The Immortals Handbook

[CRGreathouse]

Interesting, though Lesser Deities could still have cosmic abilities.

Is there any reason I couldn't just make it a divine ability (or perhaps a pair of divine abilities) to fit more easily? Or is this not really too hard: how many divine abilities would a (typical?) lesser deity have, and how many does a cosmic ability cost?

Have you decided on the creator as yet?

I don't have any stats, if that's what you mean; I've been waiting on this little book called the Immortals Hanbdbook for that. I have a fair bit of mythology worked out about the creator, though. It's one of my 9 original deities.

Non-humanoid deities might be subordinate to human Pantheons.

They certainly need some kind of grouping if they are that weak.

There's no human pantheon at all -- humans are latecomers in my world, created in historic times. (There are dwarven cities older than all humanity.) The creator of humans (a weak lesser deity) is now dead.

As far as grouping, this creator made and taught 3 gods their 'craft': the god of the elves, the god of the dwarves, and the god of the halflings. After elves and dwarves were made, the god of the orcs made a race of his own -- usurping the halflings' place. Instead of being angry, the creator shunned the god of the halflings and adopted, in some sense, the god of the orcs.

As a result there is a grouping, but it's weak becasue the god of the elves and the god of the dwarves resent the god of the orcs.

Also -- how easy is it for a god to create another (weaker, obviously) god?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hiya mate!

Glad to see you're coming back around again.

Yes, things are almost back to normal, although I will be busy all of Monday.

I know you wasn't gone long in Real Time, but it sure seemed awful quiet while you was dealing with your Grandpa's passing.

Aside from being busy, my internet connection has been on and off over the past few days.

Hope to hear soon IH is up for grabs . *I know I keep repeating comments like that, but I'm dying to see what you've come up with, as my brain's on overload trying to look at all the possiblities at the same instant!

I appreciate the interest. I'd like to get the website up sometime this weekend and then I can concentrate on the IH from then on in.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Howdy Krust!

Hi historian matey!

I hope all is well as can be with you and your family.

Not too bad.

Incidentally, I saw some of your posts at classicmarvel.com and thought they were great.

I'd forgotten about most of those (its been about 2 or 3 months since I have posted there.

Glad you liked them.

I am quite proud of the strength chart.

I've been tinkering around with a homebrew conversion from that to d20 and have found that stats convert easily (using the guidelines that you proposed for strength as the cornerstones), powers are a touch trickier (I used your WMD guidelines and compared that with d20 modern nuke approximation), and that HD approximation is also a bit tricky (I guess I could use psyche to approximate a will save and work backwords -- and tie fighting plus strength into the BAB).

I'm looking forward to any conversion insights that you post on the site!

Take Care.

I'll add some of the MSH conversion stuff to the website eventually but the opening conversion tables on the website are for Divine Ranks between the IH, D&D Immortals and the Primal Order as well as how to convert 1st Ed. AD&D Immortals and (Intelligent) Unique Monsters to 3rd Ed.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi CRGreathouse mate!

Is there any reason I couldn't just make it a divine ability (or perhaps a pair of divine abilities) to fit more easily?

It already fits perfectly as a cosmic ability.

Or is this not really too hard: how many divine abilities would a (typical?) lesser deity have, and how many does a cosmic ability cost?

8 and 4.

I don't have any stats, if that's what you mean; I've been waiting on this little book called the Immortals Hanbdbook for that.

I have a fair bit of mythology worked out about the creator, though. It's one of my 9 original deities.

Sweet.

There's no human pantheon at all -- humans are latecomers in my world, created in historic times. (There are dwarven cities older than all humanity.) The creator of humans (a weak lesser deity) is now dead.

Are you considering 'any' intermediate or greater deities?

As far as grouping, this creator made and taught 3 gods their 'craft': the god of the elves, the god of the dwarves, and the god of the halflings. After elves and dwarves were made, the god of the orcs made a race of his own -- usurping the halflings' place. Instead of being angry, the creator shunned the god of the halflings and adopted, in some sense, the god of the orcs.

As a result there is a grouping, but it's weak becasue the god of the elves and the god of the dwarves resent the god of the orcs.

It seems you are creating a closed cosmology, as such they won't need any such grouping for protection.

I was considering ramifications for an open cosmology where there would be dozens of Pantheons.

Also -- how easy is it for a god to create another (weaker, obviously) god?

Its the same as creating any outsider. There are some stipulations but I don't want to expound upon them now.

 

[Iceflame55]

Hiya mate!



Yes, things are almost back to normal, although I will be busy all of Monday.

Aside from being busy, my internet connection has been on and off over the past few days.

I appreciate the interest. I'd like to get the website up sometime this weekend and then I can concentrate on the IH from then on in.

Cool
. I've been trying to pass the time as well as possible without bugging the hell out of you *Ask my mom how much of a pest I can make of myself without really trying, and you'd have an Idea the uphill battle I'm fighting! *

I'm tweaking the Variant Paladins from UA from WoTC at the moment. I liked the concept, but I felt the need to change some things. I'm avoiding trying to even THINK about cosmology at this point, as I'd be bugging you unmercifully for updates, and I'm sure that would not be appreciatied. Though in concession to that side of my nature, I'll ask in a percentage how much you have finalized, as hopefully that shouldn't compromise any secrets you want to STAY secret

 

[CRGreathouse]

Are you considering 'any' intermediate or greater deities?

Yes, quite a few. There will probably be ~15 intermediate deities and ~7 greater deities, if I were to guess off the top of my head.

Actually I have an unusual power structure, but that's it's own issue. (There are some gods potentially more powerful than others ranked higher.)

It seems you are creating a closed cosmology, as such they won't need any such grouping for protection.

I was considering ramifications for an open cosmology where there would be dozens of Pantheons.

I don't really know what makes a cosmology open or closed, so I won't comment there. The primary form of organization for my gods is the Pantheon (which isn't a pantheon, by your standards, but a council), which is a grouping of 27 deities, inlcuding many (but not all) of the most powerful deities. Beyond that, there are a series of shifting alliances, plus familial ties.

Its the same as creating any outsider. There are some stipulations but I don't want to expound upon them now.

I guess what I meant was "Is it reasonable for a (weak?) sidereal to create 3 lesser deities, regardless of how the IH implements it?". I assume the answer is yes, though, or you would have said something.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hiya mate!

Cool
. I've been trying to pass the time as well as possible without bugging the hell out of you *Ask my mom how much of a pest I can make of myself without really trying, and you'd have an Idea the uphill battle I'm fighting!

*

He he!

I'm tweaking the Variant Paladins from UA from WoTC at the moment. I liked the concept, but I felt the need to change some things. I'm avoiding trying to even THINK about cosmology at this point, as I'd be bugging you unmercifully for updates, and I'm sure that would not be appreciatied. Though in concession to that side of my nature, I'll ask in a percentage how much you have finalized, as hopefully that shouldn't compromise any secrets you want to STAY secret

About 98% written, 75% typed up (of the first pdf that is).

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi CRGreathouse mate!

Yes, quite a few. There will probably be ~15 intermediate deities and ~7 greater deities, if I were to guess off the top of my head.

Okay.

Actually I have an unusual power structure, but that's it's own issue. (There are some gods potentially more powerful than others ranked higher.)

Well thats certainly possible. You could have a 70th-level Demigod and a 40th-level Lesser God for example, and the Demigod would be more powerful.

I don't really know what makes a cosmology open or closed, so I won't comment there.

A closed cosmology is where you define boundaries which could be a set number of deities - the Forgotten Realms for instance.

An open cosmology is where there are no boundaries and every deity from every source exists somewhere - so you could have the Greyhawk Gods battling with Cthulhu, encroaching upon the territory of Moorcocks Sword Gods etc.

The primary form of organization for my gods is the Pantheon (which isn't a pantheon, by your standards, but a council), which is a grouping of 27 deities, inlcuding many (but not all) of the most powerful deities. Beyond that, there are a series of shifting alliances, plus familial ties.

Okay. It'll be interesting to see when you have it all fleshed out.

I guess what I meant was "Is it reasonable for a (weak?) sidereal to create 3 lesser deities, regardless of how the IH implements it?". I assume the answer is yes, though, or you would have said something.

Yes, thats feasible.

 

[historian]

Howdy Krust!

I am quite proud of the strength chart

.

You should be, most designers don't go to the trouble of calculating galactic masses and the strength necessary to lift them.

I also thought your criticism of DC's MEG system was right on.

I'll add some of the MSH conversion stuff to the website eventually but the opening conversion tables on the website are for Divine Ranks between the IH, D&D Immortals and the Primal Order as well as how to convert 1st Ed. AD&D Immortals and (Intelligent) Unique Monsters to 3rd Ed.

That makes perfect sense (I have all of that stuff too, and would love to see the conversion tables).

I was wondering if you could comment on any of the following (only if you have time):

1. I believe that a Hiroshima level atomic bomb would equate to approximately SH-Y (207 to be exact) under the Marvel rules. In d20 Modern, I think it converts to around 128d6. Would converting damage from Marvel to d20 follow a linear progression (ex., SH-Z damage would approx. 310d6 damage)?

2. In estimating hit dice ("HD"), I decided on simply dividing the high stat by 2, i.e. a SH-Y or Skyfather level being would have 100 HD. This seems reasonable at this point, however, it would ascribe between 500-1500 HD to Galactus (whos CR is only 357 I believe).

Thanks

 

[Upper_Krust]

Howdy Krust!

Hi historian matey!

You should be, most designers don't go to the trouble of calculating galactic masses and the strength necessary to lift them.

It was fairly easy to be fair.

I also thought your criticism of DC's MEG system was right on.

I can't remember just what that criticism was but I am happy to concede that I was probably right.

That makes perfect sense (I have all of that stuff too, and would love to see the conversion tables).

Fairly simple stuff, but useful nonetheless. Obviously for copyright reasons it can't go in the book.

I was wondering if you could comment on any of the following (only if you have time):

1. I believe that a Hiroshima level atomic bomb would equate to approximately SH-Y (207 to be exact) under the Marvel rules.

For the blast damage alone thats probably correct. Of course there could also be fire/heat and radiation damage. Not to mention asphyxiation from the blast vacuum.

In d20 Modern, I think it converts to around 128d6.

Yes, d20 Modern is totally comic book rather than realistic.

Would converting damage from Marvel to d20 follow a linear progression (ex., SH-Z damage would approx. 310d6 damage)?

Nope.

2. In estimating hit dice ("HD"), I decided on simply dividing the high stat by 2, i.e. a SH-Y or Skyfather level being would have 100 HD. This seems reasonable at this point, however, it would ascribe between 500-1500 HD to Galactus (whos CR is only 357 I believe).

Thanks

Generally I total the FASERIP stats and divide by 20 to get the CR.