The Economics of Magic Items (RE: Naked Adventurers)

The Sigil

Mr. 3000 (Words per post)
Working up a treatment of "the Economy of Magic Items" but let's take a real quick look at a couple of things here. Posting from work, without the DMG, so had to rely on Jamis Buck's generators - took the MAXIMUM found in each with 10 runs and rounded up... if you're easily bored, skip to the last 5 paragraphs.

City Size: Highest Level Wiz/Sor; GP Limit
Thorp: 1; 25 gp
Implication:
Nothing with a value of over 25 gp will be found here. That pretty much rules out all magic items except possibly 0th-level scrolls.

Hamlet: 2; 100 gp
Implication: You may find potions of cure light wounds and a first-level scroll. Maybe. But that's it. Local hedge wizard can't even make a +1 dagger if he wants to. Heck, he can't even find a masterwork dagger to enchant. Economy might - might - be able to support one minor potion shop.

Village: 3; 150 gp
Implication: Just like a hamlet, there really isn't much to buy here. The local wizard could make a +1 dagger, but there are no MW daggers to be found (cost over 300 gp). Economy might have one minor potion shop and/or scrolls shop but no more. No MW stuff, only 1st-level potions and scrolls. Local hedge wizard can enchant a +1 weapon - but only if you import the MW weapon for him. He won't have the resources to buy one, though.

Small Town: 4; 800 gp
Implications: Town has the resources to support a couple of potion shops, including one that makes "high-powered potions." Might see a 1st-level-spell wand shop. Supports masterwork weapons, but not magic armor, shields, or even minor wondrous items (800 gp is too little). The local hedge wizard can't brew the high-level potions though; he's only level 4. So you're looking at 1st-level wands, 1st- and 2nd- level potions and scrolls, and MW items.

Large Town: 7; 3, 000 gp
Implications: Only in a large town do you even start to see much of a market for items other than potions or scrolls. You will see the occasional +1 weapon or armor and the most minor of wondrous items. Wands might have 2nd-level power. The local wizards may be able to enchant a +2 item for you, but certainly can't buy one from you. Scrolls of 4th level and below will likely be available - but from only one source. Minor potions and scrolls are likely to be plentiful - you might see three or four potion shops.

Small City: 10; 12,000 gp
Implications: You start to see 5th-level scrolls, pretty much any potion is easy to come by, and you may find +1 and +2 weapons/armor - possibly +3 armor, though that taxes the magical resources of the town. Minor wondrous items can be had here. Most wands are probably available, too. There is likely a magic trade, but due to the fact that a typical small city has only between 1 and 4 magicians over 4th level, the trade is probably small and tightly controlled.

Large City: 13; 40,000 gp
Implications: Here, folks have the magical power and money to look at +4 weapons/armor, but they're still rare. You can get your hands on scrolls of 6th and possibly 7th level. Only in large cities do you even start seeing staffs (staves?). Potions are commonplace, as are lower level scrolls - anything you can get in a large town will be easy to find here, though more powerful items will be rarer and limited to a more exclusive group of mages (again, probably less than half a dozen). Also, have you noticed that you really can't even begin to contemplate most RINGS until you're in a large city?!?

Metropolis: 18; 90,000 gp
Implications: Scrolls (any level) and potions can be had here fairly easily. Weapons and armor of all enchantments can be made, but you're unlikely to see a weapon with an effective bonus of more than +6. Only in a metropolis are wondrous items of great power even remotely close to "widely available." However, the magical power is still somewhat consolidated - anything that would be "small and tightly controlled" in a small city is easily found here - lots of 8th and 9th level mages (comparatively) but anything beyond that in power will again be controlled by a few mages - 6 to 8 on average. Considering that metropoli tend to be seats of power, you can bet that at least one of those mages is in an advisory role to the crown (or whatever), which diminishes your chance of finding such items even more.

Blah, blah, blah... what does this all mean?

Basically, it's REALLY hard to buy and sell magic items other than wands, scrolls, and potions, and you have to be in a small city before you can easily contemplate getting anything but 1st-level spells in your magic items.

Note that I haven't even tried to contemplate the time factor involved in creating items. Remember, it takes 1 day per 1,000 gp of price to create magic items. Keep that in mind, too... it means that even if you CAN find that flaming +5 sword, it took the guy 98 days to create it - he's not going to have a dozen of them lying around.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that magic items other than potions, scrolls, and wands, are going to be in short supply, even in metropoli. That's because there simply isn't much of a market for them (little supply - few high-level mages - plus little demand - only in a metropolis can people even afford such stuff - translates into almost no market and therefore no magic item shops for rings, staves, swords, et al). Keep this in mind as your players sell off stuff... they may find a buyer, but they will almost NEVER find a seller.

There should be a fairly brisk market for potions (cheap and usable by all), scrolls (cheaper than potions - but usable only by a few), and wands (more expensive than potions and usable by fewer) in that order, but that's about it. The biggest market will be for potions, which means that unless a wizard has a "special order," he's more likely to brew a potion than create a wand or scribe a scroll - because he has a greater chance of selling a potion to the average joe off the street (read: Com1).

You're only going to find a Sears-style "magic shop" where players can shop for the latest in magical items in a large city or metropolis - and maybe not even then if the resident mage has other things to do. Just using the city stat blocks in and of themselves can give you a pretty fair idea of what kind of magical economy should/ought to/can exist in a D&D game. This also solves the problems of the players thinking the DMG is a "mail-order catalogue" for magic items - unless they plan on burning the gold, XP, time, and Feats to make such items themselves. :D

--The Sigil
 

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*snip, snip ... and one more snip*

... ah perfect,

*wolf pastes this in his odd rules and ideas document for 3e stuff*
 

This supports thew way I run things. One use items (scrolls/potions) are the most common and easy to get. The few metropolises that have magic shops I have the inventory all typed up and ready to go by the time they get there. Most PCs find it's easier to befriend a mage who takes special orders or do it themselves when it comes to magical items.
 

Mind sharing?

Wolf72 said:
*snip, snip ... and one more snip*

... ah perfect,

*wolf pastes this in his odd rules and ideas document for 3e stuff*
Since I put stuff in your document, mind sharing it with me? :D

If you are willing to share, please e-mail to me at the_sigil@hotmail.com

Thanks, Wolf! :)

--The Sigil
 

G'day

Nice post! I think your study shows a lot of interest.

One thing that you're going to have to think about a bit is the question of whether magic item makers make items on speculation or to order. There might be a corner solution, but the general result is that they, or perhaps different ones, will do some of each.

Items made on speculation will often be available as soon as buyers walk into the shop, which is an advantage to the buyers. But a maker might have to wait for some time for his items to sell, which is a disadvantage to him. The result, of course, is that items made on spec and available at short notice will sell at a premium (or, equivalently, items made to order will sell at a discount). The equilibrium premium on spec items must be sufficient to compensate the speculator for forgone interest on the capital tied up in his stock. That depends on the interest rate and the average time that an item waits on the shelf. And the wait time, I guess, must depend on the nature and price of the item. The result is that items people (PC and NPC) buy fairly predictably and often will have small premiums, where the more expensive and unusual items will have longer wait times on the shelf, and therefore will sell only at a large premium (if they are made on spec at all).

Obviously, you are going to need to make some judgements about what items are commonly used. First, think of things that are cost-effective and achieve something that people often want in everyday life. Then check the NPC listings to see what items NPCs often buy. And then do some sort of survey of players to find out what items PCs buy.

In the case of really major items made on spec, where the maker (or broker) invests significant capital, so that the uncertainty of the time when the thing will sell means that the broker is taking a significant gamble, there must be a risk premium on top of the premium for pure return on capital. But with such a large premium it will be more difficult to compete with items made to order. So generally the only such items that will be made on spec are those that are needed urgently (no time to wait, no alternative) when they are needed. Wands of Cure Disease, potions of Restoration, and Ghost Touch weapons spring to mind as likely 'lottery tickets'.

Anyway: good luck with your study of the market for magic items. Feel free to get in touch with me if you want advice or an 'internal' review.

Regards,


Agback
 

Excellent.

My only comment would be to remind the readers that magic items are very durable and would stay in the economy a long time. That +1 sword could be a thousand years old.
 

BiggusGeekus said:
Excellent.

My only comment would be to remind the readers that magic items are very durable and would stay in the economy a long time. That +1 sword could be a thousand years old.

Adventurers tend to abuse their stuff alot though. I can see collectors taking the really popular stuff out of the economy as well. There are thousands of old vettes and mustangs that get driven MAYBE a week a year.

EDIT: Had to cut off to bring in groceries :D

in Simpsons comic guy voice: "AHEM! What you are looking at is a vintage Keen longsword of Sure Striking Ghost Touch. Elminster only made TWO before moving to his 'Mithril armor' style. Do NOT breathe on it! I only allow such lowly adventurers as yourself to gaze upon it so you know what you shall never obtain. Now BEGONE! Slay a goblin or something..."
 
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Of course, locally availibility doesn't mean all that much at higher levels. For example, our group could never find anything magical in shadowdale. However, we teleported to Waterdeep when seeking to trade magic items, even potions and scrolls.

Powerful people will be seeking out the powerful magic toys, because they can afford them. And the world can be very small for those with lots of power.

Besides, buying magical stuff is rip off.
--------------------------------------------------------

How many permanent magical items get destroyed in your game? Adventurers probably make more permanent items than they ruin on their adventures.
 

Implications of the gp limits in the DMG

Results direct from Newmanworld, a place which will be familiar to long-time denizens of rgfd, but perhaps not to most ENWorlders.


[repost]

From: Peter Newman (pnewman@gci.net)
Subject: Seven billion Chickens!
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd
Date: 2001-08-22 01:35:28 PST


According to the DMG a community with 30,000 adults will
have 7,500,000,000 chickens. [DMG p 137]

0.5 x the GP limit [100,000] x 0.1 x the population [30,000]
is the total value available. Thus at any given time the
metropolis will have 150,000,000 GP's worth of chickens
available. At 2 CP/chicken this will be 7.5 billion chickens.

Similarly this community will have 15 million cows, 15 billion
candles, 15 billion pounds of wheat (7.5 million tons),
7.5 billion pounds of flour, 15 billion torches, 300 million
pounds of soap, 7.5 billion loaves of bread, 1.5 billion flasks
of oil, 1.5 billion peasants outfits, 750 million pounds of
cheese, and much much more

It will also have 3 billion arrows, 10 million longswords,
10,000 suits of full plate armor, 1,000 keeps, 1,500 longships,
3,000 grand houses, 15,000 simple houses, and 100 grand castles
available.

These rules are very broken.
 
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