D&D (2024) The Half Orc. Are they still needed?

[Shardstone]

I'm someone who is biracial, but tbh, that blue orc art in MOTM really hit, so I'm good without the half-orc anymore. But, I'd rather there just be the PF2E method where you pick a race and you put the half-race feature onto it. Then I could actually have fun exploring the ideas of being mixed in weird fantasy ways without always having to be a half-elf or half-orc.

 

[Minigiant]

It depends on what those features are. Even current RAW, Half-Orcs have:

Darkvision (orc)
Relentless Endurance (orc)
Menacing (skills-Intimidation; human)

and Savage Attacks, which neither currently have (a granted point), but isn't a far stretch from something like Savage Attacker (the feat, which variant humans get a feat anyway).

So, a lot depends on how such a system is created. Using my own (above) as a template, the current Half-Orc could easily be re-imagined as:

Darkvision (strong feature - Orc)
Relentless Endurance (weak feature - Orc)
Savage Attacker (strong feature; feat - Human)
Menacing (weak feature, skills - Human)

And would be even more versatile due to the Human component. It isn't that much of a stretch, really.

Even the current Half-Elf could be done as follows:

Darkvision (strong feature - Elf)
Fey Ancestry (weak feature - Elf)
Skill Versatility (weak feature x2 - Human)
Extra ASI +1 (weak feature extra, see below)

With the caveat that if you select more weak features (as in the double human weak above), you get an additional ASI +1, which is why Half-Elves get +2,+1,+1 instead of just +2,+1.

It is practically build in already, without much work.

Savage Attacks and Savage Attacker are not the same.
Savage Attacks adds a die to melee damage and is specifically designed to make Half Orcs prefer Greataxes.
Savage Attack rerolls all damage dice ones a turn.

That's my point. You would be removing the Half Orc's specialness to support a Half Goblin and Half Gnome

Also racial skill profs look like the are going as will.

 

[DND_Reborn]

Savage Attacks and Savage Attacker are not the same.

Really?

Hmm... I think I wrote something about that. Oh, yeah, here it is...

and Savage Attacks, which neither currently have (a granted point), but isn't a far stretch from something like Savage Attacker

Get it?

 

[Minigiant]

Really?

Hmm... I think I wrote something about that. Oh, yeah, here it is...

Get it?

They're barely alike other than being rerolls.
Savage Attack is Brutal Critical. That point of the Greataxe is that it is worse than the Greatsword except in the hands of a half orc or mid level barbarian.
Savage Attacker (feat) boosts Greatswords further over Greataxes.

The half Orc is the Greataxe race. That's what Half Orcs have over Orcs. Their body and mind is better suited for greataxes.

Now you can say, that's a little too small for a racial difference. That''s why I would either extend it to spells or give all half orcs greataxe and greatclubproficiency (saying that the greataxe feels natural in the hands and is weighted perfecting with the meld of human and orc bodies).

I might even go further and make all half orcs get Extra Attack but only with greataxes and greatclubs.

The halforc wizard with a giant club feels like a great image. You have the orcish warrior with a big club but the human curiosity of them being a wizard.

 

[Minigiant]

Another reason to treat "half-races" as being unique, rather than a mix of traits, is hybrid vigor. Most likely, the offspring of two races should have higher Constitution than their parents.

Also, being able to interbreed would suggest that the two races are related. D&D handwaves this in the case of dragons and planar ancestry, but most races shouldn't be able to interbreed unless their species are actually related. In Tolkien's Middle-Earth, this was apparently true with Humans, Elves, and Goblins/Orcs, and presumably Hobbits (though we never see any examples).

But D&D has no shared ancestry between Elves and Orcs. However, thanks to the reclassification of Goblins as Fey, perhaps they do have connections to Elves. Why Humans can have children with Elves at all is curious- perhaps Elves are still just enough "extraplanar" that the rules that allow for Genasi, Aasimar, and Tieflings apply. Or the origins of Humans are tied to Elves somehow?

Of course there are exceptions in a fantasy game as to why such things can be possible, even among unrelated species, but it usually boils down to "a Wizard did it".

Or maybe a Bard, the old-fashioned way. Got to start those Sorcerer bloodlines somehow!

the PHB hints a possibility that Stout halflings have Dwarven blood.

In my homebrew I ran with it and made the Halfling Goddess marry her 2nd oldest son to the Dwarf god's 2nd oldest daughter. An the union creates the ability for Dwarves and Halflings to have children.

 

[DND_Reborn]

The half Orc is the Greataxe race.

Wow, that is severely limiting view...

I might even go further and make all half orcs get Extra Attack but only with greataxes and greatclubs.

But that seems to be the direction you see half orcs going.

You do realize that everything I'm suggesting would make for a much more versatile and less limited half-orc race??? (Which would more likely appeal to more players IME.)

Any way, this is going no where fast, so enjoy your greataxe half-orcs. Frankly, savage attacker is a pretty poor and limiting racial trait IMO, so I am glad someone seems to like it.

 

[Stormonu]

Don't touch people's gnomes, don't touch my half-orc.

I was furious when it was removed in 2E for that edition. Prior to dragonborn, it was my favorite D&D race.

 

[Azzy]

Don't touch people's gnomes, don't touch my half-orc.

I was furious when it was removed in 2E for that edition. Prior to dragonborn, it was my favorite D&D race.

As was I.

 

[Minigiant]

Wow, that is severely limiting view...

It is. That's why I wish to expand it within its own unique area.

But that seems to be the direction you see half orcs going.

You do realize that everything I'm suggesting would make for a much more versatile and less limited half-orc race??? (Which would more likely appeal to more players IME.)

Any way, this is going no where fast, so enjoy your greataxe half-orcs. Frankly, savage attacker is a pretty poor and limiting racial trait IMO, so I am glad someone seems to like it.

My point is that at a certain point, you end up dilluting the race by making its features swappable, its racial abilities freed, and its lore and culture unlinked.

There's no point of having an a half orc or an orc if there is no major mental, physical, or culture differences between them. Especially if custom lineage is a thing.

The better design in a post-Tasha worldis to focus on uniqueness. If a "swap feature" Half Orc and a full Orc are extremely similiar, you are just making redundant races in a game where race is already less than class, scores, feats, and subclass.

 

[Charlaquin]

The only issue with that is you now need to create or homebrew every combination you want to allow--which if you create a lot of those could be a LOT of races.

If you keep just a handful or so of combinations, then I would agree.

A potential solution is to say that the various “races” are what we would consider separate species, and aren’t compatible breeding partners. Then if you do want any half-and-half races, you specify that they’re sterile crossbreeds like mules, hinnies, ligers, and tyons.