does he still lose 1 hp per round? If so do those lost hit points disappear when the temperary damage goes away?


Aaron

There are, of course, no official rules covering this (as it's an unofficial effect in the first place).

But no. At least not in the games I played with temporary damage. We called it illusory damage...
But, you don't bleed down as an effect of illusory damage, because the wound isn't "real". To have the bleeding effect enough damage to put you below zero would have to be real.

 

[Particle_Man]

Interesting. I had not thought of stabilization, or not, with respect to temporary damage. Personally, I could see it both ways: a) you are so shocked that your heart is in danger of ceasing to beat even after you are unconscious...stabilization means that your heart calms down enough. b) It is all in the head, and once you have no thinking head to be affected, you are not going to get hurt. Or even c) You don't fall unconscious at 0 (but are reduced to only one standard action per round, as if you were at 0), but do die at -10.

Another question to ponder is whether temporary damage from multiple sources should stack or overlap. I believe that temporary hit points overlap.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Put me in the box of really liking this idea.

Why do you still die with temporary damage? When the effect 'goes away,' you regain those hit points, so wouldn't you come back to life, woundless, with the perception you were just struck by a deadly blow?

Or maybe 'dying' allows a second save against the effect?

I mean, temporary hp can't bring someone back to life, right? Why should temporary damage be able to kill 'em?

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

Stabalize..

Had not thought of that...

Hmm, perhaps... Once a character reaches 0 HPs from temp damage, s/he is knocked out and no futher temp damage from the spell has any effect. Then treat it like a poisen..one minute later the character must roll a FORT save or die, basically from the body forgetting to breath. Success means the character becomes fatigued and can roll a WILL save to wake up. Repeat each minute until the character dies or wakes up.
The spells duration could, and usually would, end prior to this drama playing out, but the dissapearance of the temp damage would not wake up the character. S/he still needs to make the saves.

I took part in a recent thread about stacking temp hit points.. and agreed that they should overlap. I think temp damage could overlap as well, basically only allowing one spell effect at a time. This cuts much of the lethality from it as it would take a seriously harsh spell to kill a CR equivilent target.
But then again, how often are you going to be the target of multiple Phantasmal Killers? Overlapping would place these spells strongly in the realm of low HD targets.

Kamakazi.. temp hps should be able to kill, partially because one of Particle Man's goals is to replicate the Phantasmal Killer using The Elements of Magic spell system , and partially because, as Fieari points out, this makes for a great plot hook!