OSR The Gygaxian Naturalism Appreciation Thread

[Simon Miles]

I love Gygaxian naturalism and wish it were more present in the OSR.

There aren't enough autodidact beardos getting out of their depth with cockamamie amateur science today.

I want more essays on realistic falling damage, realistic ecology, realistic economics, realistic poisons, realistic lockpicking, realistic armor/weapons, etc.

Geek culture has become mainstream, but nerd culture is still on the margins. I think there's both a capitalistic and culture war component to that. Nerdery produces little profitable IP and many left-leaning people seem to have a bit of an intrinsic allergy to it.

The whole ecology thing I agree with. I'm a Science teacher and, although I am a Physics specialist, I couldn't help myself. I was inspired particularly by Decent into the Depths of the Earth and the Vault of the Drow and the prevalence of fungus in those environments.
I worked out the ecology of our world build as a base-level of realism onto which I built everything else. On Earth everything is built on Photosynthesis so all the producers are on the surface. I invented Thaumosynthesis; plants (mainly fungi-appearing Thaumofungus) that made their food from magical fields.
The magical fields emanate from the Moon and permeate the whole world - so there's just as much life underground as there is on the surface. There are also Thaumobeasts, which are animals that derive part of their food from Thaumosynthesis, the biggest of which are the Dragons, which require actual food less and less as they grow old and spend more time sleeping and dreaming as they get older, deriving sustenance from the magical fields around them.
It was great fun and I eventually wrote it all down in detail in SM05 The World Guide to Barnaynia - less than $5 for the pdf on Drive thru ;-)

 

[Simon Miles]

I love it. A lot of the early publications are fun to read; not just as a set of game rules. The ideas that are brushed past let your own imagination shoot off in random directions, even though the very florid text often left gaps and ambiguity that would lead to endless arguments and the advent of the "Rules Lawyer" style of player - I only met one proper Rules Lawyer and he abandoned my table after only a couple of weeks.
The newer version are FAR better written, as regards rulesets, which is what they are of course. The ambiguity has gone, the areas of development have been streamlined and they are great to play... but....
They just don't have the FEEELS of the original stuff. Those great paragraphs of the classic scenarios with the useful, vital bits of information buried deep within them, like lost lore, made them very difficult to play, I agree, but they also made them great fun. Exciting and mysterious. Some of the new adventures are excellently presented and great to use as an adventure but as about as inspiring as a spreadsheet.
Does OSR do this? Well, sadly, I think it does. A bit. I play Osric. I love it because all the annoying little ambiguities and irrational bits (like 18:00 instead of 18:99 being just before 19) have been "corrected" or at least clarified, but is has also avoided building the world to let you use whatever old, traditional, inspiring stuff you want. Or the new stuff if you like spreadsheets.
Of course, there's still fiercely detailed, wild ramblings and mad ideas for gameworlds out there, firmly in the spirit of the Old School inspirations if you want to look (this last bit is a shameless plug for the stuff I help with from Dunromin University Press - available on DriveThruRPG at frankly embarrassingly good value for money...)

 

[Gus L]

To me the core of Gygaxian Naturalism is the essay on "the Campaign" in the 1E DMG, especially the "Climate & Ecology" section on pg. 88 - 89 or so. It ends with this: "In any event, do not allow either the demands of "realism" or impossible makebelieve to spoil your milieu. Climate and ecology are simply reminders to use a bit of care!"

To me that's the core of it - a sort of base of plausibility - they reality of myths and novels. Yes the ogre must eat and drink, and it will leave its cave to go down to the stream once a day to water its cattle and collect a jug. We don't need to calculate the amount of water the ogre uses each day, or the number of cattle it needs to satisfy its daily caloric intake. The point is to add interesting and details that can be derived from common sense and are useful in play... You might bribe the ogre with better food variety, ambush him while he's doing his chores or steal his cattle and make him both furious and hungry. These are the ways that RPF naturalism becomes "Gygaxian", rather then being a basis for additional rules and calculations that aim to make a clockwork fantasy world.

On the other hand, as with much of old D&D there is a particular focus to Gygaxian Naturalism in the old books - information that applies directly to violent conflict. We learn a monsters weaknesses and special powers, military organization, and maybe a little about its behavior. Only rarely do we get any details about its material culture (if it has one), life cycle, or desires ... and when we do it's usually very simple. I think this is largely fine - natural and socio-political histories of fantasy creatures aren't especially helpful to playing a game ... but they aren't something we should entirely forget about when designing or refereeing.

 

[Krachek]

The whole ecology thing I agree with. I'm a Science teacher and, although I am a Physics specialist, I couldn't help myself. I was inspired particularly by Decent into the Depths of the Earth and the Vault of the Drow and the prevalence of fungus in those environments.
I worked out the ecology of our world build as a base-level of realism onto which I built everything else. On Earth everything is built on Photosynthesis so all the producers are on the surface. I invented Thaumosynthesis; plants (mainly fungi-appearing Thaumofungus) that made their food from magical fields.
The magical fields emanate from the Moon and permeate the whole world - so there's just as much life underground as there is on the surface. There are also Thaumobeasts, which are animals that derive part of their food from Thaumosynthesis, the biggest of which are the Dragons, which require actual food less and less as they grow old and spend more time sleeping and dreaming as they get older, deriving sustenance from the magical fields around them.
It was great fun and I eventually wrote it all down in detail in SM05 The World Guide to Barnaynia - less than $5 for the pdf on Drive thru ;-)

In the remains of Tchernobyl they have found fungus that feed on radiations.

 

[Micah Sweet]

On the other hand, as with much of old D&D there is a particular focus to Gygaxian Naturalism in the old books - information that applies directly to violent conflict. We learn a monsters weaknesses and special powers, military organization, and maybe a little about its behavior. Only rarely do we get any details about its material culture (if it has one), life cycle, or desires ... and when we do it's usually very simple. I think this is largely fine - natural and socio-political histories of fantasy creatures aren't especially helpful to playing a game ... but they aren't something we should entirely forget about when designing or refereeing.

A lot of that information is available in other sources. My personal favorite source is the 2e Monstrous Manual.