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The Devil's in the Details: Slavicsek reveals the Pit Fiend in all its glory


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Fifth Element said:
Not sure that helps the argument. The books are not written for professional writers. They are written for the general gaming public. I'm not too concerned if a professional writer finds fault with some of the writing, since I read it and didn't have any problems with it.

There is so much wrong here, I don't know where to begin...

"This bridge wasn't built for professional engineers, it was built for the general public. I'm not too concerned if some professional engineer finds fault with some of the structure, I'm going to drive over it anyway..."

The, uhm, whole point of *professional* writers is that they are *professional* and...

Oh, never mind. My "pointless argument sense" is tingling.
 

Lizard said:
There is so much wrong here, I don't know where to begin...

"This bridge wasn't built for professional engineers, it was built for the general public. I'm not too concerned if some professional engineer finds fault with some of the structure, I'm going to drive over it anyway..."
Yes, because lives hang in the balance of the grammar in 4E...whether a bridge stays up is a matter of physics, whereas writing is a matter of taste...etc, etc...

I believe that professional writers read things with a different eye than the general populace. They notice things that most people do not.
 


So mysterious that, aparently, not all Leaders are going to be healers/have healing abilities... (well, at least the Pit Fiend is not a healer as i could see)

Don't forget the pit fiend has 2 roles: he is a Level 26 Elite Soldier (Leader). His leader role is probably secondary.
 



Lord Sessadore said:
They have implied several times that HD are just plain gone. Not sure if this means rolling a die to get your new hp is gone, or if HD-based effects are gone, or both.
Well, if you mean "HD-based effects" that screw harder the more levels you have, yes, those are thankfully gone. Poison does you damage per round, based on the creature, not CON damage that costs you MORE hp the higher level you are.
 

A thought on writing quality...

Fifth Element said:
Yes, because lives hang in the balance of the grammar in 4E...whether a bridge stays up is a matter of physics, whereas writing is a matter of taste...etc, etc...

I believe that professional writers read things with a different eye than the general populace. They notice things that most people do not.

First, I'm not taking issue with Fifth Element's comment quoted above, it's just a convenient jumping off point.

To my point... One of the things about DnD is that it captures the imagination. Some times, its a picture or an image - the cover of the original PH, the Balrog in the LOTR movies, different visuals for different people, no doubt. Some times it's the vocabulary - not only does the vorpal sword have a cool effect, it's a great word! And sometimes, it's the language - some of the evocative descriptions in Ravenloft and Bilbo's riddling with Smaug the Magnificent, just to name two very different.

If I see DnD artwork that, to me, seems amaturish and clumsy, I think it's an opportunity lost to tap into the imaginitive well of inspiration. So surely it's just as valid, if someone spots a use of language that is clunky and uninspiring, to hope for something better and more professional in that realm, too.
 

Philodendron said:
If I see DnD artwork that, to me, seems amaturish and clumsy, I think it's an opportunity lost to tap into the imaginitive well of inspiration. So surely it's just as valid, if someone spots a use of language that is clunky and uninspiring, to hope for something better and more professional in that realm, too.
Oh, indeed. But most of the complaints that started this thing have nothing to do with obviously clumsy wording. They are very nitpicky little points. For instance:

Is anyone else bothered by the poor writing? For example, in the first paragraph, we find that "... pit fiends form an elite ruling class that oversees vast numbers of lesser devils." Then two paragraphs later, we learn, "... pit fiends command vast numbers of lesser devils." Um, duh, I just read that.
Nitpicking a repetition. There's nothing inherently wrong with repeating important points.

And the pit fiend "wears an ornate breastplate decorated with evil symbols and runes." Oh, really, the big nasty devil has evil symbols? I'm shocked because in my last 3.5e game the pit fiends all had Barney embroidered on their chests. Not to mention that I'm really glad I'm clear on the fact that the breastplate has symbols and runes.
Setting aside the snarkiness in this comment, how else are they supposed to communicate that the breastplate has symbols and runes without stating it? Are we supposed to guess? And using adjectives for emphasis is fine. They could have just said symbols, sure, but there's nothing wrong with emphasizing the evil.

We also have this gem: "Penetrating the defenses of a pit fiend's castle and destroying the mighty devil in its own demesne is a deed of truly epic proportions." Even if we accept that penetrating and destroying should be considered a single deed and thus agree numerically with the singular verb (and I can agree to that - it's just a little awkward), why do I need to be told that a Pit Fiend Level 26 Elite Soldier (Leader) is a "mighty" devil? Gosh, I might have confused him with all those weak and pathetic Level 26 Elite Soldiers (Leaders) from the Nine Hells. And: "truly epic proportions"? Truly epic? Not just a little epic, or somewhat epic, but truly epic? Are they sure?
Nitpicking on whether the act above is a single deed or multiple deeds, nitpicking on an adjective used to emphasize that the devil is, in fact, mighty. Nitpicking the adverb used to emphasize the epic-ness of the deed(s). These complaints are just snarky nitpicks.

I certainly agree that plainly bad writing would be a terrible thing for 4E. But the nitpicks above are plainly and simply a matter of taste. You're right to call it art, and there is no right and wrong in art. Many masterpieces admired by art critics are boring and inconsequential to the general public. The most popular movies are often reviled by movie critics. Tastes differ greatly between people.

Things that stick out to some people as bad writing will be completely irrelevant and inconsequential to the great majority. Deleting all those adjectives, on the other hand, could lead to dry and boring prose, of which 3E suffered.
 

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