Trailer TERMINATOR ZERO | Official Trailer | Netflix

[Stalker0]

Food is not the problem (until climate change kicks in harder).

Food is not a problem in this very tiny timespan of human existence, because our farming is incredibly inefficient right now.

Effectively how modern farming works is, you are injecting HUGE amounts of energy into the soil in the form of fertilizer, and you get a fraction of that energy back in the crops you yield. Yes that means that an acre of land will give you 100x its natural production, but at the cost of 1000x the energy (probably an exaggeration but you get the point).

This has two issues:
1) It relies on energy sources that are not inexhaustable. We all know fossil fuels will run out someday, its just a question of when. In theory renewables can make electricity that can be reconverted to create synthetic fertilizers, though there is a transformation cost there as well and you still have to scale up renewable sources, the infrastructure and maintenance are not free.

2) The bigger issue....we are exhausting the land. Slowly and surely, our farmland is experiencing desertification, top soil erodes away, etc. The techniques we are using are simply not sustainable for long term farming.


So yeah, in a very tiny window of human civilization we have made food supplies beyond plentiful. But there is absolutely no guarantee that would last, in fact the lessons of history and nature would suggest that they won't, and mass famine will return to the world at some point....its just a matter of time.

 

[Stalker0]

Cyanobacteria.

Just to give some context here. Way way waaaaaaaay back in the day, free oxygen didn't really exist on our world. Things used other chemicals like certain sulfates to get energy.

Also comes a certain microbe or bacteria that started an early form of photosynthesis where oxygen was a byproduct. Total gamechanger. Its like you have been living off bits of stale bread your whole life and suddenly you are given pizza every hour.

So these microbes take off like a shot, just multiply and multiple, basically knock off anything else in the area, as nothing can compete with these little oxygen produces. And the oxygen builds and builds and builds.

But...here's the thing... oxygen is actually an incredibly reactive poisonous material. Modern life has gotten used to dealing with it, but make no mistake, oxygen is TERRIBLE for you in many ways if you didn't have certain protections in place to keep it in check. Well the thing is back then NOTHING had protection from free oxygen....not even the oxygen producers themselves! It just wasn't necessary for life back then to have protection from oxygen.

Until....suddenly the air (and eventually the water) was filled with the stuff...this toxic poisonous highly reactive substance was everywhere. And so....a mass extinction event occurred, some scientists speculate the greatest the earth has ever known. It basically almost destroyed life itself until certain lifeforms scurried away were able to create resistances to oxygen, and then life was able to branch out again.

 

[Zardnaar]

Food is not a problem in this very tiny timespan of human existence, because our farming is incredibly inefficient right now.

Effectively how modern farming works is, you are injecting HUGE amounts of energy into the soil in the form of fertilizer, and you get a fraction of that energy back in the crops you yield. Yes that means that an acre of land will give you 100x its natural production, but at the cost of 1000x the energy (probably an exaggeration but you get the point).

This has two issues:
1) It relies on energy sources that are not inexhaustable. We all know fossil fuels will run out someday, its just a question of when. In theory renewables can make electricity that can be reconverted to create synthetic fertilizers, though there is a transformation cost there as well and you still have to scale up renewable sources, the infrastructure and maintenance are not free.

2) The bigger issue....we are exhausting the land. Slowly and surely, our farmland is experiencing desertification, top soil erodes away, etc. The techniques we are using are simply not sustainable for long term farming.


So yeah, in a very tiny window of human civilization we have made food supplies beyond plentiful. But there is absolutely no guarantee that would last, in fact the lessons of history and nature would suggest that they won't, and mass famine will return to the world at some point....its just a matter of time.

Seen that with my own eyes.

To many nitrates into the soil the rivers are ruined.

Glaciers are also melting. Go into the mountains and have a look.

 

[Stalker0]

Food is not a problem in this very tiny timespan of human existence, because our farming is incredibly inefficient right now.

Effectively how modern farming works is, you are injecting HUGE amounts of energy into the soil in the form of fertilizer, and you get a fraction of that energy back in the crops you yield. Yes that means that an acre of land will give you 100x its natural production, but at the cost of 1000x the energy (probably an exaggeration but you get the point).

This has two issues:
1) It relies on energy sources that are not inexhaustable. We all know fossil fuels will run out someday, its just a question of when. In theory renewables can make electricity that can be reconverted to create synthetic fertilizers, though there is a transformation cost there as well and you still have to scale up renewable sources, the infrastructure and maintenance are not free.

2) The bigger issue....we are exhausting the land. Slowly and surely, our farmland is experiencing desertification, top soil erodes away, etc. The techniques we are using are simply not sustainable for long term farming.


So yeah, in a very tiny window of human civilization we have made food supplies beyond plentiful. But there is absolutely no guarantee that would last, in fact the lessons of history and nature would suggest that they won't, and mass famine will return to the world at some point....its just a matter of time.

I would argue the real solution is to get away from farming altogether.

Farming at a fundamental level has not changed in 200,000 years since the dawn of agriculture. Oh sure we are way smarter and more efficient about it, but at the end of the day its:

• Put some seeds in some decent soil.
• Add some water and fertilizer, try to keep the pests away.
• Harvest plants once they are grown.
• Rinse and Repeat.

With all of our technical revolutions, farming is still farming at the end of the day. If we really want humanity to be able to survive at the pop numbers we are used to and still be fed well (or truly function in space for example), the answer is not better farming. We instead need to develop ways to convert energy directly into food. Aka electricity -> glucose. bypass all of that extremely inefficient middle man of plants and soil. What nature does through photosynthesis, we need a factory process for.

When we think about what technology revolutions might truly change us as a species, artificial food is one of them. At that point, humanity is no longer tied to the dirt, perhaps no longer even tied to the planet (or nature) itself.

 

[trappedslider]

To go back to the show (remember the show?) It sems that the terminator franchise has always used the multiverse theory with each new movie or show/book.

 

[Ryujin]

To go back to the show (remember the show?) It sems that the terminator franchise has always used the multiverse theory with each new movie or show/book.

I don't think it's a multiverse thing. I think it's a predestiny one. Humanity is effectively doomed. Sure, they can have temporary victories, through the use of time travel, but they don't ultimately win because they can't. They're in a universe that won't tolerate a paradox. You can't go back in time to beat Skynet because you wouldn't go back in time if Skynet didn't exist. So you're always going to have a Skynet as a result of your actions.

 

[Thomas Shey]

To go back to the show (remember the show?) It sems that the terminator franchise has always used the multiverse theory with each new movie or show/book.

That seemed to set in pretty solidly after the TV show.

 

[Thomas Shey]

I don't think it's a multiverse thing. I think it's a predestiny one. Humanity is effectively doomed. Sure, they can have temporary victories, through the use of time travel, but they don't ultimately win because they can't. They're in a universe that won't tolerate a paradox. You can't go back in time to beat Skynet because you wouldn't go back in time if Skynet didn't exist. So you're always going to have a Skynet as a result of your actions.

Eh. I got the idea its more wack-a-mole; computer technology is always going to lead to AI, so once you address a Skynet, you just end up with a Legion. Deal with Legion and something else pops up. That's why both Zero and the live action TV show pursued the idea that you really need to get AI on your side rather than destroying it, because unless you abandon technology entirely you're always going to get AI, and its easy for them to be hostile.

 

[Zardnaar]

Eh. I got the idea its more wack-a-mole; computer technology is always going to lead to AI, so once you address a Skynet, you just end up with a Legion. Deal with Legion and something else pops up. That's why both Zero and the live action TV show pursued the idea that you really need to get AI on your side rather than destroying it, because unless you abandon technology entirely you're always going to get AI, and its easy for them to be hostile.

In the old EU apparently skynet and humans end up making peace.

Similar reasoning.

 

[Stalker0]

That seemed to set in pretty solidly after the TV show.

So I think with Terminator 1 the idea was....all the time travel did was actually set in place the events of the future. In trying to kill John Connor, skynet actually creates John Connor, because his father is sent back in time to actually meet his mother.

In Terminator 2, there is a sense of closure. The machines took one last shot to change things, but with the destruction of cyberdyne it suggested that the judgement day might not come.

After that though they kept going with more time travel and so you have to introduce the multiverse concept to really have it make sense.