The Gods do not know all - effect on divination

[Greybar]

For thought, comment, critique, etc.

Premise:
I think that in most campaign worlds, all gods are not omniscient. Having multiple omniscient gods could be kinda complicated. So, since divine Divination spells ask questions of the above, how do those gods know the answers?

Concept:
Gods know things (and can relay through divination) that:
1) They have observed. This can be through divine senses or those of their avatars, but that's pretty rare outside of their home plane unless you have gods popping in for tea on the Prime on a regular basic in your campaign.
2) That have been reported to them (part 1). By the field reports (i.e. prayers) of the faithful, particularly clerics and paladin types but also commonly devout as well.
3) That have been reported to them (part 2). By communication with other friendly gods and their servants.
4) That, given data from the above, they can surmise given their incredible mental capabilities.

Effects:
1) Even the simplest "Weal or Woe" may not be able to tell you a troll is down there if the divine knowledgebase doesn't know it is there. This is a potentially really big nerf on Divination spells.
2) Good gods may have a better divine knowledgebase because good by nature tends to make friends and exchange info.
3) Knowledge may be quite a currency between heirarchies of gods.

Big one:
Adventurers are very important to knowledge gathering. Having one of your devout followers go into that dark wood may be the only way to find out little tidbits that the divine knowledgebase can combine to predict the bigger plan of the opposing gods.


Possible additional info gathering:
* Portfolio based. Beyond the divine senses, perhaps the Sun God (and/or his servant celestials) can see everything that transpires in sunlight. This would help with the "evil works at night" feel. It would perhaps best be not that everything is automatically seen, but that someone up in the Sun-Palace is watching a certain place at a certain time. But this could be hard to evenly distribute to all gods portfolios, making the knowledge edge favor some. How does the god of secrets, lies, and knowledge fit into this without the god of sun becoming the de facto best god for knowledge.

 

[Steverooo]

Deities can divine, as well. If one wants to know whether going to the next level will produce weal or Woe, one would no doubt LOOK to see!

 

[TheAuldGrump]

I go with portfolio based myself.

Given that the major religions in my homebrew are monotheistic I use saints and prophets instead of diety for determining portfolio.

The Auld Grump

 

[Thanee]

Yes, it makes sense, that they can answer questions related to their portfolio.

They probably do not simply know everything, no.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Nifft]

IMC, the gods simply don't answer some questions.

Is this because they don't know? Well, they won't answer that one either.

-- N

 

[Greybar]

Deities can divine, as well. If one wants to know whether going to the next level will produce weal or Woe, one would no doubt LOOK to see!

In this context, I assume you mean the use of clairvoyant type powers, rather than appealing to a yet-higher-deity for an answer.

Certainly the clairvoyance is a wrinkle on the whole thing that I hadn't thought of, but it does fit in the "must take effort of the divinity or servant". A 1st level cleric asking for weal or woe may not be worth one of a finite number of celestial servants using a clairvoyance ability.

 

[Greybar]

IMC, the gods simply don't answer some questions.

Is this because they don't know? Well, they won't answer that one either.

-- N

From the mortal perspective, I agree this is completely good and correct. I'm tussling with the deity level motives in some ways, and then want to drive down to the hero level from there.

john

 

[Nifft]

Also IMC, note that knowing certain things isn't good for your mental health.

So the Gods are:

1/ Averse to certain knowledge, because it could drive them mad, too;
2/ Kind and wise, and don't want weak Humans to learn insane secrets;
3/ Fundamentally part of the ORDER of things, and thus blind to insane CHAOS secrets; or
4/ Limited, and simply don't know some stuff.

Note that these are ideas, as opposed to restrictions. IMHO, it's best to define the kind of flavor & feel you want first, rather than derive the setting from first principles.

-- N

 

[Greybar]

Note that these are ideas, as opposed to restrictions. IMHO, it's best to define the kind of flavor & feel you want first, rather than derive the setting from first principles.

that is indeed a weakness of mine.

Thanks for the ideas and comments!

 

[Prince of Happiness]

Another idea is that rival gods make block a certain deity's ability to grant knowledge to the petitioner, or just outright distort everything that they can get their grubby little divine fingers on. I don't think either Loki or Cyric would think that's a manuever that's too low.