The Ethics of Slaying half-fiendish silver dragons

Jürgen Hubert

First Post
Backstory: I am running a Forgotten Realms campaign, and one of the threads of the campaign revolves around an extremely powerful demon called the "Father of Wyrms" who has fathered offspring with a number of dragons (mostly against their will). The resulting half-fiendish dragons have three red eyeballs in each of their eye sockets, a trait that they have inherited from their father.

The PCs have already fought one of these creatures when they were 3rd level - a half-fiendish wyrmling green dragon, which was little more than an acid-spitting killing machine hiding in the catacombs beneath a castle where it emerged from time to time to kill some of the inhabitants. They managed to talk to it for a few moments (this party always tries to talk first), but it only taked about feasting on other people - on both their meat and their fear.

Now the PCs are 6th level. They decided to travel across the Spine of the World Mountains to see the Endless Ice Sea for themselves (they are like that, too...). Along the way, they crossed into the territory of King Obould Many-Arrows (the current big orc warlord of the North), and after spectacularly incinerating a patrol of dire bat riding orc scouts (and leaving a survivor to tell the story to the other orcs), they moved through the orc territory with as much haste as they could muster until they reached the other side of the mountain pass.


About one year ago, King Obould had an unexpected visitor: A strange, hooded figure (one of the oldest members of the Father of Wyrm's brood) who brought a gift: A Very Young Half-Fiendish female silver dragon, who was instructed to "stay with Obould until she was big and strong". Obould let her live in the caves below Dark Arrow Keep where she snacked on the occasional orc Obould was displeased with.

Now there were some reports about "powerful wizards" who were passing through orc territory and who destroyed an orc patrol. Obould then instructed here to "keep an eye on these strangers" and to "kill them if they posed a threat to him". She changed form into an eagle and followed the PCs, and close to the Endless Ice Sea the druid spotted her when he took the form of an eagle as well - the six red eyeballs freaked him out a lot...

Shortly after that, the PCs discovered a huge structure emerging from the glaciers which will turn out to be an ancient habitat built by the Sarrukh, the serpent folk progenitor race of the Forgotten Realms. They saw the eagle circling above them, but there wasn't much they could do about it.

Within the habitat, they finally met the dragon, who had now taken the shape of a small human girl with "gleaming white hair with black streaks" - and six red eyeballs. They discovered her in a room-sized orrery where large hollow crystals representing planets were floating around in circles. She had taken control of the magical control mechanism and proceeded to let the crystals crash into each other, giggling all the way.

The PCs, despite being freaked out again, talked to her, and she willingly engaged them in conversation. She frankly admitted her orders, asked them if they were "really as powerful mages as the orcs claimed", proved to be very curious about everything - and utterly without any empathy for other beings. For example, she told them that she likes to take things apart "to see how they work", and then proceeded to explain her knowledge of both the crystalline structures of the habitat and the internal organs of orcs with great enthusiasm.

One of the PCs then argued with her that it is Wrong to take apart living things (which didn't convince her at all) and that it is possible to learn much more about things by putting them together instead of taking them apart (which she said she will think about - the player rolled really well with Diplomacy). They then left her presence with the promise "to look her up later", to which she replied: "Perhaps I will look you up first." which freaked them out even more...

Once they were out of earshot, they argued what to do with her. One PC argued for killing her immediately because she was obviously evil and unnatural, one was against killing any thinking being that did not pose an immediate threat to them or others, and the third one hasn't made up his mind up one way or another. In the end, they agreed that exploring some of the other dangers this habitat might hold (and they have some hints about those) took precedence before the dragon...


So, what should happen next? The dragon is very evil and selfish, but if one of the PCs truly wants to turn her from the Path of Evil, I will make it possible - but they should go through hell (pardon the pun) for it. She is highly intelligent (Int 20, Wis 15) and doesn't care for the feeling of others at all except for some sort detached curiosity about these emotions - she certainly doesn't think it is wrong to hurt people.

But right now, she doesn't want to kill the PCs... yet. They seem much more interesting than the orcs that had kept her company so far, and she is also a bit wary about their potential power (though what she has seen so far hasn't impressed her much). Instead she will follow them around in disguise, observe them, and try put them through a variety of "tests" and situations to see how they react. Remember, though she doesn't know much about the world, she is highly intelligent and perceptive, and will quickly figure out just how far she can go until the PCs will react to her. Her being around means a constant source of small provocations for the PCs...

So, what kinds of behaviours and "tests" do you suggest for her? What should she do to get some kind of reaction from the PCs - what will upset the PCs without neccessarily making them want to kill her immediately?
 

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Firstly, yoink on the Father of Wyrms idea.

Secondly, sounds like you have a really cool group.

Thirdly, I'd say redemption shouldn't be too difficult: After all, she is really still a child. Lots of kids pull legs off spiders, and the don't all grow up to be Ted Bundy. And, you don't want your players to feel you are punishing them for taking the road less travelled. That said, don't make it a gimme either: she has been raised by orcs and is half demon, and the players probably won't find it as satisfying if they don't believe they've earned it.

So, where is the sweet spot between too easys and too hard? :D :p :) :) ;) :cool:ed if I know! Thats a matter for you and your group I'm afraid.

Sorry I couldn't be more helpfull.


glass.
 
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Well it sounds like she's acting like a child. Just have her act like one. Nothing's more hazardous and dangerous than a child with more power than the adults.
 

glass said:
Firstly, yoink on the Father of Wyrms idea.

Thanks. I'm rather proud of that idea. And while the PCs realize that she is a half-fiendish dragon, they haven't realized that she is a half-fiendish silver dragon. I can't wait to see their faces when they learn this...

...not to mention their faces when they meet her "big brother" - a grown up half-fiendish gold dragon. Learning that such beings are even possible should make them worry about the eventual climax of the campaign, where they will finally meet Big Daddy...

Secondly, sounds like you have a really cool group.

Yes, I got really lucky - I met them over the internet when I moved to a new city last year. And strangely, all of them are physicists as well...
 

Wow! That sounds really cool. And an interesting bunch of players - some great reactions to the campaign there.

Anyway, I think her tests could make a great mechanism for changing her evil ways. The PCs have presented her with several new ideas... Perhaps turn them back against them and see how things pan out? Put them under pressure/tempt them and see how well their ideals hold up? I love moral quandries! :D

[RAMBLING IDEAS]

A good samaritan setup: My initial thought would be to use something she feels the PCs might not help. An unconcious orc - sure she can provide one of them! With a nice shiny toy. Will the PCs kill it? Steal the toy? Will they help it?


How far will they go to help someone?

One I had run against me by an evil DM:

Pair of critters waiting by a roadside. In this case devils. With a small child.
We questioned them and were not satisfied with their answers. So we killed them and rescued the child.
Thus saddling us with a traumatised child to care for.
We managed to get her talking a little and took her back to her home village.
Turns out the village had sold the child to the devils to get protection from another threat. Cowardly child selling villagers were not people we wished to deal with... but could we leave them to get slaughtered?
Ended up with a good few sessions of sidetracks.
Was a complicated situation with no real right answers.

Lots of fun. Sure she could engineer something similar...

[/RAMBLING IDEAS]
 

I just thought of something: One of the PCs told here that "it is more fun to put things together than to take them apart".

So she will first take some local animals apart with her claws - there are lots of snakes in the habitat, for example - and then "put them together again" by sticking the segments to each other. And then she will deliberately leave those carcasses where the PCs can find them...
 

Expanding on that idea, if you're going to have the girl as a recurring character, why not have her learn to really put creatures together through her experiments? It would a good opportunity to use as many bizzare templated creatures and abberations as you can find, and would make for some good combat encounters, or even non-combat if she learns to create intelligence as well.

Just a thought.
 

Maybe have her start down the road to the Fleshwarper PrC from Lords of Madness. I'm sure her father would be eager to give her some pointers, or failing that hire the tutelage she needs.
 

Mmm... moral ambiguity...

My immediate reaction would be that you should give the players a fair chance at redeeming her if they put their hearts into it. Partly because, as has been mentioned, it would make sense that since they've got to her while she's still impressionable they should be able to strongly affect her mindset if they go about it the right (or wrong) way.

Also, and to me more importantly, because it seems like it will make for a better story. The players will get a real sense of satisfaction that they managed to redeem her, and you'll be left with a great big bundle of fantastic plot hooks revolving around just what her siblings (and her father, and maybe even her mother too) think about the whole thing. It seems unlikely they'll just watch impassively, after all.
 

Eluvan said:
Mmm... moral ambiguity...

My immediate reaction would be that you should give the players a fair chance at redeeming her if they put their hearts into it. Partly because, as has been mentioned, it would make sense that since they've got to her while she's still impressionable they should be able to strongly affect her mindset if they go about it the right (or wrong) way.

Also, and to me more importantly, because it seems like it will make for a better story. The players will get a real sense of satisfaction that they managed to redeem her, and you'll be left with a great big bundle of fantastic plot hooks revolving around just what her siblings (and her father, and maybe even her mother too) think about the whole thing. It seems unlikely they'll just watch impassively, after all.

My thoughts precisely. It's just that I want to impress on them what a difficult task this is going to be - trying to "convert" someone with strong natural malevolent tendencies, and who is smarter than all of them...
 

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