The Difficulties Of Running Low Magic Campaigns

I recently talked with a gamer who's often full of unusual, and sometimes impractical, ideas. He asked me about the difficulties of running a medieval-style low-magic D&D campaign. Lord of the Rings had to come up in the conversation, because it's the most well-known low magic fantasy setting in existence. If you take a functional rather than emotional view of the characters, in First Edition D&D terms Aragorn amounts to a seventh level ranger and Gandalf the Grey to an eighth level cleric with a Ring of Fire, and other characters are similarly low level. (I'll discuss in detail this another time.) Magic and "super-power" is immensely rare in this setting.

I recently talked with a gamer who's often full of unusual, and sometimes impractical, ideas. He asked me about the difficulties of running a medieval-style low-magic D&D campaign. Lord of the Rings had to come up in the conversation, because it's the most well-known low magic fantasy setting in existence. If you take a functional rather than emotional view of the characters, in First Edition D&D terms Aragorn amounts to a seventh level ranger and Gandalf the Grey to an eighth level cleric with a Ring of Fire, and other characters are similarly low level. (I'll discuss in detail this another time.) Magic and "super-power" is immensely rare in this setting.


It should be easier to run a low magic rather than a high magic campaign because the powers of both characters and opponents are unlikely to get out of hand. But as for recruiting players for such a campaign…that could be difficult in 2018. (Keep in mind, he's a college student and is likely to have players who are college students, not older players.)

The fundamental problem with a low magic campaign is that people have been "trained" to expect high magic by video RPGs and MMOs, and by video games in general, that are often designed to reward rather than challenge players. In other words, the low magic campaign will feel much too "tame", too dull, too slow, too "lame". Yes, it can be just as dangerous as any other campaign, but I suspect most players are not looking for danger any more when they play RPGs, again as encouraged by video games (where you can never lose).

Will players go for a game where there isn't a "loot drop" with every monster, without magic items by the bucket load?

In CRPG/MMOs leveling is what it's all about, the destination (which is maximum level) not the journey. Yet in order to run a low magic campaign you probably have to have low level characters, and that means they can't level up every other session or sooner. How will this sit with people who are accustomed to computer RPGs?

Perhaps it can work if you tell the players before the campaign starts that it's a military style campaign, that the party is like an elite combat unit (Navy SEALs, SAS, and such) trying to accomplish a series of dangerous but vital missions. Or perhaps they're like elite mercenaries doing the same thing. In other words, you can try to train the expectations of the players, but you're up against their experience, which will often include lots of computer RPGs.

My advice to my friend was to make small differences in capability from one level to the next, to let the players level up with some frequency, but to make magic items very rare, as in LOTR. If the players think of themselves as special service troops/elite mercenaries, perhaps that will work.

Improvement of characters is a pillar of RPGs. If they can only rarely improve via magic item collection, they're left with money collection or improved inherent capabilities (stronger, sneakier, better defenders, etc.). An alternative way to run a low-magic campaign might be to let the players begin as extraordinarily capable characters (compared with ordinary people) who don't really change much. They would be like James Bond and other long-running movie and comic book characters (Indiana Jones, Black Widow), and heroes of many novels. If players aren't focused on leveling up, they could actually have adventurous fun!

Another way is to emphasize collection of wealth, where players become merchant magnates or buy into the nobility or become leaders of mercenary armies. The ultimate goal might be to run their own small country.

I should think some readers have tried low-magic medieval-style campaigns. How well did they work out?

contributed by Lewis Pulsipher
 

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Lewis Pulsipher

Lewis Pulsipher

Dragon, White Dwarf, Fiend Folio

Von Ether

Legend
I think one needs to separate out the game effect from the description. If the At Will "Wizard's Darts" was more described as being particularly keen accuracy it wouldn't be too bad. The Wizard would simply be a better shot than one would ordinarily expect given his physicals.

IMO things like fireball, magical walls, teleport, flight, magical light, and so on are the real feel busters. By contrast, divination, ritual conjuration (especially with potentially dire consequences), enchantment of various sorts, buffs and debuffs, and maybe some limited illusions can fit in nicely.

Once you separate out game mechanics, it seems to be a lot more confusion on what a "low-magic" setting is based on a person's sense of disbelief. Most modern games are "low magic," but cell phones and Google can blow most D&D spells about communication and divination out of the water.

You could give a D&D party a couple of magic items as walkie-talkies and some would say it's high magic. But if you gave them literal walkie-talkies, they'd be cool with it as technology.

For me, beyond what players can do. Magic=tech and a "low magic" discussion is more relevant to what PCs can do in that setting. It could be a science fantasy setting and PC could access the same "magic items" as everyone else, but if they can't fling fireballs or teleport without a teleport circle, it's "low magic" to me.
 

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Slit518

Adventurer
I am not going to read all 9+ pages of the thread.

But my suggestion for a low-magic world using D&D 5e rules.

First, allow characters to gain spells up to spell level 3rd if they wish to play a caster.

Second, allow them to cast those spells at higher levels, so for example my Wizard can not access 4th level spells or higher! But he can cast his Fireball at 3rd - 9th level depending on how powerful he is.

Third, if you allow magic items, I suggest common, uncommon, and maybe +1 for weapons and armor at the highest levels. These should be sparse things.

Magic casters should be rare! The part should not encounter enemy Wizards, Sorcerers, Druids, Clerics, etc... all the time. And the party should be limited to 1 caster, maybe 2 if the 2nd character is a half to third caster.

Offer spell less Ranger and Paladin options.

Bar the Eldritch Knight and Arcane Trickster sub-classes.
 

Jay Verkuilen

Grand Master of Artificial Flowers
Once you separate out game mechanics, it seems to be a lot more confusion on what a "low-magic" setting is based on a person's sense of disbelief. Most modern games are "low magic," but cell phones and Google can blow most D&D spells about communication and divination out of the water.

Yeah, that's why I suggest that people think about it, particularly in the sense that magic is often a substitute for technology. The real question is whether there are things like rapid communication, fast travel, area effect control, etc., is possible. If it is, how common is it? If it's super rare and mostly out of reach, that will ensure a more pre-modern feel.
 

Eltab

Lord of the Hidden Layer
The 4e Ashes of Athas campaign did a nice job with a setting where Magic Items were rare, highly coveted, and likely to bring multiple Overwhelming Forces down on whoever possessed it - and therefore YOU were low-magic even though there was high magic available.

Approximately 1/level, if you accomplished the scenario goal, you got the opportunity to add a spell-like power to your character that duplicated a magic item's abilities.

I still have a druid that can run atop the Sea of Silt. (This would be Wave Runner Boots in any other world - or Silt Runner Sandals on Athas.)
 

Eltab

Lord of the Hidden Layer
Gandalf is the only one who's all PEW PEW LAZERZ with his fire and lightning.
And Gandalf, stuck up a tree and dropping flaming pine cones on worgs, even grumbles "Now I have just written 'GANDALF IS HERE' in plain words for anybody who can read the signs."
 


Jon Bradley

First Post
FantasyCraft takes a different approach.

One of the aspects of the Crafty game engine is Campaign Qualities where you set up the game you want to run. Two of these options include Miracles (divine magic) and Sorcery (arcane magic). Under both are a cascade of options you can use to flavor them being allowed in the game.

As an example for Miracles, one is titled Wrathful Universe which basically means if you break your god's oath as a Priest then you get cursed. One of the Curse options involves a permanent negative modifier to all attack checks, skills checks and saves until Atonement occurs.

Some of the examples for Sorcery have some bearing on the discussion here. You can choose to eliminate some schools of magic from being available entirely. They just gone and do not exist which makes finding a school with a single spell from that school so much more worthy. Another could be making it more difficult to cast all magic spells perhaps by doubling the casting time or lowering the save DCs for those resisting.

I prefer a third option for this discussion. What if Magic was corrupting? What if every time a PC cast a spell they had to make a Save equal to 10 plus double the Spell level so for a 3rd level Spell they have to make a DC 16 Save (or triple it so this would be a DC 19 Save)? Failure means they start gaining levels of Taint that only dissolve after so much time. Too many levels of Taint and your PC suddenly becomes a permanent NPC.

Alternately, you can just not active Miracles or Sorcery and thus remove Priests and Mages along with any associated classes from the game entirely. This is more difficult, as noted above, because higher levels practically require you to have magic or magic items just to survive. Once you cross 10th level, it becomes more difficult. I know I played in a 3.5 game with a fighter who did not believe in using a lot of magic items. In fact, he only had 3 when the game ended around 15th level: a magic flail, a ring of protection and a bag of holding. Yeah, he died quite a bit but I was trying to make it work as best as possible.

FantasyCraft has some differences from both D&D and Pathfinder which make it a better fit for running low magic or no magic campaigns. It uses a spell point system for arcane magic, an actual Spellcasting skill and is multi-attribute dependent for Mages. There is no dump stat in the Crafty engine either so you really pay for min-maxing yourself out. Also, skill heavy or non-combat focused characters can still affect things during combat with regularity including inducing an opponent to suffer stress damage. Yes, this is another type of damage but so worth it.

As an example, there was a story I read of a group of 7 FantasyCraft PCs playing their first game. The group included 4 combat heavy PCs, 2 combat capable and a very non-combat Courtier class (or the most dangerous person in a castle, Cersei from GoT is a solid example). They were making their way down a forest path when they were ambushed by a goblin warband which doubled their number and lead by a goblin shaman. The Courtier, due to a character option taken in chargen, got to act in the Ambush round and won the initiative over the goblins. They used their single action to Threaten (a combat action using the Intimidate skill) the goblin shaman and they crit succeeded. The goblin shaman failed his check, suffered Stress damage and the GM rolled for Morale which the shaman failed. It took off running forcing a general morale check which most of the goblins failed so they followed. Regular initiative order started up with 7 PCs vs 1 lone goblin who made his check. The Courtier still had the highest initiative and reminded the goblin of what happened causing it to run away.

I used this example because it demonstrates FantasyCraft does allow you to critically succeed using Skills and non-combat characters can use interpersonal options in combat such as Threaten, Distract, Tire, Taunt and Anticipate.

With the options available in FantasyCraft, I very easily can run a low or no magic campaign without worry. On the first page of this discussion, compared magic to be like an extra layer of icing on a cake. It is an apt description.
 

Jay Verkuilen

Grand Master of Artificial Flowers
And Gandalf, stuck up a tree and dropping flaming pine cones on worgs, even grumbles "Now I have just written 'GANDALF IS HERE' in plain words for anybody who can read the signs."
Definitely, especially given the fact that he's pretty much the only one around who can do that sort of thing, given that he has the Ring of Fire. Beyond that, The One Ring and the 5E port AIME has the "Eye of Sauron" rule.
 

Eltab

Lord of the Hidden Layer
IIRC - and I may not - Gandalf had a ring of healing and endurance*, not of Fire. What did you use as an information source?

* Cirdan had given him one of the Three Elven Rings.
 

Dannyalcatraz

Schmoderator
Staff member
Supporter
IIRC - and I may not - Gandalf had a ring of healing and endurance*, not of Fire. What did you use as an information source?

* Cirdan had given him one of the Three Elven Rings.
I’m not a LotR scholar, so I went to the Wiki.

Narya

The first ring, Narya, was adorned with a red gemstone, perhaps a ruby. It is seen in the final chapter of The Lord of the Rings, along with the other two Elven rings. But unlike them, it is not said what metal Narya was made of.

The name is derived from the Quenya nár meaning fire. It was also called Narya the Great, Ring of Fire, Red Ring, and The Kindler.

According to Unfinished Tales, at the start of the War of the Elves and Sauron, Celebrimbor gave Narya together with the Ring Vilya to Gil-galad, High King of the Noldor. Gil-galad entrusted Narya to his lieutenant Círdan, Lord of the Havens of Mithlond, who kept it after Gil-galad's death. According to The Lord of the Rings, Gil-galad received only Vilya, while Círdan received Narya from the very beginning along with Galadriel receiving Nenya from the start.

In the Third Age, Círdan, recognizing Gandalf's true nature as one of the Maiar from Valinor, gave him the ring to aid him in his labours. It is described as having the power to inspire others to resist tyranny, domination, and despair (in other words, evoking hope in others around the wielder), as well as giving resistance to the weariness of time.


And from what I understand, Círdan looked a bit like this...
View attachment 95363
 

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