The Advantage of MtG over D&D

[Michael Morris]

<rant>This just occured to me. Magic, and for that matter all games that have a regular tournament scene, have a distinct advantage over D&D - the rules matter more.

While players do use house rules in these games on occasion, the presence AND POPULARITY of a tournament scene insures that players have a concrete understanding of the rules as written BEFORE tinkering.

D&D sadly, doesn't have this. I've bit my tongue for quite awhile on this out of being polite, but really - in my opinion until you sit down and work with the game within changing any of the rules as written i order to learn them you have no right to criticize and no competance to evaluate them.

Competance is something you earn through practice and patience.

The reason this irks me is that I see WAY too many feats, skills, and rules alterations that are so wrong on so many levels it makes me want to cry. And when I watch other posters try to explain to the starter of the thread how the rules really work and why they interact the way they do and see the stubborn retorts it sometimes makes me want to slam my head into the wall.</rant>

 

[Trepelano]

Yes, but MtG has one big problem with it:

Its not a role-playing game.

 

[JoeGKushner]

But unlike Magic, D&D opened a pandora's box with the OLG and SRD. Imagine if there was a Magic OGL thing. Game balance would be thrown out the window there too no? Heck, way I hear it, some cards ARE broken, based on their rarity, overall utility, etc...

 

[Michael Morris]

The house rules existed before the OGL - they just weren't in print. And even with the OGL the print products tend to be of a higher quality than your random messageboard post - which this is really about.

And magic has this problem to an extent on the Fantasy card forums of both WotC and Brainburst.com - but at least there they have some peer review. The OGL removed much of the peer reviewing because the more experienced designers have made their way to print.

 

[Psion]

Yes, but MtG has one big problem with it:

Its not a role-playing game.

Yup.

That really sort of throws concept of "one right way to run the game" to the wind. D&D (and RPGs in general) vary widely in the way that they are run and played, and really, in what people expect. The strict-rules-as-written style tournament D&D is anathema to some people (myself included). To imply that people who play tournament environment (which does exist in the form of the RPGA) are the only correct, informed way of doing thing is off to me, especially after observing some patently un-fun methods of play in that environment.

If I tweak my game, and I and my players have fun, then guess what: we did it right.

 

[Crothian]

Football has full rules too, a tournement scene and yet we still see kids playing in the backyard using their own rules. So what?

D&D is a role playing game that has a lo9t more gray area then Magic. D&D relies on more creativity from the players and DM and requires a much different aspect then Magic ever willo.

 

[Michael Morris]

I guess what I've trying to say, ranting aside, is that people would have more fun with the game if they'd learn it BEFORE trying to change it. At least play a house rule free game ONCE in your life. It isn't that bad.

 

[Crothian]

I guess what I've trying to say, ranting aside, is that people would have more fun with the game if they'd learn it BEFORE trying to change it. At least play a house rule free game ONCE in your life. It isn't that bad.

What are you defining as house rules? With all the material out there people can pick and choose the rules they want without resorting to creating their own rules (what I would call house rules). I agree with Psion, as long as people are having fun it doesn't matter.

 

[Viking Bastard]

<rant>This just occured to me. Magic, and for that matter all games that have a regular tournament scene, have a distinct advantage over D&D - the rules matter more.

And here's me thinking: Man I like D&D's feel, just a tad too rule heavy for my overall taste.

The reason this irks me is that I see WAY too many feats, skills, and rules alterations that are so wrong on so many levels it makes me want to cry.

What do you mean? Doesn't this fall under the whole: Different Strokes, Different People thing.

And when I watch other posters try to explain to the starter of the thread how the rules really work and why they interact the way they do and see the stubborn retorts it sometimes makes me want to slam my head into the wall.</rant>

Yes, but... well, yeah. True dat.

 

[Elephant]

Three things:

First, think of the "apples and oranges" cliche. You're doing it.

Second, competence (sorry, but it was grating on my nerves).

Third, you don't have to torture yourself by playing by an idiotic official rule in order to be capable of evaluating it. Critical thinking skills are not contingent on game experience.

It does help, though.