The Cunningly Disguised MMIV Preview

[Sammael]

I'll repost what I wrote on Maxminis:

1) The "new" statblock has same issues, notably the lack of an "environment" line. It is spelled out in the text later on, but in a non-obvious manner. I really liked being able to instantly see if a creature is fit for an environment or not.

2) Creature writeup takes up 2 pages. Since we know of another dozen Spawn of Tiamat that will be in the book, it seems like they'll take up a significant amount of space. Since I don't like the Spawn concept, this almost guarantees I won't be buying the book.

3) Major incosistency: aside from being a goddess, Tiamat is also an Archdevil. She would never, ever create creatures that would promote Chaotic Evil behavior with their very existance. All Spawn should have been LE.

4) There is an expanded Ecology section, which is nice. But there is also an awful lot of "text-padding." A paragraph devoted to the creatures' alignment? Gah. Filler.

5) They are under-CR'd at CR6. They have 8HD, the ability to cast spells as a 6th level sorcerer, and various draconic immunities. They should be at least CR7, more likely CR8.

 

[Pants]

3) Major incosistency: aside from being a goddess, Tiamat is also an Archdevil. She would never, ever create creatures that would promote Chaotic Evil behavior with their very existance. All Spawn should have been LE.

I'm not even sure if THAT is true, she was referred to as a 'watchdog' in the old MotP or some 2e sources. And in 3e she definitely is not an Archdevil. She is a goddess that makes her lair in Hell.

I don't know of any sources that refer to her explicitly as an Archdevil, but if there is one, then her status as such has never really been consistant.

 

[Knight Otu]

I'm still not sold on using the new stat block for monsters, and I find that I am looking for the special attack and special qualities line. I know many people wouldn't like that, but I'd prefer to have those lines in addition to the ability descriptions.
I do find that I like most what I see (those who've seen my short gnoll pdf probably aren't too surprised about that). I noticed that the lore section follows the official rules for such Knowledge checks closer than several of the Ecology of... articles. The little alignment blurb would be better served as part of the society paragraph, as would the sample treasure paragraph. The sample encounter I could do without.

 

[JustKim]

3) Major incosistency: aside from being a goddess, Tiamat is also an Archdevil. She would never, ever create creatures that would promote Chaotic Evil behavior with their very existance. All Spawn should have been LE.

This is your opinion and I disagree.

Tiamat, like Lolth, has suffered from some cross-setting confusion. In Dragonlance, Tiamat is CE and lives in the Abyss. Since Dragonlance, Tiamat has sometimes been presented with a CE alignment and/or as living in the Abyss. If you were to treat these inconsistancies as canon, I would definitely say the various spawns fit with her CE, Abyssal, Takhisis persona.

Not to mention that the majority of chromatic dragons, Tiamat's followers, are chaotic evil.

 

[Sammael]

Tiamat is listed as Lord of the First in AD&D Monster Manual II.

I can't quote any sources right now, but I'm fairly certain that she passed the function to Zariel when she became more concerned with her divinity and worship. That doesn't mean she is no longer an Archdevil, much like Lolth is still a Demon Queen of Spiders.

 

[Sammael]

This is your opinion and I disagree.

Tiamat, like Lolth, has suffered from some cross-setting confusion. In Dragonlance, Tiamat is CE and lives in the Abyss. Since Dragonlance, Tiamat has sometimes been presented with a CE alignment and/or as living in the Abyss. If you were to treat these inconsistancies as canon, I would definitely say the various spawns fit with her CE, Abyssal, Takhisis persona.

Not to mention that the majority of chromatic dragons, Tiamat's followers, are chaotic evil.

It has been mentioned time and again in various official sources that Tiamat and Takhisis are completely different and separate from each other. Now, in my home games, they are one and the same. But that's not canon.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

It has been mentioned time and again in various official sources that Tiamat and Takhisis are completely different and separate from each other. Now, in my home games, they are one and the same. But that's not canon.

Yet again, they cover sloppy editing with goofy retcons.

Of course Tiamat is Takhsis. If they'd been minding the shop better in Dragonlance's heyday, we wouldn't have this confusion. And ditto running a spellcheck to make sure the patron goddess of the drow's name is spelled right always.

Presented with the situation as it now stands, I guess retcons are the best choice open to them, but it still irritates me.

 

[mhacdebhandia]

Come on, let's not get hysterical. Maybe the redspawn arcanisses are always chaotic evil because red dragons are always chaotic evil.

 

[satori01]

Adding back the AC breakdown and the advancement section makes a big plus to usability. This format might be a bit easier to use in terms of running combats straight from the book. Though I dont remember seeing an easy grapple break down, which is essential for a monster stat block.

I like environment/orginzation lines myself. Even if I never use a pod of
fiendish orcas, knowing a particuliar creature comes in 3s can make for a quick idea for an encounter with lower CR creatures.

I almost never roll for random treasure, so I do not need the Treasure line, though I will admit it gives a guide for what creatures have a horde, and which have none. Prefab magic items on a creature will mean that in terms of customization, a bit of work may need to be done in terms of magic item selection, which while a bit of a hassle is not that big of a deal.

I like the Knowledge chart, anything that gives rewards to smart use of knowledge skills is a good thing in my book. I frankly dont really care about the ecologies. Too much fluff, and very specific fluff. A raksasha in my world will perform similiarily to a Raksasha in the Forgotten Realms or in Eberron, but the feel of a Raksasha between the various campaigns can be quite different. Give me the stats, and give me the Knowledge chart, but dont give me the ecologies.

 

[Pants]

It has been mentioned time and again in various official sources that Tiamat and Takhisis are completely different and separate from each other. Now, in my home games, they are one and the same. But that's not canon.

1e MotP says that Takhisis is an aspect of Tiamat.
2e was nubulous on the idea, but never said they weren't the same (to my knowledge at least).