The Immortals Handbook

[Revenge of the Bjorn]

The Worship Points System as conceived by me uses the 'Ascending' or 'Democratic' theory of power, where power derives fundamentally from the lowest element, the belief of the ordinary, mundane human being. This belief-energy powers the multiverse, creates and empowers the gods, etc. It draws from democratic-influenced mythologies such as that of the Greeks, where the gods clearly draw power from their worshippers - power that enables them to become mightier than Elder entities such as the Titans.

The opposing theory of power (whether magical or political) is the 'Descending' or 'Hierarchic' theory, where power flows downwards from powerful beings with an a-priori divine existence to their lesser minions. This theory fits with most Judaeo-Christian doctrine and is exemplified in the works of JRR Tolkien - Iluvatar is the pre-existing divinity from which all power flows, He empowers lower levels down the chain. So Melkor initially receives the largest lump of divine power, but spends so much of it on empowering his minions that he eventually becomes weaker than the Valar who have hoarded theirs more carefully. The OD&D Immortals system also seems closer to the Hierarchic approach.

This explains why rhe idea of power from worship never appealed to me, I subscribe to the second view, with all divinity coming from a single source (cough*The Source*cough*ripping off Kirby[and Taoism and other stuff]*cough) Although with my opinion that there is a semi-non-living source, how would power be distributed...hrrm.

Although today I had a funny idea today of God running for reelection (with an actual physical ballot being taken), and various, deities, demons, angels, and/or people running against the Divine. You can just imagine the campaign speeches. Yeah, I have way too much free time. But I certainly think it could make an interesting campaign.

 

[Zoatebix]

By "Kirby" do you mean universal life-church Kirby?

I had a friend who signed up just so he could get regular emails from a guy named Kirby. He really liked the name.

UK seems to imply that you can use the IH to model any kind of cosmological/ metaphysical/ whateveryouwanttocallit system, OR mix and match said systems, AND have them be ballanced against each other, right?

If I wasn't rabbidly interested before, I certainly am now.
-z

 

[Revenge of the Bjorn]

Sorry, I meant Kirby as in Jack, of comic-book-working-on fame.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey Bjorn mate!

This explains why rhe idea of power from worship never appealed to me, I subscribe to the second view, with all divinity coming from a single source (*cough* The Source *cough* ripping off Kirby [and Taoism and other stuff] *cough*)

Well if you are going to rip off an idea may as well be from the King.

Although with my opinion that there is a semi-non-living source, how would power be distributed...hrrm.

Well initially you could spread it out evenly (those first caught by the god wave perhaps). Subsequently you could redistribute it in a manner similar to Highlander.

Although today I had a funny idea of God running for reelection (with an actual physical ballot being taken), and various, deities, demons, angels, and/or people running against the Divine. You can just imagine the campaign speeches. Yeah, I have way too much free time. But I certainly think it could make an interesting campaign.

Technically this is how you gain glory/worship anyhow. Wait 'til you see the mechanic I have for sorting that out...sweet as a nut.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi there Zoatebix!

UK seems to imply that you can use the IH to model any kind of cosmological/ metaphysical/ whateveryouwanttocallit system, OR mix and match said systems, AND have them be ballanced against each other, right?

I'll not just imply it, I'll flat out state it as a fact.

If I wasn't rabbidly interested before, I certainly am now.

Much appreciated mate.

 

[historian]

Fortunately I have all bases covered within the IH, including 'quickening' style 'Hierarchic' transferences. So the Hierarchic (Power) approach meshes seemlessly with the Democratic (Glory) approach.

I tend to favor the hierarchic approach myself (like Bjorn) for the really big guys, but I think the democratic approach works well for those immortals closer to (wo)mankind (greater deities and lower). Actually, the democratic approach would seem to work well as almost a laissez faire mechanic that the closer-to-the-primal-source deities employ to keep from having to "personally" oversee the affairs of their lessers.

I anticipate using both, to the extent compatible.

Of course those are not the only approaches you can take.

Interesting, very interesting.

I'm glad to hear that your progress is going well Krust!

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi historian mate!

I tend to favor the hierarchic approach myself (like Bjorn) for the really big guys, but I think the democratic approach works well for those immortals closer to (wo)mankind (greater deities and lower). Actually, the democratic approach would seem to work well as almost a laissez faire mechanic that the closer-to-the-primal-source deities employ to keep from having to "personally" oversee the affairs of their lessers.

I anticipate using both, to the extent compatible.

I think people should use both. I think its the best solution to the question of mortal born deities vs. immortal born deities (encompassing things like Demons and Angels)

Interesting, very interesting.

Well, there are a few other less obvious ways of doing it that might interest people; though I would see the two above methods as 'standard'.

I'm glad to hear that your progress is going well Krust!

Thanks mate, we're nearly home.

 

[Revenge of the Bjorn]

Well, there are a few other less obvious ways of doing it that might interest people; though I would see the two above methods as 'standard'.

Will these be included?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey Bjorn mate!

Will these be included?

I am not sure I see people using them as their default method, but they could prove interesting diversions, so yes, they will be included.

 

[historian]

Hello Krust!

I was wondering if you have settled on a maximum challenge rating for your immortal scale at this point.

Thanks in advance.